If your just walking around and seeing problems without actually using blind/invis or stealth I'm not sure whats going on there. I will investigate.Some close quarters quests (such as the Factory in SAVING DORRIS, and the sewers in FASHION MADNESS) are very weird currently. The mobs simply stand still until attacked or until you get to melee range.
@Torc Are these changes in Lamannia also addressing this kind of pathing issue?
What quest did you hit this?Here's an interesting discovery. It appears that if you recall out of the quest, and re-enter, the enemies will then drop aggro properly and it stays off once the aggro is lost again. But the first entry in (and this will be the case for everyone) you will not be able to lose aggro normally.
J1NG
:: edit ::
Spoke too soon. It appears there's a group aggro thing going that helps each of the aggro'd enemies maintain aggro on the player and constantly keep trying to path towards you to attack. Leaving and entering the quest only breaks it that one time. Subsequent times can be retriggered again and there's no way to break it off fully using stealth or Invis at this time and even using DD may not work depending on distance.
The problem of monsters standing still doing nothing, unable (or unwilling) to path to players, has been an issue for many months now. Sounds like the blind/invis pathing issue is a completely separate issue.If your just walking around and seeing problems without actually using blind/invis or stealth I'm not sure whats going on there. I will investigate.
Unsure if this is relevant to you, but I 100% encountered behavior (on live servers) with mobs just standing still in quests where invis, blind, nor stealth of any kind were being used. This behavior became terrible and increasingly often after U69 patch 3. I'm hoping it was a halo effect from the issue these changes are trying to address.If your just walking around and seeing problems without actually using blind/invis or stealth I'm not sure whats going on there. I will investigate.
Yes. This has nothing to do with blind/invis/stealth. Just try Finding Doris and you will see.. when you reach the room with war forges, after the spiders/rats/bats.If your just walking around and seeing problems without actually using blind/invis or stealth I'm not sure whats going on there. I will investigate.
Here's an interesting discovery. It appears that if you recall out of the quest, and re-enter, the enemies will then drop aggro properly and it stays off once the aggro is lost again. But the first entry in (and this will be the case for everyone) you will not be able to lose aggro normally.
J1NG
:: edit ::
Spoke too soon. It appears there's a group aggro thing going that helps each of the aggro'd enemies maintain aggro on the player and constantly keep trying to path towards you to attack. Leaving and entering the quest only breaks it that one time. Subsequent times can be retriggered again and there's no way to break it off fully using stealth or Invis at this time and even using DD may not work depending on distance.
I apologise as I had to IRL afk there for a while. Initial quest I've been trying this in is A Sharn Welcome.What quest did you hit this?
So a lot of structural changes are occurring in DDO to improve game performance. This thread will focus on one specific change to fix an issue we are seeing where monster pathing locks up on the instance level. Reports of this issue have been increasing gradually over time and we believe we've found the general cause...
This relates to monsters being either...
-Blind
-Chasing a player they already saw but who dropped into stealth afterwards (and have enough distance and hide skill to pull it off)
-Chasing an player who just went invisible
Monsters engaged in these behaviors were causing numerous pathing performance bugs all in the name of "looking really blind and ineffective" when chasing players they couldn't see for whatever reason. We've decide to rein this in somewhat because it's eating to much of our pathing budget. We are uncertain if this became more expensive due to other changes or that blind/invis guard just has become more common in the meta. We do know that this issue has an effect across multi instances so the actions of one party in a dungeon can affect other dungeons.
"I Can't See Target" behavior should now work as follows...
Monsters will now chase an echo of your location when blind or when you are Invis or doing a decent job of stealthing away. As long as the player keeps moving attacks should generally still be significantly impaired to keep the value of these conditions relevant. (Also blind monsters have a 50% miss chance still, as always)Mobile Ranged Attackers/Casters will attempt to get close to you, so will charge forward rather than shooting/casting blindly or swinging randomly around.Turreted mobs will still attack you at range but will fire at the echo (so they won't lead their target as effectively as they do when not impaired)
IMPORTANT - This this should not affect the stealth experience for players who were never seen in the first place. This really only touches monsters who already hate you but can't see you very well for the reasons stated above.
ALSO IMPORTANT - This is going to be an iterative process. This will mean blind monsters will be more effective at continuing to engage in combat than they once were, though the player should continue to enjoy a significant advantage. We would still like to make the monsters simulate "being blind" in a more convincing fashion but not at the cost of monsters "just plain working", so assuming we see improvements (which our repro's on the issue currently indicate we will), we will gradually add/adjust nuisances back into the system slowly and in a more performant manner till we get the balance right.
-Torc
If your talking about when a monster just orbits you really fast? I have a little. Been fixing it on a case by case basis until we find a more global solution (not sure when it got introduced)... it seems to affect monsters who want to get really close to you. Are there particular monsters you see this happen with a lot?Can you also look into monsters stuck in a "trying to flank their target" loop? This is pretty obvious and has been documented in many videos.
My thoughts would be to give the monsters a limit to the number of flanking attempts (ie try to flank but don't try again for 60 secs) to keep them from aimlessly trying to get to their target's flank.
Yes that is the behavior we are trying to fix. We believe that blind monsters in OTHER dungeons can throttle the path system on the whole server box and cause problems in other people's quests who are not using those effects at all.Unsure if this is relevant to you, but I 100% encountered behavior (on live servers) with mobs just standing still in quests where invis, blind, nor stealth of any kind were being used. This behavior became terrible and increasingly often after U69 patch 3. I'm hoping it was a halo effect from the issue these changes are trying to address.
If your talking about when a monster just orbits you really fast? I have a little. Been fixing it on a case by case basis until we find a more global solution (not sure when it got introduced)... it seems to affect monsters who want to get really close to you. Are there particular monsters you see this happen with a lot?
Specters have a bad case of it.Are there particular monsters you see this happen with a lot?
You had a functioning hide/invis and detect by enemies and chase for x amount of time working at one point. Then DDO had a physics update and then everything went to pot. Enemies that also were not half kobold were now finding themselves on invisible ledges or able to perform feats that were not possible previously, including going up vertical surfaces to attack their enemies (doesn't have to be the player, it can be neutral targets marked as enemies for them too), Doom Reapers "hopping" to gain height to attack enemies taking refuge on ledges above, also part of why I had to contact you guys about the "projectile collision" issue (it was noticed after the physics updates) that permitted attackers to, well you know already so I won't say the rest.Yes that is the behavior we are trying to fix. We believe that blind monsters in OTHER dungeons can throttle the path system on the whole server box and cause problems in other people's quests who are not using those effects at all.