Random Generated "Silver Flame" items vs. Named Items with Hallowed/Sacred Modifiers

Cashery

Well-known member
So I was surprised to find that Silver Flame Random Generated items that give the following bonuses do not stack with the Cleric/Paladin Spell-Seek Eternal Rest:

Silver Flame Random Generated
Hallowed:
An item with this quality assists only the wearers who have the ability to turn undead. Hallowed Items provide an +xx enhancement bonus to the maximum Hit Dice of undead turned.

Sacred: An item with this quality assists only the wearers who have the ability to turn undead. Sacred Items provide an +xx enhancement bonus to your effective level for Turning Undead.

See following screen shot:


Named Items with both Sacred and Hallowed -- Do Stack with the spell -- Seek Eternal Rest. Note: the wording is the same for both items.
see screenshot



I would assume that Random Generated Silver Flame items are coded differently. i.e. Sacred Bonus for random generated as seen in the screen shot as apposed to the description whereas the named item with Sacred is giving the enhancement bonus as listed in the description.

Random Generated and Named Items have the same wording for Sacred +xx.
 

Mesmerin

Well-known member
That wou
So I was surprised to find that Silver Flame Random Generated items that give the following bonuses do not stack with the Cleric/Paladin Spell-Seek Eternal Rest:

Silver Flame Random Generated
Hallowed:
An item with this quality assists only the wearers who have the ability to turn undead. Hallowed Items provide an +xx enhancement bonus to the maximum Hit Dice of undead turned.

Sacred: An item with this quality assists only the wearers who have the ability to turn undead. Sacred Items provide an +xx enhancement bonus to your effective level for Turning Undead.

See following screen shot:


Named Items with both Sacred and Hallowed -- Do Stack with the spell -- Seek Eternal Rest. Note: the wording is the same for both items.
see screenshot



I would assume that Random Generated Silver Flame items are coded differently. i.e. Sacred Bonus for random generated as seen in the screen shot as apposed to the description whereas the named item with Sacred is giving the enhancement bonus as listed in the description.

Random Generated and Named Items have the same wording for Sacred +xx.
That would seem to indicate that the random gen is providing a +14 sacred bonus, not a +14 enhancement bonus (which is why it overwrites the sacred bonus from the spell as it's only +4). Does both alaric's gauntlets and those boots stack? Probably easiest way to check is to go somewhere with undead and spam and see what sort of rolls you are getting with/without the boots on.
If it does I'm sure it will be "fixed" soon.
 

Cashery

Well-known member
That wou

That would seem to indicate that the random gen is providing a +14 sacred bonus, not a +14 enhancement bonus (which is why it overwrites the sacred bonus from the spell as it's only +4). Does both alaric's gauntlets and those boots stack? Probably easiest way to check is to go somewhere with undead and spam and see what sort of rolls you are getting with/without the boots on.
If it does I'm sure it will be "fixed" soon.
I tested it out on my turn cleric...

Alaric's with Seek Eternal Rest (see Pic)


Alaric's with the same Silver Flame boots equipped: Silver Flame Boots over rode Seek Eternal Rest but do stack with Alaric's.


Yes, this should be fixed..as random generated is giving a sacred bonus to the sacred effect whereas Named items with the sacred bonus give enhancement bonuses.
 
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Buddha5440

Well-known member
While I agree this should be fixed... how often do you see Turn Undead actually used?

It is so underpowered (in a game with tons of undead), that it is pretty much useless unless you build for it; which is when this problem comes up.
 

kmoustakas

Scourge of Xaos
While I agree this should be fixed... how often do you see Turn Undead actually used?

It is so underpowered (in a game with tons of undead), that it is pretty much useless unless you build for it; which is when this problem comes up.
Instakilling 3 mobs on r10 with no save and very small cooldown is not underpowered
 

Cashery

Well-known member
While I agree this should be fixed... how often do you see Turn Undead actually used?

It is so underpowered (in a game with tons of undead), that it is pretty much useless unless you build for it; which is when this problem comes up.

I just made an 18/2 Paladin Cleric Sun Elf. Running in Exalted Angel.. my turn DC's are 110 to effective mobs and can turn up to 174 hps worth of mobs.. most r10's undead are 44-50 cr rating.. so i can roughly turn 4 everytime I turn. the others cower or get feared. and is quite effective CC.

when not running undead quests i swith gear to be more mele based and run in Divine Crusader.

Turn Undead is really good in R10 content.. Cowers orange names, fears red names. even can fear reapers when using turn undead. they run around trying to stay away from you...
 

Buddha5440

Well-known member
That was exactley what the last part of my post referred to. If you don't build for TU, it has little use.; if you do build for it, to the point that it will be useful, that's when the issue between Silver Flame enchantment and the spells that boost the same become an issue worth looking into. That's why I think it "should" be fixed but doubt that it will be. :)
 

Aelonwy

Well-known member
Should this be in Bug Discussions (last forum sub category)? Has any dev posted yet in that forum? New forums don't seem to be getting much attention yet. Or they are all very busy right now.

I hope this gets fixed.
 

Cashery

Well-known member
Should this be in Bug Discussions (last forum sub category)? Has any dev posted yet in that forum? New forums don't seem to be getting much attention yet. Or they are all very busy right now.

I hope this gets fixed.
Yeah. Still trying to navigate the new forums. Didn’t see that one when I made the thread.
 

Mesmerin

Well-known member
You should head to THTH and see how high an R value you can push it to insta the forgewraiths.
That will get it get fixed fast XD
 

Mesmerin

Well-known member
Can also make a turn stick as a swap item using the club from A Legend Revisited (gives insightful +2 levels, +2 max hd, +4 TU hd, so stacks with enhancement bonus from sacred/hallowed items).
Four final burial filigrees - +2TU charges, +2 TU HD, +2 TU maxHD, Cha, (Set bonus +3 TU Charges, +3 TU HD, +3 maxHD)
2 Angelic Wings - +2 TU HD, Cha (Set Bpnus +2 TU Charges)
1 Embraced by Light (TU +2 levels)
For a total (including filgree set bonuses) of an additional
+4 TU cleric levels, + 11TU HD , +7 TU maxHD , + 4TU charges and +2 CHA on top of what you already have.
 
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Cashery

Well-known member
You should head to THTH and see how high an R value you can push it to insta the forgewraiths.
That will get it get fixed fast XD
I already could turn the low wraiths, and cower the orange named, prior to this.. also, when turning the lower ones, it does not upgrade the orange into reds. Turning is quite effective in R1 THTH
 

The Blonde

Catalogues Bugs
Relevant recent thread from the old forums.

If a dev reads this thread and wants to look into the issue, the intended result of how each effect should be typed is this:
- Seek Eternal Rest should be granting a Sacred bonus to Effective Turning Level. (unsure if WAI)
- Both random-generated and named items should be granting Enhancement bonus to Effective Turning Level (Sacred) and Enhancement bonus to Max Hit Dice (Hallowed). (bugged, as is evident by this thread)
- Silver Flame (the actual effect, not the the combined Hallowed-Sacred prefix of the same name!) should be granting an Enhancement bonus to Total Hit Dice. (likely WAI)
- Eternal Faith (an old non-scaling effect) should be granting an Enhancement bonus to all 3 attributes. (no idea if WAI or not currently)
- Insightful Faith should be granting an Insightful bonus to all 3 attributes. (likely WAI)
 
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Eltronin

Kobolds don't matter
Following this as I am about to TR into a Sun Elf and have a bunch of named Sacred/Hallowed gear to build a TU/Heal Sun Cleric.
 

Cashery

Well-known member
Following this as I am about to TR into a Sun Elf and have a bunch of named Sacred/Hallowed gear to build a TU/Heal Sun Cleric.

I stumbled across this as I made a 18 Paladin/2 Cleric Sun Elf, turn paladin.. my dc's are just as high as my cleric and quite effective in R10
 

Cashery

Well-known member
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