A Potential Update

Mornyngstar

Well-known member
Nooks & Crannies
update ??

The idea behind this is the quests in the limited wilderness area of Threnal specifically The Giant Lieutenants Lv 9, The Giant's Lair Lv 9, The Threnal Arena Lv 9, The Giant's Supplies Lv 10. These quests don't give favor and since they are walk up quests they don't give end rewards either. This setup was revisited in part with the quests in The Cogs for walkups, but Favor is rewarded on completion. I liked the feel of "finding" an area and questing thru it.

Now my idea is to add a number of quests like the Threnal ones but to scatter them across multiple areas. This could include Wildernesses and Public areas across many different levels. This could revitalize Wilderness that people skip and make it feel more like D&D for "Side Quests". This could also fill in some of the lower quest numbers per level. Not all of them would have to be both Heroic and Epic since we have King's Forrest as an epic only area, the quests placed there would have to be Epic. For the Wildernesses that have both Heroic and Epic the quests there could be different for each one. If they took a page from the game Dungeon Keeper they had a feature where on a Full Moon, Hidden levels would be accessible. Not sure if this kind of feature could be implemented in the current game. As a furtherance of this idea, if they can't do a single overall update then 1 or more quests added per quarter would be nice.

Now some people would say "Why run them if there is no favor?". So, a suggestion for that would be what if they gave for Casual, Normal, Hard, Elite favor at 0(1?), 1, 2, 3. While this is low it is better than nothing. Now the Favor from this could be included into a new group called Explorers or something like that (suggestions?). Depending on how many quests were eventually added this could add up to more than The Free Agents total.

Now this is my opinion, and I welcome others.

Edit:
Refutor asked a question so to clarify my objective, imagine walking thru the Stormhorn wilderness and coming across a new cave. Upon walking up to it you get the quest "The Bear's Den" with the objective to kill the agressive bear that has been terrorizing the locale area (Lv 19 base). While inside you also encounter spiders, and other minor enemies and for the finally you find the bear and cubs also along with the many corpses of people that had been felled by the bear (Treasure & Loot). Average first time running 7-10 minutes, on replaying time should be about 5 minutes on Elite/R1 average. (Again, this is just my opinion/idea.)
The way to look at my idea is in Pen and Paper (PnP) D&D you would sometimes have minor side quests that aren't part of your main campaign (At least when I am DMing) even though it doesn't further the campaign it allows a little diversion to it.

Edit:
Purr gave an example of the Yaun Ti rare located in High Road wilderness. This is a perfect example for size, location, duration and number of enemies for what would make a Nooks & Crannies style quest.
 
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Mornyngstar

Well-known member
Thought about a great place to put at least one of the quests: Have it hidden in the Steam Tunnels in one of the dead ends or even behind a new secrete door. Of course, it would have to be something with Kobolds or maybe spiders or saving Kobolds from spiders?
 

Mornyngstar

Well-known member
As part of the update the 2 wilderness (Artificer Workshop & Research Facility) that is buried within House Cannith Manufactory can have Nooks & Crannies added to them. I would suggest that they are part of the entrance selection that normally leads to House Cannith Manufactory wilderness. These 2 wildernesses are also ripe for new quests based on House Cannith in order to more fully utilize them.
(I think I am one of the few people that have a toon (Seldissan) actively farming slayers there.)
 

Refutor

Well-known member
isn't this basically what they have in orchard explorer? a bunch of crypts that sometimes have rare monsters? except you want it more involved...
 

Mornyngstar

Well-known member
isn't this basically what they have in orchard explorer? a bunch of crypts that sometimes have rare monsters? except you want it more involved...
The crypts there are just if a rare spawns there. In Threnal the quests that I referenced are actual quests that you can run on Casual to Reaper and are at the level indicated. They are walkups that don't give favor unlike the walkups in The Cogs.
I would like your feedback after you have run one of the Threnal walkup quests. (Your experience could lead to other suggestions that I haven't thought of.)
 

Mornyngstar

Well-known member
oh you cant trick me into running Threnal again. i have 3 mantle of worldshapers and i'm never going back in there lol
The quests I am referencing are outside of Threnal chain located in the Wilderness. Threnal Map from Wiki If you look on the map with the Yellow Swirls outside the ruins those are the locations I am talking about.
 

CherryBomb

Well-known member
Many players have never bothered to turn right on the run into the Threnal morass and have missed that there are actually four quests/activities over there.

I have always wanted to get something from those besides a largely useless weapon redemption.
 

Purr

Well-known member
I think you just re-invented the yuan ti rare in high road. There are a couple rares from kings forest/wheloon Era that are essentially mini quests.

A better option would be to just give the thread quests favor and treat them like BL quests that only take a few mins to run.

I always though the thread weps would be great if there was a way to further upgrade them at ML 15, 20, etc. Would be a nice easter egg where there were items that needed upgrading from different chains.
 

Mornyngstar

Well-known member
I think you just re-invented the yuan ti rare in high road. There are a couple rares from kings forest/wheloon Era that are essentially mini quests.

A better option would be to just give the thread quests favor and treat them like BL quests that only take a few mins to run.

I always though the thread weps would be great if there was a way to further upgrade them at ML 15, 20, etc. Would be a nice easter egg where there were items that needed upgrading from different chains.
The Yuan ti rare area is a perfect size and location example for what a Nooks & Crannies quest would look like.
It took me a few minutes to realize you meant Threnal weapons for the amphitheater (encounter?) the downside is you can't choose to run it on reaper since it is open wilderness. I do agree having a way to upgrade the Threnal weapons would be nice to have and possibly changing them to Bound to Account on Equip (BtAoE). Hmmm Base item, Reforging, Honing, Purifying, Imbuing?
 

Purr

Well-known member
The Yuan ti rare area is a perfect size and location example for what a Nooks & Crannies quest would look like.
It took me a few minutes to realize you meant Threnal weapons for the amphitheater (encounter?) the downside is you can't choose to run it on reaper since it is open wilderness. I do agree having a way to upgrade the Threnal weapons would be nice to have and possibly changing them to Bound to Account on Equip (BtAoE). Hmmm Base item, Reforging, Honing, Purifying, Imbuing?
Yeah, I was thinking that you would be adding specific rituals on to it at each level (so maybe at 15 you can add vorpal and 20 you can add expanded crit multiplier or something.
 

Leesun

Well-known member
Threnal, a lot of older quests in general, needs some love. Updating gameplay mechanics, quest turn-ins for Threnal specifically, and some graphical love. Would love to see some of the weapons and armor, like my beloved Retribution, look more unique.
 

Mornyngstar

Well-known member
Threnal, a lot of older quests in general, needs some love. Updating gameplay mechanics, quest turn-ins for Threnal specifically, and some graphical love. Would love to see some of the weapons and armor, like my beloved Retribution, look more unique.
I do agree that older quests, like Threnal, do eventually need an update, however the focus of this thread is about the non-chain quests that are walkups in the wilderness and the amphitheater (encounter?).
Note: (I did another Suggestion Thread about updating Restless Isles. This is just the latest thread for sparking ideas in the Devs and getting early player feedback for expanding and novel ideas.)

Yeah, I was thinking that you would be adding specific rituals on to it at each level (so maybe at 15 you can add vorpal and 20 you can add expanded crit multiplier or something.
With "Hmmm Base item, Reforging, Honing, Purifying, Imbuing?" I was thinking each step was a choose you own attribute, after completing the necessary steps to get to that point. Example: Reforging could be adding type of material, but only after grabbing the right ingredients similar to old Cannith weapons. Example: Honing, in the specific set of quests you get 2 different types of stones, when you have 5-10 (set #) you can then have a quest like encounter (Amphitheater as a quest) to either expand crit range or crit multiplier. Example (Insert Name), you collect (??? # Insert Name) and you can change the Sword/Dagger to any weapon type, again at the "Amphitheater style quest". This would add an overarching "Theme" to the entire idea of Nooks & Crannies.
 

Mornyngstar

Well-known member
Idea: Not sure if it can be implemented with current programing: Taking a "Cave", new/old, in Stormhorns wilderness and making it into a Quest Entrance. This would be a "generic entrance" because it would be random which quest you are doing when you enter each time. This would be the same layout, but the Quest Objective and monsters would change based on the scenario at that time. Kinda like if you cleared out the goblins and a bear moves in, then clearing out the bear and a Sabretooth cat moves in, or giant bats or carrion crawler, army deserters, bandits, bug bears, earth elemental, rust monsters and the list goes on.
For some people just walking thru the wilderness on their way to the next adventure in the chain they may ask can we take 5 and see which quest is up now? Others would farm it to see all the variations (thinking of you PurpleSerpent), hmm freeing a captured Couatl?

Idea: The caves with rares potentially spawning in them in Ataraxia, if they were just a bit big would be perfect for Nooks & Crannies quests as an example.
 

Sophie The Cat Burglar

Exotic Items Recovery Specialist
A few years back, Aelonwy and some other players campaigned for more quests in old wilderness areas. As a result, The Lost Gatekeepers quest pack was added to the Cerulean Hills and The Promise of Fire was added to the Searing Heights.

Also some years ago, Aelonwy and I conducted a rather successful survey--there was a lot of participation--to determine what quest packs players wanted to see updated and made epic. If I recall correctly, Threnel won and Tangleroot Gorge was second. A common request was for Threnel side quests to become full, normal quests. (Subsequent to that survey, the quests in Lordsmarch Plaza became epic. That group of quests also did well in the survey.)

In my opinion, adding side quests to existing wilderness areas can be a very good thing. Unfortunately, quest writers do not seem to have enough spare time, after working on major releases, to build such quests on a regular basis.

Would you rather have one of those old quests updated and fleshed out, or a completely new quest? In my opinion, it does not matter. A good quest is a good quest, regardless of where the quest entrance lies.

A better approach may be to ask players, "What quests do you like most, and why", and steer the quest makers towards using past successes as templates for future successes.

We also know that at least one current quest maker really likes puzzles. Maybe player feedback can steer her to a happy medium where she can make puzzles that players will appreciate and enjoy. (Players can be very critical of puzzles.)
 

Mornyngstar

Well-known member
A few years back, Aelonwy and some other players campaigned for more quests in old wilderness areas. As a result, The Lost Gatekeepers quest pack was added to the Cerulean Hills and The Promise of Fire was added to the Searing Heights.
Thank you for the contribution of the Gatekeeper quests and Promise of Fire.

Also some years ago, Aelonwy and I conducted a rather successful survey--there was a lot of participation--to determine what quest packs players wanted to see updated and made epic. If I recall correctly, Threnel won and Tangleroot Gorge was second. A common request was for Threnel side quests to become full, normal quests. (Subsequent to that survey, the quests in Lordsmarch Plaza became epic. That group of quests also did well in the survey.)
I do agree that Threnal (most especially) and Tangleroot Gorge need at least an Epic upgrade or even for Threnal a Legendary upgrade. While certain people wanted the side Quests of the Threnal wilderness upgrade to full blown quests that would lose the appeal I have for them. They are niche quests and have a charm of their own. To help satisfy the people that wanted full blown quests I suggested the minimal 1(1/2?),1,2,3 favor rewards without making the quests bigger or more complex (i.e. if quests were meals some would be full courses while others would be like fancy take out, others would be fast food) and what I am suggesting is the equivalent of a dollar menu item.

In my opinion, adding side quests to existing wilderness areas can be a very good thing. Unfortunately, quest writers do not seem to have enough spare time, after working on major releases, to build such quests on a regular basis.
The way I was looking at it was to kick off a full update with Nooks & Crannies. After that having a grab bag of ideas on the back burner and when time permitted to grab 1 and flesh it out for an update. They would not have to rush or force themselves to complete it for a deadline but would include it in an update and to add mystery to it just state each time that a new quest has appeared (easter egg hunt).

Would you rather have one of those old quests updated and fleshed out, or a completely new quest? In my opinion, it does not matter. A good quest is a good quest, regardless of where the quest entrance lies.
While having old quests updated is nice, it is also a big deal. I am looking for dollar menu item style quests (see #2 answer).

A better approach may be to ask players, "What quests do you like most, and why", and steer the quest makers towards using past successes as templates for future successes.
I do admit that there is not a large following for the Wilderness quests in Threnal. What I don't want to happen for the game is to have all the quests end up cookie cutter style for the quests. Example: in the pit one time a couple of people that joined me suggested that levitating platforms would work best because the jumping wasn't to their liking. Another time a person wanted to eliminate the knight move puzzle in Enter the Kobold.

We also know that at least one current quest maker really likes puzzles. Maybe player feedback can steer her to a happy medium where she can make puzzles that players will appreciate and enjoy. (Players can be very critical of puzzles.)
More/different puzzles would be appreciated.

Part of this idea came from watching how they made "Cat"tastrophy quest. That one is moderate in length and semi complex. Compare it to what I am looking/hopeing for in the Nook & Crannies quests the overall size of it would accomodate 3-4 of them if it was broken up into sections. Another type of quests is explore the ruins and see what wandering monster(s) have moved in since the last time it was cleared.

I hope this clarifies what I am trying to suggest.
 
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