Quest xp question.

[Winterburn]

Hi.

I just ran a few level 5 quests, to be more specific: The legend of 2-toed Tobias, Rackham's trail, Ghost of a chance and lastly part 1 of Deleras (in that order).

I would say that 2-Toed Tobias, Rackham's and Deleras part 1 are about the same length and you'd think they give roughly the same xp and Ghost should give a little less since it is a bit shorter.

I got about 19k from 2-Toed (ran R2 and had a 10% xp pot), I think i got around 17k form Rackham's and 15k from Ghost. From Deleras part 1 i got 9,5k.

Anyone else think there is some discrepensies here in how they determine how much xp a quest is worth?

Sure if a quest has high xp yielding optionals I could see it giving a little less base xp but other then that quests at the same level and about the same length should imo give about the same xp, with the exception already mentioned.

Anyone else agree on this or am I missing something?

 

[Grunndi]

3 barrel cove stuff is just kind of abnormally huge XP for that level, so hard to compare to anything.

But yeah there’s a few head scratchers out there, and I sure don’t understand how they decide base XP.

 

[Phoenicis]

Quest XP has never in the history of the game made a single iota of sense.

Welcome to DDO.

 

[droid327]

You make the faulty assumption that quest XP is normalized. It is not.

Some quests just give you a butt-ton more XP, for no discernable reason. Usually newer quests give better XP/min, but that's not a hard and fast rule, and some of the best quests XP wise include some really old ones like Shadow Crypt and 3BC. And Saltmarsh is relatively new but pretty bad XP/min.

The best way to go is to try and hit all the "good" quests each life and steer away from the "bad" ones. Most of the vets can list off the highlights from memory - Kobolds New Ringleader, Waterworks, Feywild, 3BC, Spies, Shadow Crypt, Ravenloft, Gianthold, Sharn, etc.

 

[Cheeps]

Yeah, and then there's level 2 harbour quests that give more exp than the most recent level 18 slice of life "fred" quests.

 

[mikarddo]

If you know where to jump Delaras p1 is very fast, way faster than Two-Toed Tobias in my experience. So, I would not say they are exactly of equal length. Besides, Delaras p1 opens for Delaras p2 which is very good xp if zerged.

 

[Winterburn]

Hmm, I have played for quite a lot of years (15+) and I know that I have had this thought before, I just recently started to post in the forums so that's why I never asked this before.

With that said to me it doesn't matter because I run specific quests for each life and it's not always the ones that give most xp (even though if I know of one i try to put it into the list). I usually go for favor and if I can do the quest at level at heroic I will and offcourse this means I will run a few quests with +levels too (I try to do it so I can still do reaper, aka 4 levels above at the most but sometimes you just have to take level and then a few might be run on elite with 5 levels above quest).

I know this isn't the most efficient way and I could run those quests later for the favor, but even if you are 5 levels above and run elite some of those quests still give decent xp.

I'm not against different quests giving different amount of xp, but it would have beeen easier if they followed a rule like: level + length = x amount with some extra from optionals and the other extra xp from conquest, ransack etc + bonuses (delve, no deaths or reenter etc).

 

[Winterburn]

If you know where to jump Delaras p1 is very fast, way faster than Two-Toed Tobias in my experience. So, I would not say they are exactly of equal length. Besides, Delaras p1 opens for Delaras p2 which is very good xp if zerged.

Sure but I never do the jump method personally and the point was more towards no shortcut or skip options. At that point I would say they are about the same in length.

But I do get your point, if you shortcut it and skip optionals it is a rather short and fast quest, especially compared to 2TT. Plus Deleras P2 is really nice xp indeed but it is also a level 7 quest.

 

[Darkwolfer2002]

I think they use a dart board when determining XP.

 

[Lagin]

IIRC, they use a simple matrix for quest level & length. With not much attn paid to quest overall difficulty, here's an example of that, Mine of Tethyamar tough quests with xp that IMO is short of the mark.

​

 

[Darkwolfer2002]

IIRC, they use a simple matrix for quest level & length. With not much attn paid to quest overall difficulty, here's an example of that, Mine of Tethyamar tough quests with xp that IMO is short of the mark.

​

The other part if they have a simple equation like X (Let X = quest level) + Y (Let Y = length) = Z (Total base xp), the question then becomes who determined quest length? The developer? Then players find shortcuts and quests become much shorter than expected. Like do you think they have somebody run through the quest during testing a few times and take an average time to complete? Then they have a scale of what it means for short, medium, long, very long?

Why does a level 9 quest (VoN 3 for example) give more XP than a level 16? If anything the 16 should naturally give more, it is mind boggling.

 

[Lagin]

The other part if they have a simple equation like X (Let X = quest level) + Y (Let Y = length) = Z (Total base xp), the question then becomes who determined quest length? The developer? Then players find shortcuts and quests become much shorter than expected. Like do you think they have somebody run through the quest during testing a few times and take an average time to complete? Then they have a scale of what it means for short, medium, long, very long?

Why does a level 9 quest (VoN 3 for example) give more XP than a level 16? If anything the 16 should naturally give more, it is mind boggling.

If we could answer that, we would have winning lottery tickets.

 

[Darkwolfer2002]

If we could answer that, we would have winning lottery tickets.

It just feels like somebody should go through and normalize XP? I'm a data analyst and I have to assume they have some kind of record keeping on how fast people are completing quests. Then again, the system is old and maybe they don't? But you're right, I'm just very curious.

 

[Terranigma]

Why does a level 9 quest (VoN 3 for example) give more XP than a level 16?

At the time Jungles of Khyber was created, beholders were very deadly and we were still living in an era where dying gave you an Experience Debt. The Marut at the end was also no joke, sometimes proving too hard to take down without the entire group crumbling (longtime players may remember the de-facto tactic was to have people shield block the doorway and let an arcane Magic Missile it to death). The quest gave an outsized amount of EXP to match the fact that it was a long (30+ minute) and tough quest. Since that timeframe, the developers have mostly let the EXP stay where it was, even though the difficulty of the quest is no where near what it was back in April 2006 due to players getting increased amounts of power over time.

 

[Phoenicis]

I tend to think if quest XP was 'normalized' it would go down across the board, mainly because I honestly believe the devs think most players level way to fast.

The outrage from players that would trigger would be monumental, and something the devs don't want to face.

So they leave it be, and try to slow folks down in other ways.

Just my personal theory...

 

[Darkwolfer2002]

At the time Jungles of Khyber was created, beholders were very deadly and we were still living in an era where dying gave you an Experience Debt. The Marut at the end was also no joke, sometimes proving too hard to take down without the entire group crumbling (longtime players may remember the de-facto tactic was to have people shield block the doorway and let an arcane Magic Missile it to death). The quest gave an outsized amount of EXP to match the fact that it was a long (30+ minute) and tough quest. Since that timeframe, the developers have mostly let the EXP stay where it was, even though the difficulty of the quest is no where near what it was back in April 2006 due to players getting increased amounts of power over time.

That makes a lot of sense (adding in a third factor of difficulty into the equation). Again though, maybe they need to do an XP pass over quests. I love Von 3 and the XP it gives but I'd be willing to sacrifice it some if it meant better balance of XP throughout the leveling process.

 

[Alco]

There is a reason that people run "Dailies" with the same few quests when epic leveling and OP, you just spotted it.

 

[Cheeps]

I think they use a dart board when determining XP.

I think they use the same dart board to figure out what bugs to fix.

When they miss the dart board and hit the wall, they fix nothing.

 

[DBZ]

Wish they'd make all the feywilds level 6 and all the cogs 16

 

[Winterburn]

I've seen some great points that you guys made, like the von 3 remark. It is true that some quests was more difficult back in the day and that you got some more xp from that and I'm all for it.

As to the point about ppl finding shortcuts and stuff, I'd say that it isn't something that should impact xp imo. This is because it is the quest isn't shorter just because you can find a way to skip parts of it. It is shorter and faster for YOU, but the quest in it self isn't if you know what I mean.

Then there are some quests that are ridiculously simple and fast and that should effect xp too imo. However there are semi-short and easy quests that gives great xp fot their level and other that gives crap xp so even there it it some discrepencies.

Do I want all quests to give the exact number of xp (counting level, length, difficulty (not meaning normal, hard, elite or reaper now) etc)?

I would be ok with that if they made optionals in quests that could increase the xp gained if they standardized xp like that. Some quests would have a different amount of optional mini-bosses and some even have none.

Bu doing it this way you can reward the explorers and open up for better party play.

Now this may seem like a punish for zergers and ppl that do use shortcuts but imo they should get less xp then someone that does "everything" in a quest.

It would also make it so that you don't really level all that faster for speeding through quests since you get a base amount while those that do all optionals and stuff would get more xp. It would to some degree only make it so you have to run a lot more quests then the one that does everything in a quest. To some degree you probably would level faster still since it's not like optionals would give that much more xp.

I for one would like this change (even though I like to play solo over party play for several reasons, raids excluded though). I think it would make ppl more inclined to do optionals and get conquest and stuff. I mean just look at traps in quests these days. Noone cares about the traps really (except for certain quests), they just zerg by and if you have a trapper in the party they do the traps for the extra xp after everyone except the squishy ones that can't self heal or survive the trap have already past through it and are half way through the quest already.

The traps used to be deadly and had to be dealt with meaning you had to wait for the trapper to do them and then you continued the quest as a party and helped eachother out. nowadays you get 1 or 2 ppl that are so OP or just great that they speed through the quest leaving you and some other shmuck behind.

I can't even remember how many times it has been that you are halfway through the quest trying to just keep up with these guyswhen they finish the quest and run off to the next while you still have to run to the endchest to get your loot and then when you reach the next quest they are already halfway through.

Fast and easy xp, yes. Fun, not for me unless I play a char where I really don't want the grind to get to a certain level where that char becomes fun to play.

With that said I don't mind if they keep the xp as is either I was just wondering about the discrepensies really. I felt it was weird and as for some quests I get it that it was made for the actual difficulty of the quest at the time (like with von3).