I'm planning to potentially TR my level 20 into a TWF build, and I'm debating between a fighter kensai or ranger tempest. Both have interesting abilities, but I'm wondering which winds up being better? My toon has a +8 supreme tome active (that sale was fortuitous) so stats aren't really any issue.
Kensai vs. Tempest
- Thread starter jglabare
- Start date
Better damage, more likely to be useful past level 20.
Terpilar
Well-known member
Playing a Dex-based Dark Hunter Tempest right now, and it has some sick moves (The Growing Storm+Dance of Death+Exposing Strike+Tendon Cut+Quick Cutter+Whirlwind Attack=All Mobs Are Dead), gets evasion at lvl 26, has trapping (which is also some CC) and a relatively robust pet. Love it.
Zaszgul
Well-known member
If you are soloing, 8+ levels of fighter (kensei or dragonlord) are fantastic for Second Wind - it can be used while helpless and heals all stat damage (so if you were otherwise going to die to a mindflayer or otyugh from stat drain - you should pull through after finding your second wind!).
I enjoyed my Wis-based Tempest - t4 falconry for AoE blind/sneak attack/fort bypass was a good combo that kept it alive in a lot of sticky situations.
No reason you can't do 12 tempest + 8 fighter (either archetype) if you like.
Kensei (esp pure) is a harder sell. I mixed a kensei life with some Warlock for ES brilliance. Second Wind is good for emergency heals, but not enough to self-heal entire dungeons on its own. You'll need something else. 20 Dragonlord is more viable solo, because you can keep most things helpless until they die.
I enjoyed my Wis-based Tempest - t4 falconry for AoE blind/sneak attack/fort bypass was a good combo that kept it alive in a lot of sticky situations.
No reason you can't do 12 tempest + 8 fighter (either archetype) if you like.
Kensei (esp pure) is a harder sell. I mixed a kensei life with some Warlock for ES brilliance. Second Wind is good for emergency heals, but not enough to self-heal entire dungeons on its own. You'll need something else. 20 Dragonlord is more viable solo, because you can keep most things helpless until they die.
I started out first 3 levels as fighter kensai, so it's not out of the realm of possibilities that I could add 12 levels of ranger tempest, except my complete disregard of all mental stats. But which tier 5 enhancements do you think are better? Kensai or tempest?
Zaszgul
Well-known member
If you're TWF you'll almost certainly want Dance of Death from Tempest T5 - it's the main draw for TWF. A lot of the t5 tempest abilities are good, though the tree is very expensive.
Still, if you get enough AoE from other sources then you may not want DoD and could go Kensei t5 instead.
Ranger crit mult/threat enhancements come from L12 cores (tempest and DWS) rather than t5s. AP will be tight if you want +1/+1 crit and a third tree. Pretty sure I had to sacrifice +threat on my ranger build so that's likely the one in DWS.
The one thing I've noticed about kensai is they do get an awful lot of enhancements to crit multipliers. A +1 at level 6? Then again at 12? Hard to ignore especially with a TWF build.
The main thing Tempest has going for it are its tier-5s: Dual Perfection (full stat bonus to offhand damage), A Thousand Cuts (combine with Haste Boost for burst DPS), and Dance of Death (+200% Strikethrough for 10 seconds). DoD is still the only way to add Strikethrough to dual-wielding AFAIK, which is what enables a Tempest to shred mobs faster than most TWF builds.
Regular ranger gets Evasion and the full Favored Enemy options; Dark Hunter gets trap skills and up to 5d6 sneak attacks free.
The main drawback to melee rangers is you need to invest heavily into two trees to have both a crit range & multiplier bonus; 40+ Tempest / 24 Deepwood Stalker is my usual spread. That doesn't leave a lot of points for other things. Also rangers don't get a Battle Trance, which means either investing in one of the Universal options or splashing cleric / FvS for Divine Might or Will, costing you the Tempest capstone. [Which isn't great but is still extra DPS and survivability.]
AbyssalMage
Well-known member
Did they fix DoD or is it still bugged? If it is bugged the answer is simple.
h46av8r
Well-known member
I really enjoyed this build - centered Grandmaster of Forms (Ocean stance) Dance of Death tempest with dual longswords via Whirling Steel Strike and Knights Training, haste boost of course. Falconry for Wisdom to hit and damage, helpless damage, battle trance, etc. Probably folks here can suggest better Epic Destiny selections... https://forums-old.ddo.com/forums/s...isdom-Based)-Ranger-12-Paladin-6-Monk-2-Build Absolute base is Ranger 5 with Tempest T5 and Monk1 with appropriate feats. You can do a lot with remaining levels e.g. Paladin 14 for Holy Sword for the +1/+1 crit range and multiplier. I even did a EK Wizard life on this. It is feat challenged so I suggest using Maetrim's builder.
h46av8r
Well-known member
Dance of Death works great - up 2/3 of the time i.e 10 seconds on with 15 second cooldown. Most things are down within those 10 seconds so really better than that.
AbyssalMage
Well-known member
Yes, but at one point it was bugged (for at least a year plus) and rarely worked as listed. That is why I asked because I have not read any threads saying it was fixed. Even back then during discussions most people didn’t know until they made an Iconic and went to the Airship (or Dojo on Lamania).
So currently 19th level with this build. Thus far Ftr12/Rngr7, planning to go 12/8, kensai/tempest. It's working very well to this point (except finding decent Khopesh...), but now that I'm approaching 20, which epic destiny trees would you suggest? Am thinking Legendary Dreadnought is a given, but what about others? She has a good Dex, but strength is her best stat.
Phaedra
Well-known member
Shadowdancer for evasion since you didn't get it from rng9
Could go FotW (quick/cutter, more str) or primal for the always nice cocoon.
Fauxknight
Well-known member
Dance of Death is absolute top tier for TWF builds, it takes your extremely high dps and applies it fully across an area. Without DoD you're mostly stuck single target.
So 5 levels of Ranger so you can take DoD at tier 5 or often a 6th level for the extra free feat is generally how to start any TWF build.
So 5 levels of Ranger so you can take DoD at tier 5 or often a 6th level for the extra free feat is generally how to start any TWF build.