Monks get hosed again, and what could fix it

[Pyromaniac]

Monks are currently one of the strongest classes in the game right now, and are getting stronger in mod 9. There's no need to give them any more, unless all you want to see is monks out there.

[baddax]

Monks are currently one of the weakest classes in the game right now, and are getting somewhat stronger in mod 9. They need to be given more, if you want to see more monks out there.

There fixed that for you.

[Fennario]

I think just adding silver to fists would go a long way. Hell, swap silver with the useless magic if you want.

Not the best solution. But it would be extremely easy for them to add, and it would at least be something while they come up with a real solution for their broken class.

[BlackRage]

Why would it not?

Good Burst stack with Holy if on separate weapons, then why should it stack differently if found on a ring?

I have two questions:
1. If monks are still imbalanced because of the low DPS, why should their DPS stay the same?
2. Do you think transmuting fists would be a viable long term solution?

Unlike every OTHER GS weapon, the Monk ring effects do NOT stack with their regular equivalents.

[BlackRage]

Monks are currently one of the strongest classes in the game right now, and are getting stronger in mod 9. There's no need to give them any more, unless all you want to see is monks out there.

Monks are the WEAKEST class period. Monk splash one of the strongest. It is that dichotomy that is at the heart of the problem. Currently the best role a Monk can fulfill is of a craptacular ‘Bard’.

Many characters in the GIMP project are stronger than Monks – and that is with characters DELIBERATELY DESIGNED to be gimped!

[Borror0]

Yes good burst should stack with holy... but i think the ring effect is holy burst?

I vaguely remember reading that now. That's weird...

Monks are not imbalaced becuase of their low dps...

The point I was trying to make is that adding Transmuting on handwraps would be easier to balance and, if their DPS their DPS is so low that it imbalances them, then Turbine can increase their DPS to bring them back into balance by either implementing good named transmuting handwraps or simply improving their DPS depending on what the source of the imbalance is.

Thus, the argument that "they need inherent transmuting on their fist because their DPs is too low/just fine now" is invalid.

2. Yes. Handwrap dps is already lower then any other melee... but is balanced given the defensive capability of monks.

This offers no justification as to why they should be able to transmute with their fist, over other possible suggestions though.

Unlike every OTHER GS weapon, the ‘special’ (in an Olympic way) Monk ring effects do NOT stack with their regular equivalents.

I never claimed they did.

By the way, while it is true that Green Steel weapons do not stack the same way, it's misleading to describe it like you do because, unlike other green Steel weapons, the effect affect both hands and not only one. Therefore, the effect is doubly powerful in that "crafting" one is the equivalent of two Green Steel weapons for someone who uses TWF.

[Gum]

By the way, while it is true that Green Steel weapons do not stack the same way, it's misleading to describe it like you do because, unlike other green Steel weapons, the effect affect both hands and not only one. Therefore, the effect is doubly powerful in that "crafting" one is the equivalent of two Green Steel weapons for someone who uses TWF.

Dang...Does this mean if you craft two of the new rings you will get the 4 effects? Like, if you made Holy Burst and Shocking Burst, would they count once for each each hand? I'm probably wrong, but that would be cool. lol, saves a lot of shards I guess.

[Aerendil]

Seems like I might be able to pull off +1 Anarchic Burst Holy Burst Shocking Burst Handwraps of Greater Lawful Outsider Bane (with base 3d6 damage, no dual wielding penalty, and full Strength damage to off-hand).

Am I the only the only one that's slightly saddened that such weapons exist (or will exist)?

Fear my +3 holy, shocking, acid, flaming burst transmuting khopesh of greater everything bane!

/sigh

Whatever happened to the days of normal weapons?


But I digress.

[Borror0]

Dang...Does this mean if you craft two of the new rings you will get the 4 effects? Like, if you made Holy Burst and Shocking Burst, would they count once for each each hand? I'm probably wrong, but that would be cool. lol, saves a lot of shards I guess.

Since they affects both hands, you'll get Holy Burst and Shocking Burst on each hand.

I'm not totally sure if that's you meant by "you will get the 4 effects".

[Gum]

Since they affects both hands, you'll get Holy Burst and Shocking Burst on each hand.

I'm not totally sure if that's you meant by "you will get the 4 effects".

Yappers, that's what I meant, thx. That is pretty dang spiffy right there. I know it's not THE answer were all looking for, but it ain't bad. With wind stance the burst should go off a lot having a chance to proc on both hands with two different effects.

[Eladrin]

Monks are the WEAKEST class period.

A well built, well equipped, and well played level 20 pure-class monk is an exceptionally powerful character. Weakness at any of the three seriously cripples them however, which is why they're considered (at least by us) an advanced class.

Dang...Does this mean if you craft two of the new rings you will get the 4 effects? Like, if you made Holy Burst and Shocking Burst, would they count once for each each hand?

That is correct. The first ring will add "Holy Burst" to all of your unarmed attacks, and the other ring would add "Shocking Burst". The rings do not stack with exactly identical effects. (No Holy Burst Ring + Holy Burst Handwraps, but Holy Burst Ring + Holy or Pure Good Handwraps will work.)

Unlike every OTHER GS weapon, the Monk ring effects do NOT stack with their regular equivalents.

The rings are not greensteel weapons. They're different. In some ways better, in other ways worse. (Note: There are also a couple of incorrect assumptions that have been made regarding some of the available enchantments on them, but those will clear as there is more experimentation with them. Their enchant list is similar to, but does not exactly match, the greensteel weapon enchantment set.)

Handwraps are the only weapon in the game that cant have transmuting on it.

I tried to be subtle about it in a different thread, but it wasn't picked up. This statement is incorrect. There's even a named set of transmuting handwraps that Tharagrim made (that I was really waiting to show up in the Static Rewards / Unique Loot list, but wasn't found).

In an update following the EU launch, there are some revisions planned to monk special attacks and finishing moves. I'll give more information on that as I can.

[Aerendil]

I tried to be subtle about it in a different thread, but it wasn't picked up. This statement is incorrect. There's even a named set of transmuting handwraps that Tharagrim made (that I was really waiting to show up in the Static Rewards / Unique Loot list, but wasn't found).

In an update following the EU launch, there are some revisions planned to monk special attacks and finishing moves. I'll give more information on that as I can.

I remember that quote, and I've also seen a pair of transmuting handwraps for sale on the AH on Khyber recently (although I didn't screenshot it, so I guess it didn't happen in most people's eyes). However, given the incredulity most have responded with (and the price for sale on the AH - millions of plat), I think that speaks volumes for their rarity.

Perhaps the loot tables could be looked at, Eladrin, to ensure these are dropping with a bit more regularity so as to make them more than "rumoured to exist"?
I know there have been other issues with decent handwrap rewards in the past (i.e. level 10+ quests offering +1 handwraps as static rewards).

Thanks for the response to confirm, though.

[baddax]

Thanks for the Reply Eladrin.
Maybe there is Hope for the monk class after all!
/crosses fingers

[baddax]

Any update on whirling steel strike by chance?

[binnsr]

I tried to be subtle about it in a different thread, but it wasn't picked up. This statement is incorrect. There's even a named set of transmuting handwraps that Tharagrim made (that I was really waiting to show up in the Static Rewards / Unique Loot list, but wasn't found).

Thanks for the response, Eladrin.

The problem hasn't been that they don't exist, but that they are broken .. a quick search for 'transmuting handwraps' shows several threads where people have confirmed that transmuting handwraps aren't bypassing DR -- personally, I have never seen a set of transmuting handwraps so it's hearsay at best coming from me.

Are you saying that the broken-handwraps issue has been fixed for Mod9?

[maddmatt70]

Thanks for the response, Eladrin.

The problem hasn't been that they don't exist, but that they are broken .. a quick search for 'transmuting handwraps' shows several threads where people have confirmed that transmuting handwraps aren't bypassing DR -- personally, I have never seen a set of transmuting handwraps so it's hearsay at best coming from me.

Are you saying that the broken-handwraps issue has been fixed for Mod9?

He is saying there is a unique named transmuting handwraps that can be found in a quest. My guess is perhaps in the same dungeon where the bard club was found, but that is just a guess.

[binnsr]

He is saying there is a unique named transmuting handwraps that can be found in a quest. My guess is perhaps in the same dungeon where the bard club was found, but that is just a guess.

which would imply that transmuting on handwraps is fixed, no?

[Visty]

which would imply that transmuting on handwraps is fixed, no?

no, just that it exists in them

doesnt mean it works

[Fennario]

There's even a named set of transmuting handwraps that Tharagrim made (that I was really waiting to show up in the Static Rewards / Unique Loot list, but wasn't found).

Thanks for the info. I hope that they also have holy or good on them as well, or they still won't get through the dr of the big devil bosses with the coming change to transmuting.

Will having a ring with the holy/good effect count for bypassing dr?

On a side note, I thought that the problem with handwraps and transmuting was the thing that was holding back greensteel wraps?

If you found a way to solve that problem, then why not just release greensteel wraps?

[Borror0]

no, just that it exists in them

doesnt mean it works

If I was an item designer, I would not bother making an item intended to address a current imbalance if the effect used to correct the imbalance does not work. It would end up angering the players it was supposed to help, instead, and that's not really a smart move.

Thus, it's very likely that it works.