Archetypes, Psionics and Jedi in DDO

droid327

Hardcore casual soloist
I've always wanted a "Jedi-style" build option for DDO, as have many others: a single-weapon fighting melee hybrid that also has some AOE casting and CC potential. Psionics has also been an often-requested addition, though one of the big questions is how you implement it in DDO in a way that sets it apart from other gameplay mechanics, since Spell Points already work like Psionics did in PnP. And since Archetypes are the new thing and Monk is in need of some love, I figured there was a way to kill three birds with one stone with a Psionicist as a Monk archetype.

Overview: its an unarmored centered melee specializing in Shortswords (their only proficiency), using a unique Psi resource mechanic, with several Monk mechanics re-imagined. You can think of Psi as the Force, for all intents and purposes, and Psi-blades as lightsabers :) Keeps Evasion, loses other Monk-specific advancement feats, including Martial Arts feats and Combos/Finishers.

Psi: replaces and overrides Ki (if you have it from Sacred Fist or GMoF) when you have a Psi Stance active. Psi cannot be used to power Ki attacks. Unlike Ki (and Spell Points), Psi only regenerates steadily over time, making Psi skills about managing the rate at which you use it. You can use lots of little abilities often, or big ones less frequently. That's what will make this playstyle unique. Your max Psi is based on Concentration.

Stances:
- Duelist: Single-target DPS stance. Bonuses to Doublestrike and Attack Speed. Counts as a Fire stance for purposes like GMoF, Jidz, etc.
- Warrior: AOE DPS stance. Bonuses to Stat-to-damage and Strikethrough. Counts as an Air stance
- Defender: Defense stance. Bonuses to Max Dodge, PRR, AC. Counts as an Earth stance
- Consular: Casting stance. Bonuses to Psi regen rate and spell DC/damage. Counts as a Water stance.

Stances use the same advancement as Monk stances, including the XXX of Forms feats

Philosophies:
"Light side" will be WIS based, require Good alignment. Or maybe Lawful. Not sure if the Lawful requirement for Monk would have to carry over to the Archetype as well. Counts as Light Philosophy anywhere that checks it.
"Dark side" will be CHA based, require Not Good (or Not Lawful) alignment. Counts a Dark Philosophy.

At L6, they each get WIS or CHA-to-hit and -dmg while Centered, a la Sacred Fist.

Enhancement Trees:

Psi-Blade
Core function is a toggle that converts any wielded Shortsword into a Psi-Blade, which works like Sun Blades such as Celestia: converts damage type from Piercing to Light, and can Strikethrough. Tree provides the usual set of melee tree bonuses including Crit Range/Mult, a WIS/CHA trance depending which Side you choose, some Psi based active attacks, buffs, action boost, etc., as well as up to 80% extra Strikethrough distributed through the tree up to the capstone (ie you reach 100% total Strikethrough at L20). I do not envision them as an Imbue class, though, so no Imbue or Imbue Die anywhere.

Mindstorm
Caster tree. This is where Psionicists get all their spells, since Monk does not have an actual spellbook. Grants SLAs depending on Philosophy: Light gets a suite of Force-type damage spells with some KDs, Positive heals, self-buffs, and Confuse abilities (Jedi Mind Trick). Dark gets a suite of Lightning attacks, IKs (Force Choke), Tentacle-style root/dot CC, and Temp HP effects (maybe something like Death Eater), maybe a caster-based Rage effect. Rest of tree provides the usual caster goodies: crit %, relevant DC and Mainstat.

I'm thinking it makes more sense to have all spells scale off Melee Power 300% like Sacred Fist does, and not support metamagics, since everything is an SLA. Alternatively, scale off Concentration score at some %, though I dont know how many imbalances that might create since Conc was never intended for that. This would have to be an effect that extended to Force and Lightning spells from EDs and Epic Feats, too.

Focus
Psi support tree. This tree is unique in that it is more like Racial trees: only goes to T4, the cores dont require a certain amount of AP to unlock (just Psionic level), and the capstone is not anything special. This tree provides bonuses to Psi regeneration, general mobility bonuses like a Leap, a charge-based burst Psi recharge ability, and purely defensive Psi spenders and toggles that give defensive bonuses in exchange for reduced Psi generation.


Conclusion
I really dont think this would be grossly OP - essentially its just an upgraded Swashbuckler/Spellsinger, after all, and that's something in need of an upgrade. I also cant think of any major imbalances related to potential multiclassing, either - neither splashing Psi onto something, or splashing something onto Psi. I do think this would be a fun archetype to play, bringing together mechanics from several other classes in a way you cant effectively combine them right now.
 
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PyrotechRick

Well-known member
I do think this would be a fun archetype to play, bringing together mechanics from several other classes in a way you cant effectively combine them right now.

Interesting idea. It's got me thinking I might try to build a Sacred-Fist 6/Sorcerer 14 with the Eldritch-Knight tree to see if I cant make a Jedi right now. You could go single weapon fighting. Take Whirling Steel Strike to use Longswords. Take Follower of the Sovereign host to get Longsword as Favored weapons (I'm not sure if this is a bug but it can be done despite Sacred fist getting Follower of the path of light). They'd get Charisma to hit, with Divine Dream, a choice of two imbue toggles (a flame one that improves with 200% Melee power or a flame one that improves with Spell power) that simulate a light saber nicely. You'd need the Jump spell (obviously), Hypnosis, gust of wind, Suggestion (again, obviously), cyclonic Blast, maybe chain lightning if you're feeling evil. Could be fun.
 

Fisto Mk I

Well-known member
I really wanna Psi-warrior, Psion and Soulknife be implemented to DDO, but... If i wanna play Jedi, i go to SW:TOR. No jedi garbage in DDO, please. Please? :)
 

Svirfneblin

Well-known member
Would like to see Psionics, like to see it a LOT. We used it all the way back in AD&D.

MindFlayer Psionic player race, YO! With Brain Extractions.

Don't need Jedi really, they have games for that.
 

PyrotechRick

Well-known member
I think if they introduce a new race with psionics (if they ever introduce psionics) it will be the Kalashtar

I think psionics could be easily introduced by re-skinning some spells, and giving them Psionic bonuses rather then enhancement bonuses, and adding the three psionic classes as archetypes as people have suggested. I would imagine the Psion would be an archetype of Wizard or an Intelligence based Sorcerer (probably the latter as that is closer to the current concept in D&D 5e). The Psychic Warrior, while it really ought to be a fighter archetype, would probably be another paladin archetype as they are partial casters and so can easily be given "psionic spells" although I wonder if an Archetype of Favored Soul might not be an option too. The Soul Knife would probably be a Rouge Archetype with the fey-dark illusionists shadow blades.

While I think the OP's Jedi concept is fun, I think that is probably going to remain a "flavor" build that people make by multiclassing rather than anything official. As you say there are Star Wars games for playing real/official jedi.
 
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PaleFox

Well-known member
The thing closest to it would be an Artificer that uses a short sword from Fey or Druid pastlife flame blade.
I wanted to say Druid because Gust of wind, but Tactical detonation also knocks enemies over.
Maybe there is a rune arm that has that effect?
Shrieking bolt from a clicky item?
Oh and Arti becuase of all the cool electric spells.
 

droid327

Hardcore casual soloist
The thing closest to it would be an Artificer that uses a short sword from Fey or Druid pastlife flame blade.
I wanted to say Druid because Gust of wind, but Tactical detonation also knocks enemies over.
Maybe there is a rune arm that has that effect?
Shrieking bolt from a clicky item?
Oh and Arti becuase of all the cool electric spells.

It might be more feasible if Sun Blades were a fully fleshed out and supported weapon type...there just aren't enough to level with, no good ones, and none at all past Celestia. If they added a whole bunch more and made at least the L20+ ones do light damage, then maybe you could make it work - I think being swf with minor strike through is a major defining character in what sets the playstyle aside from other existing builds, though.

That's why I made it part of the melee tree, seems like that's more realistic than committing to a whole slew of new items that anyone can use. Plus there's not enough strike through available elsewhere that doesn't require thf feats, so thats also a limitation on trying to make one piecemeal from existing classes

Also, while you could try to multi a dark sider with arti or stormsinger, there just isn't an existing build that does a full set of force casting for light siders the way I set it up here. The existing spells are too split up among different spell books
 
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