thejaerleclan
Active member
126 pulls from a chest to get the Spring Equinox ring. Close to 100 on the Book Burning End chest looking for the Golden Age Buckler.
How Insane Are the MD droprates.. exactly
- Thread starter The Nameless One
- Start date
vryxnr
Well-known member
chances to pull an item is not easily translated to time spent, because that is not how chance works. a 1/100 chance does not mean you are guaranteed 1 every 100, or that on the 100ths try you will get it. 1/100 means on average across all attempts the odds approach 1%. That could mean that 1 person doesn't get it until their 1000th attempt while 10 people got in within 10 tries, that averages out to 1% (as an extreme example).
Also, DDO supposedly (until now at least) uses a tiered system, where on normal you have an approximate 10% chance to get onto the named loot table (then your odds of getting the item you want is divided amongst all the named items available from that chest), hard has/had a 16% chance to get onto that table, elite has a 33% chance to get onto the named loot table, and each skull of reaper adds +1% more to that, ending at 43% chance to get on the named loot table per chest opening when done on Reaper 10.
The early data miners said MD rare loot table is a 5% chance to get on. is that on normal? Hard? elite? R10? All of them? The average of all of them? I don't know. BUT, from my personal in game tests trying to get some specific items, doing everything between elite and r4, the chance to get onto the rare loot table seems (for me at least) to be closer to 2% (again, at least for me, so far, on those difficulties). Each MD rare table has 3 items on it, so your chance of getting what you want is 1/3rd of that, so in my case, 0.6% chance, or 1/150. (edit: and the google.doc linked below has it as 3% to get on the table)
I got to those numbers by multiboxing a full group of myself (yes, 6 accounts at once all controlled by me), and each of my accounts has at least 3 characters that can do legendary content, so I was doing legendary Myth Drannor, elite to r4 for farming runs. Ransacking each of those (18) characters each week, and I still haven't seen some items. Doing the Safehouse for example, I was averaging 1 rare item every 50 chest openings. My 4th rare item was on pull 198. In that time I got two copies of one rare, two of another, and 0 of the third.
Also remember that many of these rare items are not actually these crazy-unique-niche-nice-to-haves-but-not-mandatory things like Jibbers Blade or an Epic Rings of Spell Storing, but are regular upgrades that have common set bonuses on them. These were supposed to be a way to get away from reliance on set items by having those bonuses available via the sun/moon augments, and in order to "upgrade" from the old set items to these new systems, you need to be able to get multiple different ones and one can do over 200 lootings and not see one? Yeah, that's bad.
As for similar things? The first two that come to mind I mentioned above. The Cursed Blade of Jack Jibbers is supposedly a 1% drop chance (which is MORE COMMON than a specific Myth Drannor rare item due to each one being on a table with 2 other items, using my data at least, which puts any specific MD item chance at 0.6%). Using the data-miners early findings (and who knows if those numbers have changed since then) then MD is only barely more common than JJ blades at 1.6% chance for any specific MD item.
The Epic Ring of Spell Storing is super common and easy to get now, but back in the S/S/S system, you needed 4 items to craft it. The base item, a scroll of the item, a seal of the item, and a shard of the item. Each one had different drop rates. The shard for the Ring of Spell Storing was notoriously rare, as it was a Raid only drop, and shared a loot table with over 40 other items. Taking all that into account, the Shard itself was somewhere around a 1/5000 rate, or 0.02% chance. In the entire time that that system was being used, there were only 2-3 people who posted publicly that they got the shard, I recall at least one of them saying they were doing the raid every 3 days for 5 years before they saw it. More probably exist, but not many more. However, this version of the ERoSS is not a vital piece in any one's gear set. It's a swap in item for it's clicky. This version has no set bonus tied to it. It's only purpose was a reusable source of spell point restoration. Like JJ's Blade, it's a nice to have Trophy item to show off having gotten it, and helps in some situations, but is not an "always worn" piece. MD rare items are meant to be worn and used all the time. Also, most people hated this back then too and considered it to essentially not exist because it was so stupid and painful to even think about getting.
Now lets include a macro view of things. Major expansions and level cap increases are supposed to happen, what, every 2 years until we get the cap up to 40. Not all players are able to play as much or as intensely as I can. So instead of multiboxing 6 accounts with 3+ characters on each account, ransacking all of them each week for 3 months and still not seeing every rare named item (one of which might be the one you are looking for, or multiple ones you are looking for)... they may be a person playing on only one account with one or two characters on it, for only 2 hours every other day instead of 4-5 every day... The level cap is going to go up and new gear to chase that will invalidate MD gear will be introduced way before many players will even get a chance to get and use and enjoy the current "available" gear.
That is a travesty.
Also, DDO supposedly (until now at least) uses a tiered system, where on normal you have an approximate 10% chance to get onto the named loot table (then your odds of getting the item you want is divided amongst all the named items available from that chest), hard has/had a 16% chance to get onto that table, elite has a 33% chance to get onto the named loot table, and each skull of reaper adds +1% more to that, ending at 43% chance to get on the named loot table per chest opening when done on Reaper 10.
The early data miners said MD rare loot table is a 5% chance to get on. is that on normal? Hard? elite? R10? All of them? The average of all of them? I don't know. BUT, from my personal in game tests trying to get some specific items, doing everything between elite and r4, the chance to get onto the rare loot table seems (for me at least) to be closer to 2% (again, at least for me, so far, on those difficulties). Each MD rare table has 3 items on it, so your chance of getting what you want is 1/3rd of that, so in my case, 0.6% chance, or 1/150. (edit: and the google.doc linked below has it as 3% to get on the table)
I got to those numbers by multiboxing a full group of myself (yes, 6 accounts at once all controlled by me), and each of my accounts has at least 3 characters that can do legendary content, so I was doing legendary Myth Drannor, elite to r4 for farming runs. Ransacking each of those (18) characters each week, and I still haven't seen some items. Doing the Safehouse for example, I was averaging 1 rare item every 50 chest openings. My 4th rare item was on pull 198. In that time I got two copies of one rare, two of another, and 0 of the third.
Also remember that many of these rare items are not actually these crazy-unique-niche-nice-to-haves-but-not-mandatory things like Jibbers Blade or an Epic Rings of Spell Storing, but are regular upgrades that have common set bonuses on them. These were supposed to be a way to get away from reliance on set items by having those bonuses available via the sun/moon augments, and in order to "upgrade" from the old set items to these new systems, you need to be able to get multiple different ones and one can do over 200 lootings and not see one? Yeah, that's bad.
As for similar things? The first two that come to mind I mentioned above. The Cursed Blade of Jack Jibbers is supposedly a 1% drop chance (which is MORE COMMON than a specific Myth Drannor rare item due to each one being on a table with 2 other items, using my data at least, which puts any specific MD item chance at 0.6%). Using the data-miners early findings (and who knows if those numbers have changed since then) then MD is only barely more common than JJ blades at 1.6% chance for any specific MD item.
The Epic Ring of Spell Storing is super common and easy to get now, but back in the S/S/S system, you needed 4 items to craft it. The base item, a scroll of the item, a seal of the item, and a shard of the item. Each one had different drop rates. The shard for the Ring of Spell Storing was notoriously rare, as it was a Raid only drop, and shared a loot table with over 40 other items. Taking all that into account, the Shard itself was somewhere around a 1/5000 rate, or 0.02% chance. In the entire time that that system was being used, there were only 2-3 people who posted publicly that they got the shard, I recall at least one of them saying they were doing the raid every 3 days for 5 years before they saw it. More probably exist, but not many more. However, this version of the ERoSS is not a vital piece in any one's gear set. It's a swap in item for it's clicky. This version has no set bonus tied to it. It's only purpose was a reusable source of spell point restoration. Like JJ's Blade, it's a nice to have Trophy item to show off having gotten it, and helps in some situations, but is not an "always worn" piece. MD rare items are meant to be worn and used all the time. Also, most people hated this back then too and considered it to essentially not exist because it was so stupid and painful to even think about getting.
Now lets include a macro view of things. Major expansions and level cap increases are supposed to happen, what, every 2 years until we get the cap up to 40. Not all players are able to play as much or as intensely as I can. So instead of multiboxing 6 accounts with 3+ characters on each account, ransacking all of them each week for 3 months and still not seeing every rare named item (one of which might be the one you are looking for, or multiple ones you are looking for)... they may be a person playing on only one account with one or two characters on it, for only 2 hours every other day instead of 4-5 every day... The level cap is going to go up and new gear to chase that will invalidate MD gear will be introduced way before many players will even get a chance to get and use and enjoy the current "available" gear.
That is a travesty.
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Varr
Member
Rare is not really rare enough. I've had the pack for about 2 1/2 months. I went ahead and planned all the items I wanted to replace my Fey gear with, both item and Solar/Lunar.
Had Quite the list. Including a rare helm from the Worm and rare cloak from the Dragon.
I've probably done 55-60 Saga loops with a bot, about 120 pulls on everything. Stuck now looting a few items to try and put a better card on it. other than that, MD is all tapped out with significant, but not maniacal play.
Red Wizards Sight Gogs. Solar Gem of Spell Crit Chance 6%
Leg Light Armor of the Artblade: Solar Gem of Int (Bonus Reaper +5% AC +3% PRR)
Leg Cuffs of the Forbidden: Lunar Gem of Neg Amp
Death's Deferral Boots: Lunar Gem of Spell Difficulty
Leg Gloves of the Resilient: Lunar Gem of Ranged
Leg Ring of Mystic Int: (Carded about 12 of these to end up with one I liked - Intangibility)
Leg Belt of Bold Brilliance: Lunar Gem of PPR
Leg Cloak of Crownblade: Solar Gem of Armor Layers
Leg Periapt of Con: Solar Gem of Spell DCS
Leg Helm of Warblade: Solar Gem of PPR
Light Crossbow of Undying Age
Had 16 of the items in the first month. I did this with no potions of finding, but I did reroll about 500 shards worth of worm farm, as that is one fat worm for a Wizard. No other rerolls done. Got the Helm after I decided against rerolling event he worm.
Had a Dino Ring and Leg Twisted Talisman I wasn't looking to upgrade.
Wish stuff was rarer. Old Spell Storing Ring and to a much lesser degree Jibbers rare. Back to leveling bot.
Had Quite the list. Including a rare helm from the Worm and rare cloak from the Dragon.
I've probably done 55-60 Saga loops with a bot, about 120 pulls on everything. Stuck now looting a few items to try and put a better card on it. other than that, MD is all tapped out with significant, but not maniacal play.
Red Wizards Sight Gogs. Solar Gem of Spell Crit Chance 6%
Leg Light Armor of the Artblade: Solar Gem of Int (Bonus Reaper +5% AC +3% PRR)
Leg Cuffs of the Forbidden: Lunar Gem of Neg Amp
Death's Deferral Boots: Lunar Gem of Spell Difficulty
Leg Gloves of the Resilient: Lunar Gem of Ranged
Leg Ring of Mystic Int: (Carded about 12 of these to end up with one I liked - Intangibility)
Leg Belt of Bold Brilliance: Lunar Gem of PPR
Leg Cloak of Crownblade: Solar Gem of Armor Layers
Leg Periapt of Con: Solar Gem of Spell DCS
Leg Helm of Warblade: Solar Gem of PPR
Light Crossbow of Undying Age
Had 16 of the items in the first month. I did this with no potions of finding, but I did reroll about 500 shards worth of worm farm, as that is one fat worm for a Wizard. No other rerolls done. Got the Helm after I decided against rerolling event he worm.
Had a Dino Ring and Leg Twisted Talisman I wasn't looking to upgrade.
Wish stuff was rarer. Old Spell Storing Ring and to a much lesser degree Jibbers rare. Back to leveling bot.
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Teh_Troll
Well-known member
This is madness, and not even the cool kind of Spartan madness where you get to kick a messenger down a well.
erethizon1
Well-known member
We have the same basic idea. I am still wearing level 29 gear at cap. Some day I will have enough Saltmarsh, IoD, and Vecna gear to consider upgrading my 5 piece Ravenloft set. It was only a few months ago I learned that no gear since Sharn Docks has a chest piece with Universal Spell Power and Spell Lore (which Ravenloft, Sharn, Sharn Docks, and Feywild all have), so I immediately decided to stop looking into whether it was worth upgrading to the newer content gear since apparently it is not. Perhaps when I finish my last 10 racials and move away from Warlock to do other classes I will see if gear higher than level 29 is worth considering at cap.
The items are very rare... I think the only people with full sets of MD rares are the people who have the 8 extra accounts they drag in to loot. The rare augs are a smidge easier by doing whole sagas and getting the rares in the end rewards.
I decided to ransack every quest every week on two characters with full rerolls and greater pots and I have the ring and the cloak and a couple of augs I need. I'm short the chest and the hat and one aug still.
I decided to ransack every quest every week on two characters with full rerolls and greater pots and I have the ring and the cloak and a couple of augs I need. I'm short the chest and the hat and one aug still.
Sarlona Raiding
Well-known member
Here is the math you requested. I haven't updated it for the improved purple named drop rates as I don't yet have the new data.
Warsaga
present day - present time
I'm a trucker and this is what I legit think about every time I'm driving over a bridge or in my personal vehicle driving under an underpass
kmoustakas
Scourge of Xaos
I think you can do that with iod crafting if you get raid armor... but yeah.
I got an autumn equinox on my main while helping some folks try to grind an imbue dice augment from voices, so I decided to make a gearset that includes it. I specifically avoided planning for anything else with a rare drop chance other than an undying warhammer.
I used one of the 6 hour 15% elixirs of discovery we got an some point with a 6 hour +15 treasure hunter elixir, and then 8x ransacked every quest in MD that I can complete in under 5-10 minutes (e.g., not time long past or key to the mythal). I grabbed easy opts as well along the way. It didn't really feel worth it to put a group up for it because if anyone else pulled a golden age item I would feel bad taking it from them since the rate is so atrocious.
I shard rerolled whenever an end chest had no named item whatsoever, and about 2k shards and 6+ hours in quests later I had gotten two golden age weapons to make into a golden warhammer that I upgraded to undying. It was a thoroughly miserable and unfulfilling experience - I only got half of the augments I needed, and rarely more than one copy of any given piece of gear. I'm not planning to do an MD set on any other characters, and I kinda hate the content now.
I used one of the 6 hour 15% elixirs of discovery we got an some point with a 6 hour +15 treasure hunter elixir, and then 8x ransacked every quest in MD that I can complete in under 5-10 minutes (e.g., not time long past or key to the mythal). I grabbed easy opts as well along the way. It didn't really feel worth it to put a group up for it because if anyone else pulled a golden age item I would feel bad taking it from them since the rate is so atrocious.
I shard rerolled whenever an end chest had no named item whatsoever, and about 2k shards and 6+ hours in quests later I had gotten two golden age weapons to make into a golden warhammer that I upgraded to undying. It was a thoroughly miserable and unfulfilling experience - I only got half of the augments I needed, and rarely more than one copy of any given piece of gear. I'm not planning to do an MD set on any other characters, and I kinda hate the content now.
Teh_Troll
Well-known member
I didn't know an animated gif could be a company motto . . .
Oliphant
Well-known member
Good news, bad news. Unless you enjoy running over to some miserable caves in a massive wilderness to farm non-quest encounters, you can pretty much predict it's those miserable caves where the rare you be needing is going to end up.
Did you find a new home after that?
erethizon1
Well-known member
I need my chest, gloves, and cloak slot for the much more important 6% increase to spell crit that the Sharn Docks gives me, so I can't do a 5 Chrono set. To replace Ravenloft would require boots, belt, 2 rings, and bracers (could also possibly do eyes if it is worth giving up my artifact).
do you need 5? cant 3 work?
erethizon1
Well-known member
This definitely sounds like an expansion worth skipping. I still am wearing level 29 gear, so when the time does come to upgrade I am sure I can settle for IoD/Vecna or whatever expansion is after MD (assuming they don't ruin it the same way they ruined MD).
erethizon1
Well-known member
Potentially. It all depends on what is being given up and what is being gained. I designed my warlock back when Sharn was new and people were saying the DC's there were impossible to hit (before the stat squish). I have a warlock that focuses entirely on DPS and put no effort into DC's. Everything I picked was based around spells and abilities that either had no saving throw or still did damage even if they made a save. I never charm or hold anything (don't even pick the spells). As time has gone on and I have gained more power, my DC's have gotten better such that my tentacles can hold stuff in most content now, but I never left the pure DPS focus. I even pick mental toughness and improved mental toughness as two of my feats just because they each come with 1% spell crit.
With all that in mind, a tiny bonus to DC's from an item set means less to me than whatever bonuses are on the gear itself (and whatever further DPS increases the gear has). Those 5 pieces listed include my deathblock, insightful charisma, ghostly, and a bunch of other bonuses that the new gear would have to replace. I'm assuming that somewhere out there is a better set than the 5 or 6 Ravenloft items I have now (I think I forgot the neck slot as a possibility too), but I haven't taken the time to find it because I don't have enough gear from those expansions to already have most of the items needed (and I don't really want to look it up only to discover I'm still missing most of the set since I rarely ever farm for anything).