Artificer class - bottom tier?

[Col Kurtz]

If people want to debate and discuss artificer DPS it's fine, but do it without attacking each other.

in b4 the lock!

 

[Randomdude1223]

I'm not even asking for proof! I'm just asking that you give anyone other than you some sense of what "the best ranged DPS in the game" is!

Don't bother if he had any valid numbers or proof; he would have already provided it. It's just bait to get negative reactions out of the community at this point.

 

[Xgya]

I know they're not an optimal way to play, but I absolutely LOVE caster Artis.
Tactical Detonation <3
I think the recent changes to runearms was a nerf to some of my favorite ones, but it was overall positive for arm cannon users.
I think they still need help in Epics, since they're a bit weak compared to the spells they're supposed to emulate, but the fun factor is still there, and you can absolutely still finish quests as an Arti caster.

 

[DDO Noob]

Thanks for all the feedback. I suspect the reason that why Artificer was rated at the bottom tier multiple times is because of that saying "Jack of all trades, master of none". The way the class is set up it can play multiple styles adequately, but is never at the peak of any whether it be melee, ranged, tank or spell DPS. This means it might not perform so well in mid to high reaper compared to so many other classes which are much better at specialising. This is just a theory. Please tell me if you think I'm off the mark with these thoughts.

 

[davidcysero]

runearm op

 

[I dont Like gimps]

Sure. But not higher than best repeater and throw dagger builds

The fact that u believe T dagger >Shuri is incredibly delusional
If i were to tell you my Numbers on both Builds u would prolly say that i simply cant build T dagger
While not giving any proof of it yourself (;

But for the sake of it if i run into some random r10 quest without action boost or 10k Activated
First Pre debuff shuri deals around 450-500ish? No mythic boost etc on items
T dagger is more of a 350 in that same scenario on FE target...
2. 10k is a bazillion times better than multitude cuz its 50% up Not 17.6%
3. 100% more DS also means more Sneak dmg ....

Idk if u have some weird 41VKF voodu magic thing but please C'mon share it with us fools

 

[I dont Like gimps]

Watching @Epicsoul build get review bombed. ? Rather than tear down the builds other people post, why don't you post the complete build with gear you say is amazing.

My favourite part is that Epic himself said something like "gearset not perfect for dps i wanted runearm versatility"
And they yapping anyway

 

[SgtMajorZero]

Without delving too deep into the hunt's end artificer debacle;

Take any class tier listing with a grain of salt. Every single class in DDO can perform perfectly well. Some have advantages in certain areas - like melee and ranged characters as archetypes trump caster characters in sustained damage overtime, but all classes can be made work for general gameplay.

Some classes are a bit easier to pull off than others, but everything has their moment to shine in various difficulties and for various purposes in the game.

If you need to look at a class tierlist, you don't need to worry about a class tierlist.

This plus even if the list is correct, it would be correct then. Two years in this game could mean changes to enhancement trees, EDs, feats, gear and whatnot. I don't see many WF archmages around running in Shiradi spamming magic missile and force missile, but back in day it was a serious contender for top dps and self healing.

 

[Mickeymouse]

My favourite part is that Epic himself said something like "gearset not perfect for dps i wanted runearm versatility"
And they yapping anyway

Often more interesting to see people post builds similar to your own that don´t 'resonates' with yours. Maybe they know something I don´t kinda thing, and in that case, it looked like a solid standard up-to-date arti with SP/runearm focus, wasn´t aware of it being bombed tho.

 

[FaceDancer]

Thanks for all the feedback. I suspect the reason that why Artificer was rated at the bottom tier multiple times is because of that saying "Jack of all trades, master of none". The way the class is set up it can play multiple styles adequately, but is never at the peak of any whether it be melee, ranged, tank or spell DPS. This means it might not perform so well in mid to high reaper compared to so many other classes which are much better at specialising. This is just a theory. Please tell me if you think I'm off the mark with these thoughts.

Overall I would say it is a fair assessment. They are very flexible, but I'd say that if you focus your efforts in certain areas & trees, they can become more potent (specialized).

 

[Zvdegor]

I think everyone is missing the point. There is no "best" class just like in a team there is no best player. There is only best team. DDO is about building an effective adventurer team to complete quests.
You can play DDO solo and it can be discussed which class is the most efficient but DDO's spirit is teamwork.

 

[MysticRhythms]

The ohrase "bottom tier" is poorly defined in this thread. The implication is "bottom tier DPS" which still needs further clarification because of what it is being compared to. A paladin tank or CC wizard are significantly worse at DPS than an Artificer.

If it's a general tiering, then why is Artificer the most popular class in hardcore? Obviously because it has strong marks in self-healing and trapping skills with a lot of versatility.

Anyone making any kind of a tier list needs to be dutiful in exolaining what the criteria for comparisons are.

 

[DDO Noob]

runearm op

I thought many of the rune arms didn't work properly. And I thought that they were only a minor improvement to the class overall with their damage. Can you please explain why you think they are OP? Are there specific rune arms that you think are OP?

 

[AbyssalMage]

I decided to do a google and youtube search on DDO class tier lists. I found a few that are all a year or 2 old and they all rated Artificer as bottom or second bottom out of all classes. I'm currently playing an artificer and enjoying it and it doesn't seem too weak to me. Are these tier class lists still accurate with regards to Artificer as of the last few updates?

Yes it's near the bottom.
Is it unplayable? Heck no.
Is it fun as heck? Read this thread. It is seriously fun. To the point people over hype it.
Should you play it? IMO you should. I enjoyed it immensely.

 

[Archaic]

I wil post nothing, because I care nothing about you. Feel free to play your great xbow builds and do half the dps of any decent repeater build, to each their own ?

Great Crossbow with full SA damage even after IPS was weakened if I stealth and line up mobs right it tends to instakill everything it hit.
But as a side note you need to chill dude. This is a discussion forum not a meta social network made to release teen angst people been Squirting out since puberty.

 

[PrinceOfAsphodel]

Furthermore, it’s worth noting that great crossbows and Inquisitors sync better with Endless Fusillade than a repeater. With the correct build, they can have at least 15 charges. Your argument is baseless and contains numerous flaws.

Can I ask what you mean by "sync better"? Do you just mean those types of builds can get more action boost charges or is there also something that makes them stronger than repeaters under Fusilade/NHB?

 

[AbyssalMage]

I thought many of the rune arms didn't work properly. And I thought that they were only a minor improvement to the class overall with their damage. Can you please explain why you think they are OP? Are there specific rune arms that you think are OP?

The recent revamp/update to Rune Arms made them decent.

 

[Randomdude1223]

Can I ask what you mean by "sync better"? Do you just mean those types of builds can get more action boost charges or is there also something that makes them stronger than repeaters under Fusilade/NHB?

I may be mistaken, but my experience with using repeaters alongside fusilade led me to believe that the dps output wasn’t as high compared to dual shooting or using a great crossbow. This is likely because repeaters inherently fire quickly, but when fusilade is applied to great crossbows, the benefit is substantial. Each bolt fired from a great crossbow is significantly stronger than those from a repeater. Additionally, I think repeaters can only achieve a maximum of 20% ranged alacrity , whereas dual shooting and great crossbows can reach up to 30%. I’m not entirely sure about this information, so I apologize if it’s wrong. Hopefully, someone more knowledgeable can confirm or correct this.

 

[Randomdude1223]

Can I ask what you mean by "sync better"? Do you just mean those types of builds can get more action boost charges or is there also something that makes them stronger than repeaters under Fusilade/NHB?

I’ll need to conduct a test to determine the number of bolts fired when using fusilade with repeaters, as opposed to dual shooting and great crossbows and do proper calculations to compare them effectively. However, my current observation is currently based solely on personal experience.

 

[FaceDancer]

Can I ask what you mean by "sync better"? Do you just mean those types of builds can get more action boost charges or is there also something that makes them stronger than repeaters under Fusilade/NHB?

I did a quickie build on Lamannia, and did some kobold punching bag tests and the great crossbow was rather awesome with Endless Fusilade. This was a casual/curious test, but to me there was a more fluid rate of fire of with the great crossbow. I would suggest doing a Lamannia trip if you can to confirm this for yourself though. I am in the process of building up a great crossbow for low epics becuase of this (it's a start).