New Hypothetical Monk Tree: Hedonist

DaWiner

Member
Hello everyone!

I decided to create a hypothetical revamp of Ninja spy so that it could be a viable melee and ranged tree. However, I found that it was nearly impossible to make melee viable without making shuriken throwers completely OP. So, I decided to make a completely separate (hypothetical) tree that would use melee weapons, which then led to a hypothetical archetype (since that's the only way a new tree would be added). I posted a ninja spy cleanup here, which removes all the melee stuff from ninja spy. This tree, called Hedonist, would take over the mantle of 'all other melee ki weapons', such as kamas, shortswords, and anything else you could find yourself centered with (other than handwraps, quarterstaves, and shuriken).

Some flavor: A hedonist is someone who doesn't believe in a higher power. So, a hedonist monk finds peace knowing that their life has no inherent meaning. A hedonist is willing to take the life of anyone, and they view it as giving mercy to their victims. A hedonist does not try to protect themselves, or any allies. They do not attempt to constrain or shackle enemies, as that only worsens the futility of their opponent's actions. They only bring quick ends to those who want it.

This tree is centered around offense. Very little defense, no crowd control abilities. Only damage. There's really not much else to say, so here's the new tree!

Cores
  1. Harbinger of the Inevitable: Imbue toggle: Deal 1d6 force damage, scaling with 100% Melee Power. Apply one stack of "Weight of Powerlessness" on hit (max 10 stacks, all stacks fade after 10 seconds)
  2. Carry their Burden: Toggle. Every 3 seconds, all stacks of "Weight of Powerlessness" applied by you are removed from all enemies within 10m of you. When this happens, they take 1 force damage per character level (up to 20) per stack removed, scaling with 100% melee power
  3. Abandon Hope: Whenever Harbinger of the Inevitable removes a stack of "Weight of Powerlessness" from an enemy, that enemy loses 1 armor class. Stacks up to 10 times
  4. Solace in the Inescapable: +5 MP, +1 imbue die
  5. Strike at the Soul: Centered Weapons gain a +1 competence bonus to critical threat multiplier. You may now have 2 Carry On toggles active at the same time
  6. Flurry of Blades: Choose one:
    • +4 Dex, +1 imbue die. While centered, your maximum doublestrike is now 150%
    • +4 Wis, +1 imbue die. While centered, your maximum doublestrike is now 150%
    • +4 Int, +1 imbue die. While centered, your maximum doublestrike is now 150%
Tier 1:
  • (AP: 1, Ranks: 1): Carry On: Choose 1 of 4 toggles to modify your Carry their Burden. You can only have 1 toggle active at a time
    • Dismal Purpose: If an enemy dies within 1 second of taking damage via Carry their Burden, gain 20 temporary hit points (scaling with 100% melee power) for 12 seconds. Stacks up to 3 times
    • Hopelessness for All: When an enemy with "Weight of Powerlessness" stacks dies, transfer half of their stacks to a nearby enemy
    • Inflict Despair: For every stack of "Weight of Powerlessness" removed from an enemy via Carry their Burden, that enemy gains 1 stack of Despair (-1 MP, -1 RP, -2 SP). Stacks up to 10 times
    • Crippling Desperation: If 5 or more stacks of "Weight of Powerlessness" are removed from an enemy at once via Carry their Burden, that enemy's movement speed and attack speed are reduced by 50% for 6 seconds. Bosses are immune to this effect
  • (AP: 1, Ranks: 3): Subtlety: -20%/-30%/-40% threat generation with melee attacks.
  • (AP: 1, Ranks: 3): Nimble: +1/2/3 to saving throws vs traps
  • (AP: 1, Ranks: 3): Improved Dodge: +1/2/3% dodge
  • (AP: 1, Ranks: 3): Tranquility: +1/2/3 heal and concentration
Tier 2:
  • (AP: 1, Ranks: 1: Requires Previous Carry On): Carry On: Choose of the toggles not previously selected
  • (AP: 1, Ranks: 3): Swift Demise: +1/2/3 doublestrike
  • (AP: 2, Ranks: 1): Harness Energy: +1 imbue die
  • (AP: 1, Ranks: 1): Primordial Strike: Choose 1 of 4 Primordial attacks. Ki cost: 5, cooldown: 3 seconds
    • Erode Defenses: Rot ki melee attack: Apply 2-3 stacks of vulnerability
    • Induce Weakness: Poison ki melee attack: +30% damage. Targeted enemy has all their saves reduced by 3 for 10 seconds
    • Frosty Delirium: Ice ki melee attack: +10% damage. Targeted enemy is confused for 6 seconds
    • Rippling Strike: force ki melee attack: +50% damage, +1 crit multiplier
  • (AP: 1, Ranks: 3): Action Boost: Imbue: Gain +3/6/9 Imbue die for 20 seconds. Cooldown: 30 seconds
Tier 3:
  • (AP: 1, Ranks: 1: Requires Previous Carry On): Carry On: Choose of the toggles not previously selected
  • (AP: 2, Ranks: 1): Dual Cut: Dark ki Melee Cleave. +20% damage. Make 2 cleave attacks in quick succession. If Harbinger of the Inevitable is active, any enemies hit are given an additional stack of "Weight of Powerlessness" per hit. Ki cost: 15. Shares a cooldown with cleave
  • (AP: 2, Ranks: 1: Requires Previous Harness Energy): Harness Energy: +1 imbue die
  • (AP: 1, Ranks: 1): Ghosts Aren't Real: While centered, melee weapons you equip gain ghost touch
  • (AP: 2, Ranks: 1): Dexterity, Wisdom, or Intelligence Multiselector
Tier 4:
  • (AP: 1, Ranks: 1: Requires Previous Carry On): Carry On: Choose of the toggles not previously selected
  • (AP: 1, Ranks: 3): Swift Demise II: +2/4/6 doublestrike
  • (AP: 2, Ranks: 1: Requires Previous Harness Energy): Harness Energy: +1 imbue die
  • (AP: 1, Ranks: 3): Nihilistic: +5/10/15 healing amplification
  • (AP: 2, Ranks: 1): Dexterity, Wisdom, or Intelligence Multiselector
Tier 5:
  • (AP: 1, Ranks: 1: Requires Previous Carry On): Crushing Pressure: Melee attack: Make an attack with 30% damage and +2 critical range. Apply 10 stacks of "Weight of Powerlessness" to the targeted enemy. Every 3 seconds for 9 seconds, apply 10 "Weight of Powerlessness" stacks. Cost: 40 Ki. Cooldown: 40 seconds
  • (AP: 2, Ranks: 1): Transfer Momentum: For every stack of "Weight of Powerlessness" removed via Carry their Burden, you gain +1% doublestrike for 10 seconds. Max 25 stacks. All stacks fade when timer expires
  • EMPTY
  • (AP: 2, Ranks: 1): Target Weakness: Centered Weapons gain a +1 competence bonus critical threat range. +25% Competence bonus to maximum hit points
  • (AP: 1, Ranks: 1): Hooked Blade Master: If you are wielding a kama or sickle in one hand, and nothing in the off hand, or kamas or sickles in both hands, gain +50% strikethrough

Closing Notes:
  • Stacks of 'Weight of Powerlessness' removed because the timer expired would not trigger any effects in this tree that say "when stacks are removed". The stacks must be removed by Carry their burden for these effects to occur
  • This is part of a hypothetical monk archetype. That post also details a new feat, Prescient curve, which gives kamas and sickles the ability to benefit from strikethrough.
That's it! Would love to know what you guys think of this tree.
 
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DaWiner

Member
So basically the same but more consistent?
Ah, now I see what you meant. Yes, it would enable triple strike, but on average it would be 2.5x strike, since going above 150% doublestrike would not do anything.

It would behave the same way doubleshot behaves when you go over 100% doubleshot
 

DaWiner

Member
i think youre conflating hedonism for nihilism
You're right, they would be a nihilistic hedonist. My thought was that a hedonist doesn't believe in a higher power, but that doesn't necessarily make him 'at peace', which is what a monk would be. So he uses nihilism to be 'at peace'. The more correct name would be Nihilistic Hedonist, but that didn't really roll off the tongue, so I stuck with Hedonist
 

Hobgoblin

Less Nerfy Nerfy more fixy fixy
uhhh.... a person who believes that the pursuit of pleasure is the most important thing in life; a pleasure-seeker.

that doesnt fit with anything you proposed here
 
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I dont Like gimps

Well-known member
You're right, they would be a nihilistic hedonist. My thought was that a hedonist doesn't believe in a higher power, but that doesn't necessarily make him 'at peace', which is what a monk would be. So he uses nihilism to be 'at peace'. The more correct name would be Nihilistic Hedonist, but that didn't really roll off the tongue, so I stuck with Hedonist
that basically sounds like nihilistic antinatalism/ultilitarism as in better to be neutral in non existence than a painful life
did u ever read Epicurus?
 

DaWiner

Member
"better to be neutral in non existence than a painful life" is a very succinct and straightforward way of covering the majority of the archetype's flavor. Tack on that the 'painful life' part is because there is no god (according to them), and that's basically all of it.

The philosophical stuff (and writing about it) isn't really my forte unfortunately, which is why my explanation came out confusing. Thanks for clearing it up
 
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