Lamannia U76 - Balance Pass

[Bjond]

to fix tempest they'll need to give them something so good even dragonlords would say "wow, that's dope"

I don't think you'd need that much. It does need enough to make it similar but different.

2. STR or DEX Trance without having to go Horizon Walker or Dragon Lord

Not a trance fan, but in the current game, it's required. That wouldn't make up for the difference, though. IMHO, it should also have OH DS = MH DS in T5. Even that would not be enough, but we'd be down to single-digit scalar percentages.

3. Movement speed

Funspeed is really nice to have and nicer to share. This would help with making it attractive without over-buffing DPS.

I feel the problem with DCs is that either they are too low to make everything trivial or too high to make those abilities useless. It is all or nothing.

For Tempest in particular it's far too much of nothing. Paladin spells work and are desirable because they're buffs. My bet is that most don't even notice that it also has DC spells, which (like Tempest's) do absolutely nothing at all. It would be nice if SSG applied that lesson to hybrids. Either make the DC spells useful or make SURE hybrids have valuable useful buffs. Otherwise, it ends up like Tempest -- a half-caster class (or third-caster) that effectively has no spells.

 

[Mindos]

I pugged R1 Relentless the other day, an agonizing 37 min completion. There were at least five players in that raid that had no clue how to do damage.

players get bent out of shape that we're elitest because we don't play with new players.

The raids been out how long? 3 days when you pugged it?

 

[Shear-buckler]

I get what you're saying, but the floor needs to improve for lots of builds. I pugged R1 Relentless the other day, an agonizing 37 min completion. There were at least five players in that raid that had no clue how to do damage.

You cant raise the floor without also raising the ceiling.

And as for DPS in the new raid, are you sure those 5 players didnt just play melee and would have done fine with DPS in a regular non-anti-melee raid?

 

[songswrath]

Suggestions for 2hf
Bring the ability score mod for damage back to 3x at greater, 3.5 with perfect.
Give Perfect Two Handed Fighting the vorpals on a 19 that used to be in the old Fury of the Wild (maintaining Horizon Walker trance charges as a Dex 2h build like thief acrobat really sucks)
If possible give Cleave/Great Cleave and Whirlwind attack +1 critical threat range per 100% strikethrough (tempest players want buffs, let them benefit.)

Give future 2handed weapons an extra effect slot and augment slot to make up for the loss of an offhand item like what started being done with caster weapons getting +2 exceptional DCs, doesn't matter if it's just some bonus fort bypass - just there needs to be something to make the loss in slots used less punishing.

Change the 2handed sunder animation for something less horrendously delayed - especially quarterstaff.

I agree with every here

 

[l_remmie]

Thf has one big upside...

You only have to do all the work for 1 weapon.

 

[Ventrul]

A suggestion for Warlocks:

• Right now, this class only has one Imbue Toggle — Spiritual Retribution. Please adjust it to scale with 100% or 50% spell power; most other classes’ imbue toggles scale with either Melee or Ranged Power.
• Add another Imbue Toggle for Warlocks, or adjust one of the existing ones so it can be used by them.

I hope you consider this carefully. Thank you for your time.

 

[Terpilar]

A suggestion for Warlocks:

• Right now, this class only has one Imbue Toggle — Spiritual Retribution. Please adjust it to scale with 100% or 50% spell power; most other classes’ imbue toggles scale with either Melee or Ranged Power.

ES imbue already does scale with 100% light power, so what do you mean ?

 

[Qrvar]

For Tempest in particular it's far too much of nothing. Paladin spells work and are desirable because they're buffs. My bet is that most don't even notice that it also has DC spells, which (like Tempest's) do absolutely nothing at all. It would be nice if SSG applied that lesson to hybrids. Either make the DC spells useful or make SURE hybrids have valuable useful buffs. Otherwise, it ends up like Tempest -- a half-caster class (or third-caster) that effectively has no spells.

This applies to all rangers not just Tempest. Rangers in general are long overdue for a spell pass.

If we go by 3e approach, a lot of druid spells should also be in the ranger spellbook but aren't. If we go by 5e, rangers should be getting a lot more unique spells, not the least things like Hunter's Mark (not to be confused with whatever HW got).

 

[Wini]

So many ideas in this thread...

Balance is a mess, this won't work unless they touch everything at the same time.

 

[YTSESoldier]

With the enemy AC creep I would like to see a DEX and INT trances with + to hit. T5 warchanter is WAY to expensive. Swashbuckler and Tempest trees are very outdated and not viable as main trees. Deepwood has become a splash tree as it was originally ranged OR melee but is subpar as far as ranged and did not get competence hp for melee when they did away with EDF. Harper agent still sucks and rarely gets more than 13 points. Drow racial tree is still meh and outdated. Vanguard will probably still need some more love in the form of MP or another 5% attack speed in capstone, and T5 is too expensive…but I will still TR into one when this goes live because I like me some sword and board.
warlocks need more dps without having to invest 4 sun/moon slots to dice.
For everyone complaining about DL being OP, i see it as a good tree for first/low life toons, leveling and multiclassing, endgame dps of Barb is still >>.

 

[l_remmie]

If couple of builds are always OP the solution is not to nerf those it is to make all other builds atleast somewhat playable.

It is a lot easier, cost effective and less risk to tone down a few overperforming builds than buff dozens of others. Its good design to do that first in very modest increments.

Monthly small balance adjustments of a few digit changes , like an action point here and a 5% there should always be done as game maintenance.
They did that for a couple years with Tonquin listening to players and fixing tiny bugs and adjusting some small numbers.

Now we just have big new OP builds with lots of bugs on release to sell quickly. And that is that.

Balancing things is hard to monetize...

 

[l_remmie]

You dont need to have perfect balance, you need a world where all your designs have a place and reason to exist. if sometging is unique or simply a lot of fun it doesnt need to be actually that good.
The MTG timmies and johnies also inhabit DDO

Being original and making things fun costs a lot of effort though. Much more than just making numbers bigger.

 

[waxinglyrical]

So many ideas in this thread...

Balance is a mess, this won't work unless they touch everything at the same time.

a touch of perpetual labyrinthitis with the deck receiving a light reshuffle

 

[Qrvar]

Deepwood has become a splash tree as it was originally ranged OR melee but is subpar as far as ranged

Depending on what you compare it to. Vs Arcane Archer? DWS is the better tree for T5 and AA is a deep splash at best (though HW is a thing too and can easily replace most of what AA has to offer).

But then paladin's KotC is a better ranged tree than anything ranger has to offer as a class.

 

[paddymaxson]

I still think enlightened spirit could do with a little bit more love than 2 tier 5 enhancements being cheaper. Doesn't really address the issues with the tree.

 

[Shao Kahn]

if you are buffing the cleaves. could you update supreme cleave in the frenzied berserker tree?

Currently its
Tactical Melee Cleave: Deals +10%/+20%/+30% Damage. Attack enemies all around you. (Activation Cost: 10 Hit Points. Cooldown: 9/6/3 seconds)

Could be changed to
Tactical Melee Cleave: Deals +25%/+50%/+100% Damage. +1 Threat range +2 Critical Multiplier Bonus. Attack enemies all around you. (Activation Cost: 15/30/50 Hit Points. Cooldown: 9/6/3 seconds)

which you could then change the Blood trail ability in the same tree to be
Supreme Cleave costs 10/20/30 fewer hitpoints to activate.

Also tantrum too. It's VERY lackluster and in need of a boost.

 

[Bjond]

I still think enlightened spirit could do with a little bit more love than 2 tier 5 enhancements being cheaper. Doesn't really address the issues

Just "a little"!?

ES T5 is completely worthless; it has no 25% HP node and no critical multiplier node (for the melee'ish tanks) and no useful DPS for the spell tanks -- an extra unscaled 4d6 is pathetic. Even Shining Through is too small to bother buying (maybe 700 HP every 30s?). I get more from Guard-Up in the US tree every 12s and phenomenally more from rage/scream+blood feast with no CD (actually about 3s due to UI GCD).

Capstone for 20% HP is not the right place, too. The tree as a whole is so bad that 41 points in it is 10~20 wasted AP, which leaves not enough for fixing things via other trees.

Displacement used to be a big draw, but due to reaper nerfs it's become just "oh, nice" and then only if you don't have to work for it but get it as a passive on the way to nicer things.

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I'd update it with scaling for the aura on 2xmelee OR spell power, give T5 crit+HP, scale the buttons (on both melee or spell), and add some new aura features (like tentacles). Having tentacles randomly spring up on stuff you're tanking would be fun.

Warlock is also ripe for a 5e'ish hexblade pass. ES could be polished up with ideas from that.

 

[VinoeWhines]

Change the animation-time from Disabling Traps speed, to the speed of switching item/weapon speed.
The animation is too slow and others just bypass it.
You get people just "Winging" over it and the one disabling the trap is left, like everyone got up from the table and your left with the bill.

Outfit/Robe switching animation is fine. Heavy armor switching speed is fine.
Medium armor should be half that speed and Light armor should be half of Medium armor speed.


Some of the Tier IV's in Epic Destinies would do well to be in Tier III's, so that when devs finally release the ability to pick a 4th Tree, it would make it possible to take meaningful Tier III's, in Epic Destinies to match what was available from previous Epic Destiny choices, that were promised, we would have more of("Choices").

 

[Hobgoblin]

I only disagree with armor speed. none for heavy what it is now med and half for light

 

[VinoeWhines]

What sucks is to switch to an armor your not (normally) wearing before entering with group at entrance, just to be able to use an armors "clicky" for the buff and then entering quest; (the Server has to recalculate "All the bonus'" to HP, Stats, effects) when switching to your preferred armor just so that your not waiting in the penalty box to switch back, while others are "off to the speed races" while your waiting to move again after armor switching time kicks in.