Not happy, disillusioned with Duergar/ Mindcleaver

[Awar]

I’ve been through three racial lies with Dugar and two racial lies with mine clever
Both have been disappointed with the racial trees
I’ve tried single handed and fighting two handed fighting and two weapon fighting and the racial Tree just does not give me a reason to ever come back to these trees
The Dugar race is dead
There’s no reason to play that race the top tier…… plus one to crit range Does nothing for a build.

Last thing I will try is a transmutation build, which is alchemist or artificial caster.. but the racial Tree has a lot of melee help in the tree which does not help casters
Maybe a Melee warlock build???? Can we make a warlock with poison?

Has anyone else found a good reason to play Dugar race or mine Cleaver I need a little help here

 

[Sythe777]

I think it's ok for what it does. I agree that it's not too caster focused (really all you can take is the buffs to your grow/shrink if you don't lean into the race weapons), but there are definitely worse racial trees for casters and the tree doesn't need to be generalized for them.

 

[Rusty_helmet]

I’ve been through three racial lies with Dugar and two racial lies with mine clever
Both have been disappointed with the racial trees
I’ve tried single handed and fighting two handed fighting and two weapon fighting and the racial Tree just does not give me a reason to ever come back to these trees
The Dugar race is dead
There’s no reason to play that race the top tier…… plus one to crit range Does nothing for a build.

Last thing I will try is a transmutation build, which is alchemist or artificial caster.. but the racial Tree has a lot of melee help in the tree which does not help casters
Maybe a Melee warlock build???? Can we make a warlock with poison?

Has anyone else found a good reason to play Dugar race or mine Cleaver I need a little help here

Lol. You are clearly not doing it right then. Dual wield war hammer with dragonlord. It’s a very effective and balanced tree. If not going battle ace or warhammer, it may be a little light for sure. It probably doesn’t beat wood elf with long swords due to elven accuracy

 

[Bjond]

There’s no reason to play that race the top tier…… plus one to crit range Does nothing for a build

war hammer with dragonlord. It’s a very effective and balanced tree

This is it exactly. Critical+1 (either ranged or multiplier) can be used to great effect by Dragonlord, Frenzied Berserker, and/or Ravager trees. It's one way to a strong DPS build.

Another way, of course, is to pair doubled tree profile bonuses with a strong weapon. D.Axe is definitely NOT a strong weapon. You can have fun leveling it, but it will likely be at least 20~30% off of a top build.

 

[Dulkhan]

We tried to tell them on lamania but devs dont listen if anything need too much change... This race is as as underpower as the oldones that already need a buff...

 

[ZPR]

the iconic one makes for a decent tank, 6% AC, and some good buffs for going small. especially if you've been saving radiant forcefield potions for the last 10 years and dont need the standard dwarf dragon mark, also with the added benefit of already being fighter and starting at level 15 so its easier to level up as a tank.

 

[FuzzyDuck81]

I disagree with the +1 threat on dwarven axes not doing anything for a build, it means my vanguard actually gets an extra threat boost for her weapon in addition to the shield, extra strikethrough means she's over 200% for that guaranteed 3rd target hit in groups and the thrown axe attack procs the light damage from divine crusader core 4 for an extra bit of punch to open the fight - part of the changes are to baseline dwarf too admittedly but for that character it's only been a power boost.

Now I'm just gonna have to adjust a couple of feats when the next update comes out, that temp hp proc one looks really tasty.

 

[seph1roth5]

We tried to tell them in lamania but devs dont listen if anything need too much change... This race is as as underpower as the oldones that already need a buff...

I like their answer for everyone saying mindblades sucked at 20+, it was basically "Don't use it then."

 

[voenixa121]

We tried to tell them in lamania but devs dont listen if anything need too much change... This race is as as underpower as the oldones that already need a buff...

Every lamannia is just a constant haggling for more powerful changes. Some players reacted that way to dragonlord, telling the devs it was way too weak and will never be played. Tha kind of feedback is impossible to follow up.

I think the ranged aoe sunder is really fun to use and it actually does count as a sunder for all other abilities. (and it hits the primary target twice) I was really suprised that the tooltip didn't lie for once.

 

[FuzzyDuck81]

I think the ranged aoe sunder is really fun to use and it actually does count as a sunder for all other abilities. (and it hits the primary target twice) I was really suprised that the tooltip didn't lie for once.

Agreed, if i was running dragonlord rather than regular fighter it'd be fantastic, especially since it's on a separate cooldown timer from the actual melee sunder attack.

 

[Dulkhan]

Every lamannia is just a constant haggling for more powerful changes. Some players reacted that way to dragonlord, telling the devs it was way too weak and will never be played. Tha kind of feedback is impossible to follow up.

I think the ranged aoe sunder is really fun to use and it actually does count as a sunder for all other abilities. (and it hits the primary target twice) I was really suprised that the tooltip didn't lie for once.

What I want is consistancy, if eladrin and dhampir are going to be the baseline so be it, let keep new races at that power level and udpate the old ones when we can to somewhere there. Same with dragonlord. and before you say it, Not everything need to have the SAME power level, but it needs to be close enough en some areas to make races interesting.

 

[Darksteel]

Completed the lives and moved on. Nothing to see in this fatty dwarf.

 

[justin credible]

I’ve been through three racial lies with Dugar and two racial lies with mine clever
Both have been disappointed with the racial trees
I’ve tried single handed and fighting two handed fighting and two weapon fighting and the racial Tree just does not give me a reason to ever come back to these trees
The Dugar race is dead
There’s no reason to play that race the top tier…… plus one to crit range Does nothing for a build.

Last thing I will try is a transmutation build, which is alchemist or artificial caster.. but the racial Tree has a lot of melee help in the tree which does not help casters
Maybe a Melee warlock build???? Can we make a warlock with poison?

Has anyone else found a good reason to play Dugar race or mine Cleaver I need a little help here

for the regular duergar, 6 paladin/cleric/fvs for silvanus +2 to crit range with mauls, 6 dragonlord for +2 crit multiplier
the other 8 whatever

havent gotten to mindcleaver yet, will probably do 1 fighter 18 barbarian 1 warlock and use esos since i dont have a lvl 20 maul worth using

 

[Aggy]

I love dwarves, and I have been waiting for Duergar for years. I like the cosmetic options and i think for melee they are great.
5% HP, the whole Axe/Hammer line with the +1 to crit range, +3 to hit and dmg in the cores, another +3 from enlarge, extra 20% helplesness damage, the invis SLA.
It may not be great for every build, but it is pretty good for many melee builds.
I'm playing a Dragonlord/Rogue/barbarian variant right now with Dwarven Axe and Twohanded mastery. Its for sure not the best single target damage out there, but I'm abolutely smashing R10s. Might shuffle and try to get more AOE attacks and then go back to Warhammer maybe.

I like Duerger a lot.

 

[Gimp]

To OP if you dont like em...dont play em. Sorry about your loss.

 

[Aristis]

5 past lives in just 10 days? That’s some seriously great progress!

 

[Awar]

To OP if you dont like em...dont play em. Sorry about your loss.

I did like them!! I love growing bigger! Fun!
But I didn’t end up using axes or dwarf axe…. Used SWORD OF SHADOW ALL THE WAY.

So I like them but neeed better reason to play them other than ooooooh I get big

 

[Awar]

5 past lives in just 10 days? That’s some seriously great progress!

Yes I did all my deugar life’s first for the racial completionist and the +1 to con.
Now doing my last iconic live.
Just get to cap and TR. I had to use 2 TR timers that I had in the bank. I can get to cap in 2 days using saga bonuses and 30% xp pots

 

[Sythe777]

Yes I did all my deugar life’s first for the racial completionist and the +1 to con.
Now doing my last iconic live.
Just get to cap and TR. I had to use 2 TR timers that I had in the bank. I can get to cap in 2 days using saga bonuses and 30% xp pots

I did the reverse because I'm sick in the head

 

[Justfungus]

It is/was a cool looking dwarf to help sell the expansion, nothing more.
It was never meant to be OP.
Now playable Kobolds, they would definitely be OP by design.
lol...