Here's the scenario: Shortly after my husband and I met in game on Cannith, he invited me to come see his guild on Sarlona. He was one of those players who would create a toon on a server to farm favor. His mains were on Sarlona. So, I created a toon on Sarlona so I could see his guild. After we had played together on Cannith for about a year, he decided he wanted to move to Khyber. So he gifted me his Sarlona guild, and we both moved our mains to Khyber: his from Sarlona and mine from Cannith. So I have a little guild in Sarlona that he put several years' worth of work into, but over 90% of the guild's renown in that guild is from his work, and I have just kept it in safekeeping over the years. The renown is owned by the guild; there are no active players other than me, and I have only played on Sarlona briefly when we first met over 8 years ago. If all that renown is lost, I'm going to be unhappy because it represents a huge amount of time and effort and love that he put into building that guild. Our plan was to move it to Cormyr, where we could play together there occasionally, even though our mains will be going to a different server. Without the renown the guild currently owns, it would effectively be starting over, even though we have a small ship and multiple amenities. If SSG can figure out a way to retain guild levels or address renown that is owned by the guild and not by a player, that's going to solve a lot of issues described in this thread.
Guild renown and server transfer
- Thread starter Chaotix
- Start date
Anurakh
Little Nixie
They should have kept the guild's total renown, and then allowed each toon to maintain their renown (although this has always been pointless, given that the only thing that matters currently is total renown, and they can't transfer their renown elsewhere). It was so simple. And less complex than adding up individual renowns on the arrival server.
If they wanted to completely change the system and have a guild be the sum of active individual renowns regardless of past history, then they would have to be consistent and allow each toon to apply their renown to any guild the player wants.
But not a system that's neither here nor there.
Did he transfer his character or is it still in the guild? If it is still in the guild then he can login pack and transfer. If not then it should not impact the guild, that is one of the answers we are waiting for.
He transferred all his characters to Khyber. I am the only active member in the guild, with two of my f2p accounts just as placeholders.
Anurakh
Little Nixie
We have to wait and see if there's actually going to be something that prevents guilds from losing levels, because if up until now all that's mattered is guild history and not individual renown, it should remain that way.
But if there isn't, you're lost. Much more so than my guild, which will only lose vanity levels.
I don't like the system, and it's worth stating that.
Solarpower
Well-known member
So, is this the only thing that you found as "unfair" here ?
At least, Renown can be farmed back.
How about a situation when, let's say, a player spent $$$ on AS to help the guild to buy the biggest ship, for example, but now this player had to move to the other server than the guild ?
Anurakh
Little Nixie
No, it's not the only thing I find unfair, although shards can be fixed by giving the player valuable items if it's important. As a guild leader, I would do that.
In my case, that doesn't have an impact because I paid for all the amenities, except for one that was paid for by a guy who has since left the game.
I've also said several times that the community split is the worst thing I've seen with these transfers, though I don't see how they can fix that without taking away the player's freedom of choice to move to any server they want. But things like maintaining guild level shouldn't be so difficult.
Solarpower
Well-known member
I can imagine players will write tickets and ask their AS back.
Who knows, how the company are going to deal with them, though.
I don't think any guild leader will be pleased that the guild have lost not just it's levels but some of amenities too.
It seems that in any case, someone is bound to be dissatisfied. And all of this because of the forced transfers.
Mnemor
Contract devil
One of the guilds will receive -1, and each toon will contribute their renown to their home guild.
CherryBomb
Well-known member
My guild is now essentially one account, that is me. Over the years, many other accounts contributed to renown aggregate. My account currently contributes 55% of all renown. I have worked hard to level the guild to it's current 140. It appears that my guild will be decimated by the stated move plans and the guild will lose many of the earned amenity privileges that it currently enjoys.
This sucks. My guild should be able to retain it's entirety.
This sucks. My guild should be able to retain it's entirety.
Gimp-1
Well-known member
Its really not different from person spent $$$ on AS to help the guild buy the big ship...then for whatever reason leaves the guild / is kicked out of the guild.... etc....they would lose it under many situations. I dont see that as anything different. As noted guild leaving can be your choice or not your choice....either way you lose the AS the minute you contributed.
Solarpower
Well-known member
Those are literally 3 different situations.
1) If a person left themselves, OK they left.
2) It they were kicked, this can already be considered as fraud on the part of the guild leader.
3) And the current situation is that players may not want to leave, but are forced to split up to move to another server for better connection and less lags.
Well, I can't imagine there are many players that have bought something for the guild while not being guild leaders themselves, but still it's possible.
TavernTails
Tuesday Trivia Host on DDOstream
***EDIT! Announcement on DDOstream 6/27 made all of this irrelevant. Renown is transferring with the guild leader & guild!**
But, for posterity sake, the original rant is below
--------------------------------------
The way the current plan for guilds & renown is laid out is untenable, in my opinion. I ran through this on my stream this weekend, but I also wanted to post it here to illustrate the problem.
WARNING! Wall of text below...
My guild has been around since 2007. For the sake of discussion, let's call the guild "Been Playing Awhile."
For simplicity, let's leave renown out of the conversation and focus on the levels contributed. Also, forget alts and discuss players. This simplifies the illustration.
So, here is the status of Been Playing Awhile today, a level 200 guild:
Unfortunately, Player L (in gray) passed away in 2010. RIP - a big time raider. He wont be transferring...so we lose 30 levels of renown right there.
Players H, I, J, & K left the game a long time ago (in red). They're not coming back.
So now, the "Been Playing Awhile" guild is left with several active members, and is still level 200 because both examples above earned renown that went into the guild level. So let's start discussing the guild that remains - all full of active players who decided to move to Thrane. Two of the players (in lavender) are European players, though, and decided to move to Moonsea.
So in the move to Thrane, assuming everyone moves and rejoins the guild, the migrated guild should look like this:
However, they are no longer Level 200; they are now Level 80 (25+30+10+5+10). The guild leader may have access to the airship amenities, but he can't deploy them because the ship is no longer at a high enough level. So, for sticking with the game for all these years, they are rewarded with... loss.
I understand entirely that guild renown contributions stay with a character's back-end data; that's how you calculate renown loss upon kicking a player or the player leaving the guild. However, it's NOT a solution to carry on because it's 'hard' to untangle. The guild renown needs to STAY with the guild, period. Anything else is punishing loyalty and penalizing players for having stuck with the game.
If this is the way the final pack and move work out, it hardly seems like a solution. Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
But, for posterity sake, the original rant is below
--------------------------------------
The way the current plan for guilds & renown is laid out is untenable, in my opinion. I ran through this on my stream this weekend, but I also wanted to post it here to illustrate the problem.
WARNING! Wall of text below...
My guild has been around since 2007. For the sake of discussion, let's call the guild "Been Playing Awhile."
For simplicity, let's leave renown out of the conversation and focus on the levels contributed. Also, forget alts and discuss players. This simplifies the illustration.
So, here is the status of Been Playing Awhile today, a level 200 guild:
Unfortunately, Player L (in gray) passed away in 2010. RIP - a big time raider. He wont be transferring...so we lose 30 levels of renown right there.
Players H, I, J, & K left the game a long time ago (in red). They're not coming back.
So now, the "Been Playing Awhile" guild is left with several active members, and is still level 200 because both examples above earned renown that went into the guild level. So let's start discussing the guild that remains - all full of active players who decided to move to Thrane. Two of the players (in lavender) are European players, though, and decided to move to Moonsea.
So in the move to Thrane, assuming everyone moves and rejoins the guild, the migrated guild should look like this:
However, they are no longer Level 200; they are now Level 80 (25+30+10+5+10). The guild leader may have access to the airship amenities, but he can't deploy them because the ship is no longer at a high enough level. So, for sticking with the game for all these years, they are rewarded with... loss.
I understand entirely that guild renown contributions stay with a character's back-end data; that's how you calculate renown loss upon kicking a player or the player leaving the guild. However, it's NOT a solution to carry on because it's 'hard' to untangle. The guild renown needs to STAY with the guild, period. Anything else is punishing loyalty and penalizing players for having stuck with the game.
If this is the way the final pack and move work out, it hardly seems like a solution. Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
Last edited:
Solarpower
Well-known member
I think the whole situation should be better that this even if the devs won't change renown transfer.
Because the palyers keep gain renow. So it's not something like 25+30+25+5+20+35+60=200 but something like 150+200+80+100+94=200 (+424 unaccounted levels).
I buy things for a guild I do not lead every HC season and for a guild currently on Cormyr
What about all the renown earned by players after the guild hit 200 to replace decay, the sum of renown of the current members may far exceed the amount needed for 200. This is not a simple issue.The way the current plan for guilds & renown is laid out is untenable, in my opinion. I ran through this on my stream this weekend, but I also wanted to post it here to illustrate the problem.
WARNING! Wall of text below...
My guild has been around since 2007. For the sake of discussion, let's call the guild "Been Playing Awhile."
For simplicity, let's leave renown out of the conversation and focus on the levels contributed. Also, forget alts and discuss players. This simplifies the illustration.
So, here is the status of Been Playing Awhile today, a level 200 guild:
Unfortunately, Player L (in gray) passed away in 2010. RIP - a big time raider. He wont be transferring...so we lose 30 levels of renown right there.
Players H, I, J, & K left the game a long time ago (in red). They're not coming back.
So now, the "Been Playing Awhile" guild is left with several active members, and is still level 200 because both examples above earned renown that went into the guild level. So let's start discussing the guild that remains - all full of active players who decided to move to Thrane. Two of the players (in lavender) are European players, though, and decided to move to Moonsea.
So in the move to Thrane, assuming everyone moves correctly (guild leader first, then players), and rejoin the guild. The migrated guild should look like this:
However, they are no longer Level 200; they are now Level 80 (25+30+10+5+10). The guild leader may have access to the airship amenities, but he can't deploy them because the ship is no longer at a high enough level. So, for sticking with the game for all these years, they are rewarded with... loss.
I understand entirely that guild renown contributions stay with a character's back-end data; that's how you calculate renown loss upon kicking a player or the player leaving the guild. However, it's NOT a solution to carry on because it's 'hard' to untangle. The guild renown needs to STAY with the guild, period. Anything else is punishing loyalty and penalizing players for having stuck with the game.
If this is the way the final pack and move work out, it hardly seems like a solution. Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
Chaotix
Well-known member
Leeme guess, You US based?
As far I can see for EU players, me included, LA server isn't viable option at all guild or no (and yes call me selfish), why should I suffer lag issues, twitching, when I have option to play smooth. After all I'll be harsh, my guildies don't paying my packs, playtime and accounts/subscriptions, I do, and I want to have maximum comfort and experience playing this game.
It is Las Vegas, not LA. I am US east so my latency goes up regardless of which server I select. It is the adjective 'grotesquely' that I was commenting on. If you played on Cormry the experience will be the same.