Lominal's R10 and Raid build repository

[mikarddo]

What would the AP split look like? 41 inq 7 FI 22Kotc rest BE?

41 Inq, 23-24 be, 6-8 KotC (trance), 7 Fey (cha to dmg and hit) and 4 ravager (action boosts) would be mine. (Edited).

I consider BE to be the better tree. T4 10% DS and 3 imbue dice is strong and so is the T3 AoE. If others think otherwise I am interested to learn

 

[woq]

41 Inq, 23 be, 6 KotC (trance), 7 Fey and 6 vkf (Deflect Arrows) would be mine. If you dont have enough ap drop vkf.

I consider BE to be the better tree. T4 10% DS and 3 imbue dice is strong and so is the T3 AoE. If others think otherwise I am interested to learn

if you don't put points into ravager for action boosts, then its better to take 2 monk levels instead of dragon lord levels and pick up deflect arrow feat there, drop vistani and put those into kotc or be [or] drop dl levels and put those into dh for cheap sneaks and an extra FE and some hp

 

[mikarddo]

if you don't put points into ravager for action boosts, then its better to take 2 monk levels instead of dragon lord levels and pick up deflect arrow feat there, drop vistani and put those into kotc or be [or] drop dl levels and put those into dh for cheap sneaks and an extra FE and some hp

You are so very right. I got caught up in having just enough points for Vistani and forgot about Ravager

That might teach me not to post too early in the morning .... nah, who am I kidding.

Editing post above, thanks.

 

[Lominal]

Interesting. I thought the speed advantage of the light xbow was nullified by the speed cap at cap. How come light are now better?

The speed cap only applies under NHB. Its a fairly significant difference (10% more) without NHB, and enough that it makes light on par with heavy when they both have NHB (+ downtime between).

 

[mikarddo]

I took a closer look at the gear setup for the INQ.

I think you can make a case for the following alternative setup:
Chill: Armor + Trinket (bloody rare drop though but I got lucky)
MD: Helm + Cloak + Belt + Goggles + Greaves + Raid Neck + Undying Xbow
Sora Kell: 2x Rings + Gloves ( really odd with the same ring twice, but rings are just a weak spot with no sun/moon augment)
Viper: Bracers
IoD: Runearm

Pro: 15% HP, 3% DS, 5 RP, 3 Imbue, Tendon Slice, Enh Ghostly, 15 heal amp
Con: Sonic Absorb, Ins PRR, Q Deadly, Art SA, Art Seeker, Q Deception, FoM

Its entirely possible I overlooked something

 

[PanasOfArgonessen]

Thanks a lot for the builds. I would like to ask about the end stats of the inquisitive build, doubleshot and ranged power. How does it compare to 14/4/2 pld/art/dh?

 

[Vertigo]

Thanks a lot for the builds. I would like to ask about the end stats of the inquisitive build, doubleshot and ranged power. How does it compare to 14/4/2 pld/art/dh?

Wis 13-5-2: 41-28-11-1-1
13d6 SA
3 dmg
13 RP
0 DS
3 imbue
3 FE
+6 wis
Birdstrike stun, single target.
10 fortbypass, 30% helpless, 5% HP, 15 hamp, twf(hp) no 0 AB
113% Movement speed.

Buffs pressed: 1.*
*not counting universal buffs i.e. potions, good hope clickys etc

Int 13-6-1 -- 41-23-7-11
10d6 SA
1 dmg
10 RP
15 DS
7 imbue
1 FE
+1 int
10 fortbypass
3 Action boosts
123% Movement speed.

buffs pressed: 0

Cha (the 14-4-2 build) 41-27-8-6
0 SA
3 dmg
30/40 RP
25 DS
0 imbue
+5 cha (includes racial bonus compared to int-wis that are both 4 so +1)
15/15 mmr/prr
3 Action Boosts
insane saves
100% Movement S. -- can be offset somewhat by tabaxi instead of Aas, but that doesnt work at all in even somewhat decent
groups while questing)

buffs pressed: 5

 

[Spook]

I would be interested in seeing what a modern day debuffer looks like - been a while since I ran one at end game so im out of the loop

 

[SpartanKiller13]

I would be interested in seeing what a modern day debuffer looks like - been a while since I ran one at end game so im out of the loop

Not sure they've changed recently, depends on when ya saw one last XD there are more gearing options but like a LGS stick applies the same Dust as a Dino etc.

Rabidfox's still looks good to me:

https://forums.ddo.com/index.php?threads/warlock-1st-life-debuffer-build-and-no-raid-gear-set-for-fire-fiend-aots-builds-as-of-u67.10851/

I imagine if you have racial AP best debuffing is Razorclaw, howl for -14 AC as well (Beasthide +PRR/MRR party howl is likely better for raiding but the debuff isn't lol).

Otherwise, the general sliding scale for debuffer builds is "how many debuffs do I bring" vs "how useless am I outside the debuffs" - like /2 Warlock was common for a hot minute, easy -10 PRR/MRR for pretty cheap. EA Turn stuff is easy to grab on any build in that tree (for a bit of healing or wings usually). IMO the ideal is coordinating among your group to overlap less (6 people with Dust is about 4 too many lol), but that's dependant on having mostly the same people for most of what you're running. Bringing a full Warlock 20 debuff machine is a lot less impressive when one of your regulars is on a /2 Warlock and in EA already, and your TWF buddy is running Dust/Ooze/Shattered Device etc etc.

 

[Spook]

Not sure they've changed recently, depends on when ya saw one last XD there are more gearing options but like a LGS stick applies the same Dust as a Dino etc.

Rabidfox's still looks good to me:

https://forums.ddo.com/index.php?threads/warlock-1st-life-debuffer-build-and-no-raid-gear-set-for-fire-fiend-aots-builds-as-of-u67.10851/

I imagine if you have racial AP best debuffing is Razorclaw, howl for -14 AC as well (Beasthide +PRR/MRR party howl is likely better for raiding but the debuff isn't lol).

Otherwise, the general sliding scale for debuffer builds is "how many debuffs do I bring" vs "how useless am I outside the debuffs" - like /2 Warlock was common for a hot minute, easy -10 PRR/MRR for pretty cheap. EA Turn stuff is easy to grab on any build in that tree (for a bit of healing or wings usually). IMO the ideal is coordinating among your group to overlap less (6 people with Dust is about 4 too many lol), but that's dependant on having mostly the same people for most of what you're running. Bringing a full Warlock 20 debuff machine is a lot less impressive when one of your regulars is on a /2 Warlock and in EA already, and your TWF buddy is running Dust/Ooze/Shattered Device etc etc.

I love Rabidfox's build and really shows how far you can push a first lifer but this is not what I was looking for. The debuffer changes with the meta and tries to cram in as many non common debuffs as possible. For example before the monk revamp it was common for a debuffer to go 3 monk for Jade Strike as melee monks werent all that common in push raids - not sure this is needed anymore unless all monks switch to Str based. To give an idea the last debuffer I liked was something like 15 alch 3 monk 2 warlock.

 

[Guntango]

15 alch 3 monk 2 warlock

Yeeeup. One of my favorite builds. I'm currently on a ranged version.

 

[Spook]

@Lominal you take magical training on the bard (healer) build but then take magical studies tier 3 which grants magical training for free so Im not sure why that feat was taken?

Yeeeup. One of my favorite builds. I'm currently on a ranged version.

Sounds interesting. What did you swap for monk? and when can we expect a Lominal style writeup for it ?

 

[Vertigo]

I love Rabidfox's build and really shows how far you can push a first lifer but this is not what I was looking for. The debuffer changes with the meta and tries to cram in as many non common debuffs as possible. For example before the monk revamp it was common for a debuffer to go 3 monk for Jade Strike as melee monks werent all that common in push raids - not sure this is needed anymore unless all monks switch to Str based. To give an idea the last debuffer I liked was something like 15 alch 3 monk 2 warlock.

I suspect you actually need the Wisdom to land the Jade on anything hard these days. not sure when they changed that cause in the past you didnt need it for 10% buff! but they did. I tried out a 14 pal, 2wrl, 4mnk build not that long ago idea was going TWF that didnt stink too much on an individual level and still could push out debuffs and buffs. Build wasn´t that bad, but couldnt land Jades on other then like ship cannon.

 

[Guntango]

@Lominal you take magical training on the bard (healer) build but then take magical studies tier 3 which grants magical training for free so Im not sure why that feat was taken?


Sounds interesting. What did you swap for monk? and when can we expect a Lominal style writeup for it ?

If anyone would provide a doctoral-level analysis of how and why, Lomi's your guy.

The build I'm on was specifically designed to cover debuffs that weren't covered multiple times in a group built to run an R10 raid. Monk was covered; this ranged debuffer covers alch and wl debuffs and bard buffs. It's fun, I'm sure other variations could better suit a different or more generic party makeup.

 

[Lominal]

@Lominal you take magical training on the bard (healer) build but then take magical studies tier 3 which grants magical training for free so Im not sure why that feat was taken?

The mental toughness line (3% crit cahnce + some spell pts) requires you to have the feat (trees wont qualify you since they can be reset).

I dont recall if I posted here or elsewhere, but my rationale for not posting a dedicated debuffer if for 99% of pugs it would be better to have things like a monk that has jade, lock with debuffs. If you wanted more info the general idea for debuffer is you want to bring things that wont typically be covered by dps. This would include things like:
- Jade (3 monk )
- Knock on the sky (2 Monk)
- Taint the Aura (2 lock)
- Caustic overload (9 alch)
- Warchanter t5 (5 bard)
- Crusade (epic destiny)
- Exhalted turning (epic destiny + pally/ Cleric levels ideally, can work without though)
- Turn the tide/Timestop (t5 ED's)
- Arti bubble (Arti, Dwarf dragonmark, Cleric protection domain)

You cannot get all of those on the same toon, so typically you'd tailor it to the raid group/raid

 

[woq]

You cannot get all of those on the same toon, so typically you'd tailor it to the raid group/raid

For generic puggy debuffer ideas to people looking here: heres 4 i've tested and felt "ok" with that can also do stuff alone or in questing, in order of personal preference from 1 to 4:

12 dl 6 monk 2 warlock:

Spoiler: specs

t3 shintao (jade, knock) t2 soul eater (taint, consume) t2 henshin (unbalancing strike); rest is optional.

more individualistic can be any race and use wraps - more group guy goes pdk cha based with goggles and longswords.
I like the selfish guy that goes wraps with t5 dragonlord and uses swap setup for double debuff snapshots, and change destiny depending on what the raid might need if needed, usually soloist generic melee setup (ld / sd / fury) is better for pugging, but you can also run the fate/magus>dc>ea type setups for more debuffs.
- pros: fun, fast, helpful guy: provides elemental sundering, good debuffs, decent damage, active playstyle, doesn't need a lot of lives to work for both questing and raiding cuz pumps jade strike dc from dragonlord/fighter feat stuff
- cons: melee, active playstyle and a lot of buttons. no alch/bard/cleric, has to pick between damage and tankiness, easy to get caught up in investing too much into individual damage choices and forgetting the proper debuffing and staying alive parts

12-13 arti 5-6 bard 2 warlock

Spoiler: specs

- t5 wc, t4 be, t2 soul eater, t2 harper, rest optional. Points are tight, best on racial comp gnome.
- Pros: very nice buffs including wc t5, bubble, pos energy infusion; does not-0 damage, theoretically good if you don't want too many ranged toons as can apply track & do debuffery things and applies consume from range if needed (lmao when do you not want many ranged does that happen hueeee) - one of the builds that doesn't feel too bad about being in fatesinger t5 (t5 fatesinger, t4 shiradi, t3/t4 shadowdancer works well and feels like a generic ranged toon really
- Cons: gnome, would like to be racial comp, repeater clunky: i ended up basically tumbling any time i wanted to apply consume to avoid the clunk. If you go for the uncommon epic destiny debuffs like Magus/EA, threat becomes a problem and individual performance plummets.

12 alch 6 arti 2 warlock

Spoiler: specs

^same as above, less buffs, applies alch debuffs. drops t5 wc for inquisitor tree - more race agnostic and better life/iconic life grinder thanks to alch speed pots.
- t5 inquis t4 be t2 soul eater t2 harper, if you want to fit in poisoned shot for poison stripping drop inquis capstone
- Pros: feels better than repeater mechanically, applies alch debuffs nobody wants to bring
- Cons: no wc buffs, no monk debuffs, bit of a "i pretend to debuff guys ok, i can change my epic destinies guys don't be mad" -toon

15 cleric 3 monk 2 warlock: prot domain, di, monk/warlock debuffs, use kamas.

Spoiler: specs

might see a pattern here... almost like there is something to 3 monk 2 warlock...
- pros: really neat package of cool stuff, very versatile utility, very versatile with destiny choices for debuffs/buffs depending on rest of the raid
- cons: kinda tough to get jade strike dc high enough and is the worst soloist/rxp farmer of the bunch and people assume you're a main healer from cleric icon, even though you can heal being main heal is too action intensive to also apply debuffs so you wanna pretend u cant heal and just sneak in heals when debuffs and buffs are up when nobody is paying attention, or play as a healer in r10 groups but unbind heals for raids. also robed cleric takes getting used to and feat selection is tricky.

All of the 4 above are fairly lenient on epic destiny choices: you can drop individual damage/tankiness/heals in favour of whatever the raid needs from your destinies and still do ok. It did get a bit costly on Platinum over time though - don't recommend doing it a whole lot.

For a "main debuffer" I still think something like a 15 alch 3 monk 2 warlock is likely the play: but those are *so awful* to play in anything but a static raid group and rely entirely on others and as such are disqualified. I'd like to add that I do not have a full/racial completionist, so this is all done on not-perfectly minmaxed characters while swapping from one build to the next on my main. I might feel differently if I had a full comp toon.

 

[Spook]

The mental toughness line (3% crit cahnce + some spell pts) requires you to have the feat (trees wont qualify you since they can be reset).

MT has a pre-req of bard 1 and IMT bard 7. You cannot take tier 3 in magical studies if you have taken the magical training feat.

For a "main debuffer" I still think something like a 15 alch 3 monk 2 warlock is likely the play: but those are *so awful* to play in anything but a static raid group and rely entirely on others and as such are disqualified.

I dont see the point in 3 monk for a pug debuffer currently as theres loads of monks in pug land these days since the revamp.

 

[woq]

I dont see the point in 3 monk for a pug debuffer currently as theres loads of monks in pug land these days since the revamp.

Because on those odd times there is no monk or they choose not to use jadestrike or they are shurimonks, it is the absolute best debuffs you're missing out on. But that is also why I have these other options despite of that, yes.

 

[Monkey_Archer]

For a "main debuffer" I still think something like a 15 alch 3 monk 2 warlock is likely the play: but those are *so awful* to play in anything but a static raid group and rely entirely on others and as such are disqualified. I'd like to add that I do not have a full/racial completionist, so this is all done on not-perfectly minmaxed characters while swapping from one build to the next on my main. I might feel differently if I had a full comp toon.

The variant I've been liking is 15 monk/3alc/2warlock. You only lose out on Caustic/Voltaic, but can build wisdom for qp/stun/falconry and play just like a weaker monk.

 

[Guntango]

The variant I've been liking is 15 monk/3alc/2warlock. You only lose out on Caustic/Voltaic, but can build wisdom for qp/stun/falconry and play just like a weaker monk.

Those missing buffs are big.