Lamannia Update 68 Preview 2 - Wild Mage Archetype

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Shao Kahn

Active member
Warlock/Wild Mage is a crappy combo. Going from Warlock 20 to level 16 or 17 loses too much: 30% spell crit dmg, 5% spell crit chance, EB+pact dice, and whatever else you need to give up in Soul Eater to fuel the AP costs in Wild Mage tree. Nothing in Wild Mage comes close to closing that power gap.

The opposite doesn't work at all (16-17 Wild Mage/3-4 Warlock) because Eldritch Blast progression is gained when Warlock levels are taken. If Acolyte of the Skin EB feats were made to work like the Monk form feats, where you could purchase them independent of the Monk levels you have, then there might be something with 18 Wild Mage/2 Warlock that leans on Eldritch Blast. But that doesn't exist today,
You can also do FvS with Wild Mage since they can use WIS or CHA as their spell casting stat. Also the EB+pact die you would lose is minor. 5% spell crit chance lose you would get from SE is also minor. The only thing that is somewhat of significance would be the 30% spell crit damage and some of it can be negated by wild mage. Never said the combo would be great. Was just using it as an example that there are classes that can synergize with Wild Mage due to them sharing the same spell casting stat.
 
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misterski

Well-known member
I was thinking Stormsinger 16/WM 4 might be interesting on the iconic with lightning strip but that’s about the best I can think of so far.

Losing level 9 spells is a non starter to me for any class.
Bards/Stormsingers only get up to level 6 spells. They get 2 level 6 spell slots at level 16 so that could still work.
 

Scrag

Well-known member
AotS gets a huge chunk of damage from pact dice that you don't need to have warlock levels to get...
 

rabidfox

The People's Champion
AotS gets a huge chunk of damage from pact dice that you don't need to have warlock levels to get...
Except you can't splash less than 12 AotS without losing about 30%-50% of your blast/pact damage in epics because https://ddowiki.com/page/Epic_Eldritch_Blast & https://ddowiki.com/page/Epic_Pact_Dice both require 12 AotS. They need to be changed to require 12 warlock or Ultimate Pact Attunement feat so AotS can multiclass effectively. Wild mage splits with AotS would be interesting if not for that current limitation.
 

DBZ

Well-known member
Another scam level iconic to sell hearts they gave stripping to dls for free you want it on a caster you can pay hearts

And you don't even get a good stat for them lol
 

Xezon

Well-known member
I retested this in the same fashion as the first preview. I love all the additions. Getting to use the prismatic spells and have them be both reliable and powerful is amazing. It seems like the tree is in a pretty good place in my opinion. There are, however, some functional issues that really do need to be addressed before launch.



1) Caster Levels from the core points are not increasing caster level or max caster level as they are supposed to (at least with the Chaos spells, so assuming the same with any spells. This is not just the power in chaos point that's not functioning, it's all the caster level boost points.

2) Tides of Chaos 3 is not raising the chaos spell crit chance according to the spell power tab.

3) The spell Wildstrike does not accept Empower/Maximize/Intensify. As a damaging spell, it certainly should, especially now that it has a spell book version (not to mention that the color sprays even do now that the point that adds chaos damage to them exists).

4) Channel Entropy's function is still very poor. It does not hit enemies even semi-reliably. Most of the time you cast it, you get the ground effect lights and it does absolutely nothing. Considering that it's your capstone, and the most powerful Chaos spell in the game right now, it's vital that this one be fixed and functioning before release or anything past heroics is going to be a slog trying to clear with the wonky chaos sphere.

Overall, things feel even better than in the first preview and are feeling like a viable tree now. Once these four things are fixed I'm highly confident that it will be a pretty good Archtype to play. Give it a good polish and function fix pass and imo it's release ready.
 

Shao Kahn

Active member
Another scam level iconic to sell hearts they gave stripping to dls for free you want it on a caster you can pay hearts

And you don't even get a good stat for them lol
They get +2 bonus to dex lol. That got me rolling xD
 
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Cruxader

New member
Posting on behalf of Steelstar:

Hey, everyone! Welcome to your second look at the Wild Mage Archetype! There was a lot of good feedback given in Preview 1, and many of the changes we've made for Preview 2 were directly taken from player feedback. We've also fixed quite a few bugs.

Check out the change list below, and the updated full look at the Archetype below that!

Changes from Preview 1:
  • The description of the Wild Magic feat that Wild Mages get at level 1 has been updated to clarify that it grants a base 5% chance to incur a Wild Surge when spellcasting, and also that it grants you Wild Surges over time if you aren't casting spells.
  • Fixed Wild Mage to properly get granted the Water Savant tree.
  • Chance to gain a Wild Surge on Spellcast has been fixed to work as described. (Gaining Surges on casting spells was not working in Preview 1. This should lead to significantly more surges in gameplay.)
  • Entropic Energy, Channel Entropy, and all ranks/tiers of Student of Chaos each now grant +1% Spell Critical Damage with all spells in addition to their existing effects.
  • Unpredictable Consequences now also includes Chaos Hammer in its list of included spells.
  • Unpredictable Consequences' effects no longer have saving throws, which should resolve situations in Preview 1 where some spells without Saving Throws looked like they had them.
  • Fixed the tooltip for SLA Chaos Orb to correctly state the spell's damage (1d6+3 per Caster Level)
  • Greater Color Spray has been added to the Wild Mage spellbook as a Level 5 spell.
  • Wildstrike has been added to the Wild Mage spellbook as a Level 5 spell.
  • Wildstrike has had its damage adjusted 1d6+10 per Caster Level.
  • Wildstrike's max caster level is now 10.
  • Prismatic Strike has been added to the Wild Mage spellbook as a level 6 spell.
  • The Core abilities that grant Caster Levels with Chaos Spells now work. (Chaos spells are Chaos Bolt, Chaos Sphere, Wildstrike, Channel Entropy, Color Spray, Greater Color Spray, Prismatic Ray, Prismatic Strike, and Prismatic Spray).
  • Chaotic Mind has been removed.
  • Lucky Dodge has moved into T2 where Chaotic Mind was.
  • Chaos Control I has moved into T1 where Lucky Dodge was.
  • Chaos Control II has moved into T2 where Chaos Control I was.
  • Power in Chaos has moved horizontally to where Chaos Control II was.
  • Power in Chaos has changed to "Toggle: You gain +2 Caster Level and Max Caster Level with all spells, but are able to receive Very Bad and Bad Surges even if you have Chaos Control I or II."
  • NEW Tier 3 Enhancement: Prismatic Mind:
    • Rank 1: Color Spray now deals 1d6 Chaos Damage per Caster Level in addition to its other effects. A successful Will save reduces this damage by half.
    • Rank 2: Greater Color Spray and Prismatic Ray now deal 1d6 Chaos Damage per Caster Level in addition to its other damage and effects. A successful Will save reduces this damage by half.
    • Rank 3: Prismatic Strike now deals 1d6 Chaos Damage per Caster Level in addition to its other damage and effects. A successful Will save reduces this damage by half.
      • Also, Prismatic Spray now deals 1d6 Chaos Damage per Caster Level to all targets in addition to its other damage and effects. A successful Will save reduces this damage by half.
  • Changed Mixed Magics to "Your Caster Level with spells is now equal to your Character Level instead of individual class levels (max 20). This does not change the caster level of Rune Arms, Wands, Scrolls, or other Items." It now works as described.
  • Action Boost: Wild Magic and Rapid Surge now each grant Wild Surge Luck Bonuses, which increase your odds of getting a better Surge, in addition to their existing effects.
  • Maximize, Empower, and Intensify now apply to Color Spray and Greater Color Spray.
  • Chaos Bolt, Chaos Sphere, Chaos Hammer, Wildstrike, Channel Entropy, Color Spray, Prismatic Strike, Prismatic Ray, and Prismatic Spray now count as Chaos spells.
  • Shiradi Champion's Cores, Wild Magics, Fey Form, and Feywild Attunement now grant Chaos Spell Power in addition to their other effects.
  • NEW Epic Feat: Master of Chaos: Your Chaos Bolt, Chaos Sphere, and Wildstrike spells gain +10 to their Maximum Caster Level. Grants +140 Maximum Spell Points.
  • The Destiny feat "Epic Spell Power: Light" has been renamed "Epic Spell Power; Light and Alignment" and now reads "+20 Light and Alignment Spell Power, +10% Light and Alignment Spell Crit Damage, +5% Universal Spell Crit Damage". Please note that it already had this updated functionality, the only change is to the text to make it reflect the existing functionality.
Class Trees:

  • NEW: Wild Mage
  • Fire Savant
  • Water Savant
  • Air Savant
  • Earth Savant
Changes vs. Base Sorcerer:

  • You gain the Wild Mage feat at level 1
  • Eldritch Knight Tree is replaced with Wild Mage tree
  • Spell List:
    • You have access to Chaos Bolt (new) as a level 1 Sorcerer Spell
    • You have access to Chaos Ball (new) as a level 3 Sorcerer Spell
    • You have access to Chaos Hammer as a level 4 Sorcerer Spell
    • You have access to Wildstrike (new) as a level 5 Sorcerer Spell
    • You have access to Prismatic Strike as a level 6 Sorcerer Spell
New Feats:

  • Wild Mage:
    • Automatically granted at Wild Mage 1
    • When you cast spells, you have a small chance to have additional strange effects occur around you. These effects very greatly from helpful, dangerous to just silly. Grants a +5% chance of gaining a Wild Surge every time you cast a spell. Wild Surges will also manifest over time passively. Wild Surges do not occur in public spaces.
Unless specifically listed, assume the class is otherwise identical to Sorcerer.

Wild Mage Tree

  • Cores
    • Core 1: Determination
      • +1 Will Saving Throw
      • +10 Chaos Spell Power. (Chaos Spell Power is part of Alignment Spell Power).
    • Core 2: Boldness
      • +1 Caster Level with Chaos Spells
      • +10 Chaos Spell Power
      • +10 Universal Spell Power
    • Core 3: Riches of Randomness:
      • Once per Rest, target an unopened chest and twist fate for a chance at better rewards for the entire party. Chests can only be improved in this way one time, and there is a chance of failure based on your Charisma. (There is no special drawback on failure.) Some chests cannot be improved in this manner. This effect does not stack with Treasure Finding from the Greater Dragonmark of Finding.
      • +10 Chaos Spell Power
    • Core 4: Entropic Energy
      • You gain +1 Caster Level and Max Caster Level when casting any spell.
      • +10 Chaos Spell Power, +10 Universal Spell Power, +1% chance of incurring a Wild Magic Surge when casting a spell, +1% Spell Critical Damage with all spells. You may use Riches of Randomness one additional time per Rest.
    • Core 5: Reject Limits
      • +1 Caster Level and Max Caster Level with all Spells. +10 Chaos Spell Power, +10 Universal Spell Power.
    • Core 6: Channel Entropy
      • SLA: A field of chaotic energy strikes the target and nearby enemies, dealing 19 to 24 Chaos damage per caster level (max 380 to 480). A successful Will save reduces the damage by half. D&D Dice: Deals 1d6+18 Chaos damage per caster level, max caster level 20.
      • +4 CHA, +10 Chaos Spell Power, +10 Universal Spell Power, +1% chance of incurring a Wild Magic Surge when casting a spell,+1% Spell Critical Damage with all spells. You may use Riches of Randomness one additional time per Rest.
  • Tier 1
    • SLA: Chaos Bolt: Fires a small orb of Chaos at a target, doing 1d6+2 Chaos Damage per caster level (max 10d6+20 at caster level 10).
    • Chaos Control I: If you would get a Very Bad Wild Magic Surge, you get a Bad Surge instead. (this has moved to Tier 1).
    • Student of Chaos I: +1/2/3% chance of incurring a Wild Magic Surge when casting a spell and +1/2/3% Spell Critical Damage with all spells.
    • Tides of Chaos I: Once per minute, you gain a +1/2/3 bonus to one of Reflex, Fortitude, or Will Saving Throws for one minute.
    • Skills: +1/2/3 Spellcraft, Concentration, and Bluff.
  • Tier 2
    • Action Boost: Wild Magic: For the next 20 seconds, your chances of getting a Wild Magic Surge are improved by 5/10/15%. This also grants a +5/10/15 Wild Surge Luck Bonus increasing the chances of a positive surge result.
    • Chaos Control II: If you would get a Very Bad or Bad Wild Magic Surge, you get a Neutral one instead. (requires Chaos Control I). (this has moved to Tier 2).
    • Student of Chaos II: +1/2/3% chance of incurring a Wild Magic Surge when casting a spell and +1/2/3% Spell Critical Damage with all spells.
    • Tides of Chaos II: Once per minute, when you incur a Wild Magic Surge, you gain a defensive buff that scales with Wild Mage level.
      • (This is likely a modified version of the Dreamscape buff list)
    • Lucky Dodge: +1/2/3 Dodge while wearing no armor. Rank 3: While wearing no armor, you gain +1d6 Dodge Cap. The die is rerolled once per minute. (this has moved to Tier 2).
  • Tier 3
    • SLA: Chaos Sphere: Launches a chaotic orb that explodes on impact, dealing 1d6+3 Chaos Damage per caster level (up to a max of 10d6 Chaos Damage at caster level 10) to targets in the area. A successful Will save reduces the damage by half. This SLA uses the highest of your INT, WIS, and CHA in its DC calculation, and uses the higher of your Evocation and Conjuration DCs for its spell school.
    • Power in Chaos: Toggle: You gain +2 Caster Level and Max Caster Level with all spells, but you are able to receive Very Bad and Bad Surges even if you have Chaos Control I or II. (this has shifted horizontally in the tree.) (Known Issue: The CL/MCL boost is not working in this preview.)
    • Student of Chaos III: +1/2/3% chance of incurring a Wild Magic Surge when casting a spell and +1/2/3% Spell Critical Damage with all spells.
    • Prismatic Mind:
      • Rank 1: Color Spray now deals 1d6 Chaos Damage per Caster Level in addition to its other effects. A successful Will save reduces this damage by half.
      • Rank 2: Color Spray, Greater Color Spray, and Prismatic Ray now deal 1d6 Chaos Damage per Caster Level in addition to their other effects. A successful Will save reduces this damage by half.
      • Rank 3: Color Spray, Greater Color Spray, Prismatic Ray, Prismatic Strike, and Prismatic Spray now deal 1d6 Chaos Damage per Caster Level in addition to their other effects. A successful Will save reduces this damage by half.
      • (Known Issue: Stub icon. Working on a real one.)
    • Ability Score: Multiselector:
      • INT
      • WIS
      • CHA
  • Tier 4
    • Unpredictable Consequences: Your Chaos Bolt, Chaos Sphere, Chaos Hammer, and Channel Entropy spells and SLAs now add additional damage, debuff, or crowd control effects when cast. If the target saves for half damage on Chaos Sphere, the additional effects are negated.
    • Multiselector:
      • Unstable Sorcery: While wearing no armor, you gain 2% Spell Critical Damage.
      • Mixed Magics: Your Caster Level with spells is now equal to your Character Level instead of individual class levels (max 20). This does not change the caster level of Rune Arms, Wands, Scrolls, or other Items. (Known Issue: The limit of 20 is not working in this preview.)
    • Student of Chaos IV: +1/2/3% chance of incurring a Wild Magic Surge when casting a spell and +1/2/3% Spell Critical Damage with all spells. Once per minute, when you incur a Wild Magic Surge, gain (one from a list of buffs).
    • Tides of Chaos III: +2/4/6% Chaos Spell Crit Chance.
    • Ability Score: Multiselector:
      • INT
      • WIS
      • CHA
  • Tier 5
    • SLA: Wildstrike: Surround target adversary with rainbows, dealing dealing 1d6+10 Chaos Damage per caster level (Maximum damage 10d6+100). They take a random (but powerful) effect, and every 2 seconds, they take another random effect. A successful Will save reduces the damage by half and negates the additional effects. This SLA uses the highest of your INT, WIS, and CHA in its DC calculation, and uses the higher of your Evocation and Conjuration DCs for its spell school.
    • Bend Luck: You gain Bend Luck: Whenever you fail a Saving Throw, you reroll that Saving Throw and take the second result. This stacks with Slippery Mind, but does not stack with other sources of Bend Luck.
    • Rapid Surge: Active: Trigger a short session where you get a lot of surges very quickly. This also grants a +15 Wild Surge Luck Bonus increasing the chances of a positive surge result.
    • Random Deflector: While wearing no armor, you gain +1d100 MRR Cap. This die is rerolled once per minute.
    • Tides of Chaos IV: -2 to all Spell DCs. Whenever you cast a spell with a DC, you gain +1d6 to the DC of that spell.
Past Life: (Known Issue: Not Functional In This Preview):
You were a Wild Mage in a past life. Strong magic surrounds you. Each time you acquire this feat you gain +3 Universal Spell Power. This feat can be stacked up to three times.
If the theme of wild mage is to encourage some fun, diversity of casting styles, multi-classing, with a bit of creativity and uncertainty, then the Mixer of Magics is on the right fundamental track, However it should then be supported by allowing for the highest of Caster stats to therefore fulfill this theme, i.e allow for Wisdom (cleric, druid) to multi-class with the other caster stats as well (Char and Int) to allow highest caster stat to determine DC, then you would have a fulfilled its multi-classing "diversity of builds" creativity potential without making it a balance issue.
 

Edrein

Well-known member
If the theme of wild mage is to encourage some fun, diversity of casting styles, multi-classing, with a bit of creativity and uncertainty, then the Mixer of Magics is on the right fundamental track, However it should then be supported by allowing for the highest of Caster stats to therefore fulfill this theme, i.e allow for Wisdom (cleric, druid) to multi-class with the other caster stats as well (Char and Int) to allow highest caster stat to determine DC, then you would have a fulfilled its multi-classing "diversity of builds" creativity potential without making it a balance issue.
I kind of wish it also included Str/Dex -if- casting while Wildshaped. Maybe then Eladrin would have some value with that dex and lean into their druidic theme. ?
 

SpardaX

Well-known member
If Acolyte of the Skin EB feats were made to work like the Monk form feats, where you could purchase them independent of the Monk levels you have, then there might be something with 18 Wild Mage/2 Warlock that leans on Eldritch Blast. But that doesn't exist today,.
Im not sure I understand precisely what you're saying here. Because this IS how it works.
You can be a 1 Acolyte / 19 Sorcerer and pick up all your EB dice at levels 6, 12, and 18. The downside, is that you need at least 12 levels of Warlock to take the epic feats. Which is why Iv been asking and asking over and over since Acolyte came out, to please tie the epic feats to 12 levels of Warlock OR the level 12 Greater Pact or or level 18 Ultimate Pact feats. Then you could actually BE a 19 Sorcerer / 1 Acolyte and go all the way up to cap using a fully scaling EB. But no one answers or even acknowledges my requests, and it hasnt happened, so clearly the answer at this point, is no.
 
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EvilDragon

Well-known member
I am happy to see (and it's funny to see) that people realised there is no actual broken build with WM. Shared Caster Level is an illusion.
 

Tilomere

Well-known member
Another scam level iconic to sell hearts they gave stripping to dls for free you want it on a caster you can pay hearts

And you don't even get a good stat for them lol
Sorcs are so powerful you have to give them a dex race, enhancement tree that self-CCs, take away their defensive tree, and give them a racial tree that gives them bypass they already have, in order for them to be balanced.

What is really needed is to lay down the law with sorc nerfs, then this will all come together. Take away passive immunity core 6 bypass, and also maybe chip some defenses away by reducing extend to just 1.5x distance, and take away some DC favoritism by increasing instant kill cooldowns 5% per skull, and then this will all come together.

Think how happy everyone will be to get bypass in the iconic if the base class didn't have it passively. Plus it will add pacing, and push another instant kill button off the primary toolbar for bypass, making everything more well-rounded.
 
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Shao Kahn

Active member
Then that'll restrict players to play only one or two races for bypass immunity in order to make the class playable. Umm no thank you.
 

erethizon1

Well-known member
Unlike most past life bonuses, spell power does not scale very well with level. I would increase the spell power bonus to either 5 or 10 per life, or perhaps something akin to what you did with martial past lives with AC where you get 3, 5, or 10 spell power per life for every 10 levels you have.
 

Tilomere

Well-known member
Then that'll restrict players to play only one or two races for bypass immunity in order to make the class playable. Umm no thank you.
Currently everyone plays dragonborn. If we remove immunity bypass passive in Core 6 you can pick max DCs and caster levels race, fire limited bypass spell crit multiplier race, or full bypass maybe you stun yourself race.

If bypass immunity was a requirement, wizards/fvs/clerics/bards wouldn't be viable.
 

LuKaSu

New member
So, if I'm understanding this correctly, the shared level thing primarily seems to be beneficial for an 18 Sorc / 2 FvS build with the healing SLA, yeah?

Is there anything else that caster level really will help significantly?

(Don't get me wrong, I'm not disappointed in this at all! I'm really looking forward to that particular build. I was just wondering what other synergy I'm missing here.)
 
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