Petimitimion for REROLL Button

[Kargon]

Kargon see this idea brought up long time ago, but Kargon cant find thread, so Kargon want throw out there again.

Kargon want a REROLL button on charactermermer login/delete screen. When use button you select charactermermer, have to type in name again to confirm, and charactermermer are brought to charactermermer creation screen. Can choose whatevamer class and stats and skills, not have to be same class charactermermer used to be, but charactermermer end up with same name, money, items in inventamory, tomes used (maybe), and items in bank, including raid loot. Charactermermer not keep any favor (although Kargon can see this cause problems if somemabody earn 1750 tome, reroll, and go to earn anothamer one, but realamally, if they want to get to 1750 6 times and reroll 6 times for 6 +2 tomes, let them! That mean are playing the game a WHOLE LOT. if are some way to keep track of alreadamy get first +2 tome with that name, that would work too and only let first 1750 give tome).

First off, Kargon think this are very handy feature. Instead of having to mail evermary item (and 2 million plat 10k at a time) have to three alts because is so much stuff and mail it all back, this much easimier on player. This also help with peopamul paranoid about get their old name taken while on charactermermer creatimion screen, since name stay reserved for player.

Also, from RP perspectamive, this make sense as far as charactermermer abandon all old ways and skills and try to re-train as somemathing else and change their life (cleric lose faith in their god, fighter gets fed up with get hold person all time and goes to magic school, etc). Instead of having to make charactermeremr commit suicide (delete) and somemabody with same name show up on docks of stormmareach same day.

Now to controversimial part: Keeping old raid loot and tomes. Since the name are forced to stay the same, to Kargon the charactermermer are the same person. And just because they earn raid loot as differement class, are no reason to force them to abandon all their bound loot when change class. peopamul not going to reroll over and over at drop of a hat just because fighter have easier time get group for dragon loot and bard have easier time on reaver loot and ranger have easier time on queen loot. If somemabody want play a charactermemrer up to those levamels that many times, LET THEM build up whatevamer raid loot they can and keep it. Especiamally now with slightamally more pug friendly raid drop system it probamally not going matter what class they are to get into certain raids, so Kargon not see this as rampant problamem. Remembamer that all raid loot have min levamel too, so not like Kargon sorcermermer who get a SoS and reroll as barbarian going kill waterworks with it! Hopefumully would be some way to keep tomes read too, but if kargon had to give those up for technicamal reasamons or for abuse reasamons (int tomes for more skillmapoints at levamel 1 etc) kargon could live with that.

So, since this developmament discussimion, any feedback/suggestions/tasty ham apprecimated.


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SAME EXACT POST... TRANSLATED FOR THOSE WHO HAVE NOT YET LEARNED TO READ IN KARGON (dont expect this service very often ), courtesy of Trank, Drow Sorceress Extraordinaire:

Kargon wants a REROLL button on character login/delete screen. When you use the button you select your character, have to type in name again to confirm, and are brought to the char creation screen. You can choose whatever class and stats and skills, you dont have to be same class you used to be, but you end up with the same name, money, items in inventory, tomes used (maybe), and items in bank, including raid loot. You dont keep any favor (although Kargon can see this cause problems if somemabody earn 1750 tome, reroll, and go to earn another one, but really, if they want to get to 1750 6 times and reroll 6 times for 6 +2 tomes, let them! That mean they're playing the game a WHOLE LOT. if there's some way to keep track of whether that name has already earned their favor tome, that would work too and only let them have the first 1750 tome).

First off, Kargon thinks this is a very handy feature. Instead of having to mail every item (and 2 million plat 10k at a time) you have to three alts because there's so much stuff and mail it all back, this much easier on the player. This will also help with people paranoid about getting their old name taken while on the char creation screen, since the name stays reserved for player.

Also, from RP perspective, this makes sense as far as the character abandoning their old ways and skills and trying to re-train as something else and change their life (cleric loses faith in their god, fighter gets fed up with getting held all the time and goes to magic school, etc). Instead of having to make the char commit suicide (delete) and someone else with same name showing up on docks of stormreach the same day.

Now to controversial part: Keeping old raid loot and tomes. Since the name is forced to stay the same, to Kargon the rerolled char is the same person. And just because they earned raid loot as different class, there's no reason to force them to abandon all their bound loot when they change class. People arent going to reroll over and over at the drop of a hat just because a fighter has an easier time getting a group for dragon loot and a bard has an easier time on reaver loot and a ranger has an easier time on queen loot. If someone wants to play a char up to those levels that many times, LET THEM build up whatever raid loot they can and keep it. Especially now with the slightly more pug friendly raid drop system it probably isnt going matter what class they are to get into certain raids, so Kargon does not see this as rampant problem. Remember that all raid loot has a min lev too, so its not like Kargon's Sorc who gets a SoS and rerolls as barbarian is going kill waterworks with it! Hopefully theres some way to keep the tomes that have been read too, but if kargon had to give those up for technical or abuse reasons (int tomes for more skillpoints at lev 1 etc) kargon could live with that.

[Cowdenicus]

Well since tomes are an inherent bonus I see no issue....

I agree Kargon, no matter how convoluted it is to try and decipher one of your many posts....

Are you getting upset yet?

/distraction "Oh Kargon look over there, a crate of tasty ham."

/sneaks away

[Pellegro]

I couldn't agree more.

I would even like an option to take the re-rolled character up to level 8 or 10 or such. But its no deal breaker - I'd take the reroll to zero over nothing.

And I think the idea of allowing repeat 1750 tomes is fantastic, for the reason stated (i.e. if people want to grind to 1750 six times ... let em!).

I just wish you had an alt forum accnt so you could post out of character to make reading this very wise and insightful post a little easier for those of us not fluent in 'kargonanamon'.

[Gadget2775]

Personally I like the idea. Since the new character would start at level 1 I don't see there being any built in abuseability (think I'm making up words now..) with the Raid loot transferring to the re-roll slot.

Point One...
I don't think tomes should transfer. Way to much potential to unbalance beginning characters.

Point Two...
1750 Tome should be re-earnable. Well, as long as tomes don't transfer . Wouldn't be fair to deprive them of the ability to earn a tome when all previous tomes had been stripped away.

[jjflanigan]

Originally Posted by Gadget2775

Personally I like the idea. Since the new character would start at level 1 I don't see there being any built in abuseability (think I'm making up words now..) with the Raid loot transferring to the re-roll slot.

Point One...
I don't think tomes should transfer. Way to much potential to unbalance beginning characters.

Point Two...
1750 Tome should be re-earnable. Well, as long as tomes don't transfer . Wouldn't be fair to deprive them of the ability to earn a tome when all previous tomes had been stripped away.

How is the potential that much greater than it currently is? Long time players already shuffle off tomes for every stat to their new characters anyway.

[darkrhavyn]

Actually I agree with Kargon that tomes should transfer ---there are tons of people with baby characters now who have eaten tomes in 4-6 stats at creation ---I doubt letting those people reroll those characters would unbalance things anymore than they already have.

And if someone really wants to get 1750, take a tome, reroll and repeat 6 times -- then I think Kargon summed it up- let them-- it just means they'll be playing ALOT - which ultimately should be a good thing.

And I agree that raid loot has minimum levels so its not like the SoS is mowing through Waterworks with a level appropriate group.

For an admitted re-roll-aholic - I really like this idea -- what else do I really have to do- I have done all the quests (excluding the Abbott which I have no interest in ever trying again) most of them on elite--I have loot and raid items I want -- the only real fun I have is new characters and new builds-- being able to adjust some of them without having to transfer everything would make my life alot easier and give me something to do except whine when I am bored.

[Lithic]

Originally Posted by jjflanigan

How is the potential that much greater than it currently is? Long time players already shuffle off tomes for every stat to their new characters anyway.

QFT

And anyway +2 to every stat is hardly game breaking in our min/max monty-haul DDO world. I already transfer 6 +1 tomes to some of my rerolls, and it only helps to make the +1 items usefull.

[Darth_Sizzle]

/signed

But how about this for an idea:

Keep your favor/tomes/raid items/name/race (character appearance) and your XP - just reset to lvl 1 and talk to the lvl appropriate trainers to lvl all the way back up to where you were (capped in most cases I'm guessing).

I would even be ok with this being a paid option ($25 or so?)

[Tin_Dragon]

My God Kargon, my poor sinewy and stone logic center almost melted behind my site orbs reading this, then I realized, this flesh bag is a Prophet, and must use lesser forms of communication so that we who can not truly understand such monumentous wisdom in its raw form can have a chance to glimpse the knowledge and foresight of one so gifted.

in other words

/signed.

[Fallout]

For the original 28pt, has almost max favor, let them re-roll to 32 pt build. I always wondered why they decide to penalize original characters. Fix the skills and attributes. If the game world suddenly change rules, then its only fair to let our chars to change.

It always amazes me that other MMO's allow changes, but a game that allows complex character building doesn't allow skill and attribute change. Since they allow feats and enhacement change, just allow skill and attribute change.

[Lorien_the_First_One]

Originally Posted by Darth Sizzle

/signed

But how about this for an idea:

Keep your favor/tomes/raid items/name/race (character appearance) and your XP - just reset to lvl 1 and talk to the lvl appropriate trainers to lvl all the way back up to where you were (capped in most cases I'm guessing).

I would even be ok with this being a paid option ($25 or so?)

Don't like this at all... No magic transformations of a cappped char to a capped char.

[Lorien_the_First_One]

Originally Posted by Kargon

Kargon want a REROLL button on charactermermer login/delete screen.

I think this makes some sense. Six months ago I would have disagreed with the tomes when they were fairly rare but at this point they are dropping everywhere. Some of the raid loot will no longer be of value, but some could be. And yes it might expose someone to multiple +2 tomes, but then +2 tomes do fall now and if instead of relevelling for 2 weeks they spend the same time raiding they might well pull another +2 tome anyway. If that one small issue was a problem then remove the inherent bonuses but let them keep the gear.

At this point in the game, I can see how this would keep players interested and I can't see much in the way of game breaking issues.

- Terry

[Ringlord]

Basically he is talking about a total respec of the character and this is actually the best presented idea on the whole thing I have seen. I think they should only add a block or limit to how high a stat can be so it limits any incentive to try and continually gain +2 Tomes at the 1750 favor mark by re-rolling because we all know there would be people who could do it . Set a timer on it of at least a week so people can't just custom re-roll to give their party the best classes for each quest. Also make it cost an increasing amount of plat to do each time.

[Darth_Sizzle]

Originally Posted by Lorien the First One

Don't like this at all... No magic transformations of a cappped char to a capped char.

Do you not like it because it means you can't get multiple +2 tomes by attaining 1750 over and over again?

IMHO it's better to keep everything you have as the same (favor, tomes, etc). To me this is a way to fix a charcater that you like, but want to make some minor tweaks to (such as, I wish I had started with a slightly higher con instead of dumping dex into my sorc).

Edit: and wouldn't it seem more of a "magic transformation" for you to somehow have all your raid Item's (even if you can't use them yet) at level one? From an RP standpoint how would justify this? You just spent however long questing and leveling up, but somehow forgot all of your training and are now starting from scratch?

My idea, in terms of what are currently in place (Fred the Mindflayer) makes much more sense, you are re-training. The reason for it is even similar: they allow us to change out feats because they made changes to the way some feats worked. They have also (in higher end content) made HP much more valuable than AC. We even have new feats coming out now, so how about the Wiz/Rog who took only 1 lvl of Rog because with no dex evasion is useless, well now a 2nd lvl of Rog w the feat that applies your Int bonus to your reflex saving throws makes evasion very useful.

[Vorn]

/signed.

I like the idea of a re-roll of my favorite 28 point characters as 32's as well. Whether the tomes I've used transfer or not...meh...as long as they could re-earn the 1750 favor one. They have been around since a few moments after the game went live. Only one of my characters has any raid loot and he's my original guy. If someone wants to grind six times through 1750 favor for six +2 tomes...more power to them. Another tricky part might be inventory and bank slots. Would have to be careful not to delete those if re-doing favor.

[bandyman1]

/signed

Awesome idea Kargon.

[GHOSTRYDER]

Originally Posted by Darth Sizzle

Do you not like it because it means you can't get multiple +2 tomes by attaining 1750 over and over again?

IMHO it's better to keep everything you have as the same (favor, tomes, etc). To me this is a way to fix a charcater that you like, but want to make some minor tweaks to (such as, I wish I had started with a slightly higher con instead of dumping dex into my sorc).

your idea would NEVER fly, there has to be some kind of penalty for being able to reroll your character, in this case it would be having to level up all over again, which isnt THAT much of a penalty, but keeps people from doing it every other day perhaps...also the ability to re-level your character and keep those items would give many people a reason to spend more and more time playing, and something to do between major modules which are few and far between, this SHOULD be appealing to turbine

collecting raid loot now is SO difficult, that very few people who have several raid items they've worked months and months to obtain, and were perhaps fortunate to ever get at all, would never even consider re-rolling a character, instead they just get bored running the same high level content, and eventually move on

[Gadget2775]

Originally Posted by jjflanigan

How is the potential that much greater than it currently is? Long time players already shuffle off tomes for every stat to their new characters anyway.

Starting off a char with an average of +2 - +3 in multiple stats would (IMO) skew the game a bit. And yes, I do have multiple characters with +2 and +3 tomes...Of course being able to tab the extra skill points from my plus three Int bonus would definitely be nice at lvl 1...But not really appropriate. (Again, personal opinion. Not preaching it as the Gospel truth)

[Borror0]

/sign

I've been thinking the same for a while now.

Only difference I had was that you keep favor for +2 Tome and to avoid the whole "loose inventory/bank space" thingy, however, I do see the arguement of the opposite side, and to me, both are valid opinions.

[GHOSTRYDER]

Originally Posted by Gadget2775

Starting off a char with an average of +2 - +3 in multiple stats would (IMO) skew the game a bit. And yes, I do have multiple characters with +2 and +3 tomes...Of course being able to tab the extra skill points from my plus three Int bonus would definitely be nice at lvl 1...But not really appropriate. (Again, personal opinion. Not preaching it as the Gospel truth)

probably a long shot but wonder if there would be a way for them to pro-rate the tomes, so only +1's, or +1 from a +2-+3 tome applies at level one, +2 applies at somewhere in the 8-9-10 range, and +3 at 14 or so?

wouldnt be quite so game breaking then