Clarification on use of generative AI from the devs?

Throbulator

Throbulator

Well-known member
Noticed the thread bringing up the question of AI used to make cosmetic items got closed. Unsurprisingly, since it became pretty toxic.

BUT

It would be nice with clarification on whether generative AI is used for the game or not? Does SSG have a policy on the use of AI? A simple "yes" or "no" will do fine though, and any debate over whether AI is good or bad can be held somewhere other than the DDO forums. I personally have opinions and preferences, but there are other arenas for those. This a simple request for some consumer information, and that's all.
 
Lotoc

Lotoc

Well-known member
The game is listed on the Steam store. If you use LLM models on your product you need to disclose that on the Steam store page.
There is no such disclosure and I'm pretty sure there had been a statement in one of the hundreds of threads pushing AI in the last few years that SSG isn't interested in using it.
 
Throbulator

Throbulator

Well-known member
Lotoc said:
The game is listed on the Steam store. If you use LLM models on your product you need to disclose that on the Steam store page.
There is no such disclosure and I'm pretty sure there had been a statement in one of the hundreds of threads pushing AI in the last few years that SSG isn't interested in using it.
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Haven't used Steam for anything in a while, but good to know.
 
P

pirotessa

Well-known member
Throbulator said:
Noticed the thread bringing up the question of AI used to make cosmetic items got closed. Unsurprisingly, since it became pretty toxic.

BUT

It would be nice with clarification on whether generative AI is used for the game or not? Does SSG have a policy on the use of AI? A simple "yes" or "no" will do fine though, and any debate over whether AI is good or bad can be held somewhere other than the DDO forums. I personally have opinions and preferences, but there are other arenas for those. This a simple request for some consumer information, and that's all.
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Where do you think customer support comes from? :D
 
D

DDO Gaming

Well-known member
Hireling said:
I have thought about this too.
I wonder if its about protecting Devs/Coders or is it that AI is worse/bad?
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its a tool. Artists will use it to speedup productivity...just like using landscape designers instead of C++ speedsup productivity.

I think folks forget when you work for a product delivery business like SSG everyone is under immense pressure to deliver working products quickly to maintain incomestreams. Otherwise its gameover for the business and I'm sure SSG was staring at a blackhole around 2023 when banding etc issues were at their very worst
 
Frisson

Frisson

Well-known member
Lotoc said:
The game is listed on the Steam store. If you use LLM models on your product you need to disclose that on the Steam store page.
There is no such disclosure and I'm pretty sure there had been a statement in one of the hundreds of threads pushing AI in the last few years that SSG isn't interested in using it.
Click to expand...

Netease has just recently released 2 games that use AI: Swords of Justice & Where Winds Meet. I don't believe their Steam store page discloses the use of AI, unless I am missing it.

It absolutely should, in my opinion. And Steam should be diligent about that sort of transparency. I think SSG should do the same.

There are very legitimate concerns regarding the use of AI, that I would encourage people to research thoroughly. I will respect the OP's wishes, and leave it at that.
 
Owlbear

Owlbear

Well-known member
Frisson said:
Netease has just recently released 2 games that use AI: Swords of Justice & Where Winds Meet. I don't believe their Steam store page discloses the use of AI, unless I am missing it.

It absolutely should, in my opinion. And Steam should be diligent about that sort of transparency. I think SSG should do the same.

There are very legitimate concerns regarding the use of AI, that I would encourage people to research thoroughly. I will respect the OP's wishes, and leave it at that.
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The concerns are weird though... Game devs have been using AI tools for a long time and no one cared until now. Does anyone care if a developer uses AI to spellcheck or look for mistakes in code? It's the same like every other tool that developers use to create their work. Do we also need to list every game that uses Photoshop because someone uses it to draw art and an other dev uses it to copy an image? Judge the work, not the tool. In the end every new technology kills jobs and creates other jobs.
 
Lotoc

Lotoc

Well-known member
Owlbear said:
The concerns are weird though... Game devs have been using AI tools for a long time and no one cared until now. Does anyone care if a developer uses AI to spellcheck or look for mistakes in code? It's the same like every other tool that developers use to create their work. Do we also need to list every game that uses Photoshop because someone uses it to draw art and an other dev uses it to copy an image? Judge the work, not the tool. In the end every new technology kills jobs and creates other jobs.
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when people say AI they mean LLMs
LLMs are quite literally plagiarism machines fed anything and everything with no respect for copyright or licensing, predictive text models with no comprehension of actual context.
The use of it is a legal minefield waiting to blow and the entire 'industry' around it is a bubble waiting to pop being propagated by money launderers.

Genuinely the entire topic of AI is too political to have an actual discussion on here within the rules, because the way it is being used at large is incredibly damaging to the world in a more serious manner than some videogame.
 
Owlbear

Owlbear

Well-known member
Lotoc said:
when people say AI they mean LLMs
LLMs are quite literally plagiarism machines fed anything and everything with no respect for copyright or licensing, predictive text models with no comprehension of actual context.
The use of it is a legal minefield waiting to blow and the entire 'industry' around it is a bubble waiting to pop being propagated by money launderers.

Genuinely the entire topic of AI is too political to have an actual discussion on here within the rules, because the way it is being used at large is incredibly damaging to the world in a more serious manner than some videogame.
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Key is still how a developer uses the tool and not if he uses the tool.
 
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