Bug Fix: Summon Golem

[Jontheknight]

I have been loving summon golem lately, been soloing Reaver's Fate by Diplomacy so that my Iron Golem tanks but there's a huge problem with this spell, that even cost me a run randomly, which is funny but maybe this needs to be changed.

For some reason, and I have no idea if this is intended. Golems can just randomly turn on you (seemingly) I particularly notice they turn hostile when you use the social skills, or if you get too far and force them to teleport to you. I happened to summon a clay golem and of course, while I was doing Reaver's Fate, He got angry, smacked me with a Cursed Wound, and with no remove curse was forced to make a decision. Die or try to continue the raid without taking any damage. This could also be used to accidentally grief other players. Although I am sure people carry remove curse potions/scrolls, etc; I still think removing them becoming randomly hostile is just something that should be done.

Sometimes when I group with people I have to pray NOT getting a clay golem and accidentally grieving someone. If the golem summon was not a random selection of the 4 maybe this silly gimick will be tolerable.

 

[Terpilar]

Well that's part of their nature since the early days of DnD, no doubt here Gygax was inspired by the Golem novel of G. Meyrink, itself calling upon very old hebrew myths. The thing just likes to go rampant, supposedly there's a lesson there.

Also, always carry Remove Curse potions.

 

[RobShow]

I have been loving summon golem lately, been soloing Reaver's Fate by Diplomacy so that my Iron Golem tanks but there's a huge problem with this spell, that even cost me a run randomly, which is funny but maybe this needs to be changed.

For some reason, and I have no idea if this is intended. Golems can just randomly turn on you (seemingly) I particularly notice they turn hostile when you use the social skills, or if you get too far and force them to teleport to you. I happened to summon a clay golem and of course, while I was doing Reaver's Fate, He got angry, smacked me with a Cursed Wound, and with no remove curse was forced to make a decision. Die or try to continue the raid without taking any damage. This could also be used to accidentally grief other players. Although I am sure people carry remove curse potions/scrolls, etc; I still think removing them becoming randomly hostile is just something that should be done.

Sometimes when I group with people I have to pray NOT getting a clay golem and accidentally grieving someone. If the golem summon was not a random selection of the 4 maybe this silly gimick will be tolerable.

Its not a bug bro. Sometimes they can turn hostile. RNG

 

[Jontheknight]

Its not a bug bro. Sometimes they can turn hostile. RNG

Bug or whatever you want to call it, a mechanic that can potentially grief players should be changed. Why did you think undead forms were changed to not be damaged by heal spells?

 

[RobShow]

Are you new to the game?
I will give you one more example of a bug that is not a bug, it is intentional on the part of the developers.

Inspiring Bond: When your Hirelings or Pets die, after 2.5 seconds they are automatically resurrected and heal to full health. This can occur only once for each creature every 3 minutes. In addition, your Hirelings, Pets, and Summons gain +25 Physical Resistance Rating and Magical Resistance Rating.

It never worked with the Pale Master's PET. It's not a bug! I and others reported the ''bug'' at the release of the FEAT, and they later made a patch saying they fixed it.

Wizard is a free class; they don't make and will not make anything really good for Wizard. Can you understand? Wizards are treated as trash by the Devs so they can sell the other magic classes.

 

[Jontheknight]

Are you new to the game?
I will give you one more example of a bug that is not a bug, it is intentional on the part of the developers.

Inspiring Bond: When your Hirelings or Pets die, after 2.5 seconds they are automatically resurrected and heal to full health. This can occur only once for each creature every 3 minutes. In addition, your Hirelings, Pets, and Summons gain +25 Physical Resistance Rating and Magical Resistance Rating.

It never worked with the Pale Master's PET. It's not a bug! I and others reported the ''bug'' at the release of the FEAT, and they later made a patch saying they fixed it.

Wizard is a free class; they don't make and will not make anything really good for Wizard. Can you understand? Wizards are treated as trash by the Devs so they can sell the other magic classes.

So you address my argument of "Why undead form was changed from not being damaged by spells" with "Are you new to the game?" You didn't address grieving potential of this summon, It has nothing to do with Wizards. Your wording saying that the devs intentionally did not make it work with the Skeleton Knight, then saying after everyone reported it they finally fix it to work with Skeleton Knight, doesn't have that "Gotchu" feel. I am advocating for changing Golems to ethier 1: Stop it for being Random, 2: Remove the Hostile ability of the Golem. I referenced Undead Forms because you can unintentionally harm other player via a spell, the heal spell. I am saying I can unintentionally harm other players by summoning a golem, a golem that I don't even want to summon, but am forced to by random chance. I understand that I can simply just NOT summon. Just like people would argue just DONT heal undead form and let them be damaged by them. It's a change to prevent grieving, that's all. Otherwise I still love the summon, as I love all summons; but you made a poor point, if you even had one.

 

[RobShow]

So you address my argument of "Why undead form was changed from not being damaged by spells" with "Are you new to the game?" You didn't address grieving potential of this summon, It has nothing to do with Wizards. Your wording saying that the devs intentionally did not make it work with the Skeleton Knight, then saying after everyone reported it they finally fix it to work with Skeleton Knight, doesn't have that "Gotchu" feel. I am advocating for changing Golems to ethier 1: Stop it for being Random, 2: Remove the Hostile ability of the Golem. I referenced Undead Forms because you can unintentionally harm other player via a spell, the heal spell. I am saying I can unintentionally harm other players by summoning a golem, a golem that I don't even want to summon, but am forced to by random chance. I understand that I can simply just NOT summon. Just like people would argue just DONT heal undead form and let them be damaged by them. It's a change to prevent grieving, that's all. Otherwise I still love the summon, as I love all summons; but you made a poor point, if you even had one.

Okay kid, you are right!

 

[PersonMan]

Why did you think undead forms were changed to not be damaged by heal spells?

When was this? The only time I remember undead players really being griefed was due to an unintended interaction with the original epic destinies.

Judgment: Active Ability: (Cooldown 15 seconds, 10sp) Target undead or evil outsider will explode when killed, dealing 10d100 light damage to other undead or evil outsiders near them. WARNING Judgment can kill Palemasters in your party.

As far as I am aware Palemasters have never been harmed by positive, at least not by design. They were originally immune to both positive and repair.

 

[Jontheknight]

When was this? The only time I remember undead players really being griefed was due to an unintended interaction with the original epic destinies.

As far as I am aware Palemasters have never been harmed by positive, at least not by design. They were originally immune to both positive and repair.

Honestly I could be misremembering the damage part, I think I was reading people advocating FOR being damaged at the time so that can be totally my bad.

 

[PersonMan]

Honestly I could be misremembering the damage part, I think I was reading people advocating FOR being damaged at the time so that can be totally my bad.

No worries, was quite a while ago

I'm trying to remember if/when they got rid of summons becoming aggressive through dispel magic. I seem to recall that used to just be a thing.

 

[Jontheknight]

No worries, was quite a while ago

I'm trying to remember if/when they got rid of summons becoming aggressive through dispel magic. I seem to recall that used to just be a thing.

The Golems do not have this effect, However, this old mechanic still exists on Epic Wolf Whistle: Thraak Hound, and I believe the Werewolf summon and Dinosaur Summon (have not yet obtained these items); You can tell because they have a buff/debuff "Summon monster Control" Which used to be on regular summons, that can be dispelled.

 

[droid327]

Honestly if you're using summons in group play you're already griefing

 

[Jhml]

No summon should be turning hostile, it's not like they're worldbeaters even at the best of times. Sounds like a bug or something lag related - which this game has no shortage of!

 

[PurpleSerpent]

I have been loving summon golem lately, been soloing Reaver's Fate by Diplomacy so that my Iron Golem tanks but there's a huge problem with this spell, that even cost me a run randomly, which is funny but maybe this needs to be changed.

For some reason, and I have no idea if this is intended. Golems can just randomly turn on you (seemingly) I particularly notice they turn hostile when you use the social skills, or if you get too far and force them to teleport to you. I happened to summon a clay golem and of course, while I was doing Reaver's Fate, He got angry, smacked me with a Cursed Wound, and with no remove curse was forced to make a decision. Die or try to continue the raid without taking any damage. This could also be used to accidentally grief other players. Although I am sure people carry remove curse potions/scrolls, etc; I still think removing them becoming randomly hostile is just something that should be done.

Sometimes when I group with people I have to pray NOT getting a clay golem and accidentally grieving someone. If the golem summon was not a random selection of the 4 maybe this silly gimick will be tolerable.

For what it's worth, Clay and Flesh Golems in D&D lore have a section in their rules where they can turn on their summoner when they've taken enough damage (per the 5E flavour text for Clay Golems: "However, clay is a weak vessel for life force. If the golem is damaged, the elemental spirit bound into it can break free. Such a golem runs amok, smashing everything around it until it is destroyed or completely repaired"), so I suspect this might actually be an intended behaviour. I'd suggest maybe refraining from using this particular summon without a Remove Curse potion on hand.

 

[RobShow]

For what it's worth, Clay and Flesh Golems in D&D lore have a section in their rules where they can turn on their summoner when they've taken enough damage (per the 5E flavour text for Clay Golems: "However, clay is a weak vessel for life force. If the golem is damaged, the elemental spirit bound into it can break free. Such a golem runs amok, smashing everything around it until it is destroyed or completely repaired"), so I suspect this might actually be an intended behaviour. I'd suggest maybe refraining from using this particular summon without a Remove Curse potion on hand.

Don't destroy a boy's dreams.

 

[VinoeWhines]

Use Augment Summoning fillagrees/Enhancements/and Colored Augment to see if you can make a Super Clay Golem and see how crazy it can get with all its Buffs and when it turns, kill a Vengence Reaper next to it. Then cast Mass Confusion.

 

[Jontheknight]

For what it's worth, Clay and Flesh Golems in D&D lore have a section in their rules where they can turn on their summoner when they've taken enough damage (per the 5E flavour text for Clay Golems: "However, clay is a weak vessel for life force. If the golem is damaged, the elemental spirit bound into it can break free. Such a golem runs amok, smashing everything around it until it is destroyed or completely repaired"), so I suspect this might actually be an intended behaviour. I'd suggest maybe refraining from using this particular summon without a Remove Curse potion on hand.

I completely respect that, However I do not think following DnD rules in DDO to the T is reasonable. DnD doesn't have spell points as a example and I can list MANY more examples of this as probably others can. I honestly do not mind the mechanic myself, if the golem charges at only me and kills me then despawns. My problem is that it can kill other players in a dungeon; and it's possible to do this completely unintentionally as its a random selection on cast. If I could choose the summon to prevent grieving (and yes I understand this can work in choosing TO grief) then I think that's a way better change. I hope you guys don't get the wrong idea, I love this kind of stuff in MMO's and DDO is unique in this way, but I just think it can cause problems for other's If I want to play a certain way, and that certain way of playing can grief/kill another player. If this mechanic stays, so be it, I think it's more fun that way and I laughed when I died in that Reaver's Fate Attempt; The implications is what brought me to bring this up.

 

[nix]

When was this? The only time I remember undead players really being griefed was due to an unintended interaction with the original epic destinies.

As far as I am aware Palemasters have never been harmed by positive, at least not by design. They were originally immune to both positive and repair.

I seem to remember they could be turned .... almost made me want to roll up a cleric

 

[PersonMan]

I seem to remember they could be turned .... almost made me want to roll up a cleric

There was a funny moment during PvP with my guildmates where one thought they did, but it turned out the Arcane Archer rolled a 20 at just the right moment. (Slaying Arrow used to be a toggle that dealt 500 damage on a Vorpal)

 

[Jontheknight]

I seem to remember they could be turned .... almost made me want to roll up a cleric

You know if this is true, I swore I remember being killed by something by another player and I thought it was healing, maybe I was turned?