Weaponalpha
Well-known member
This sounds like an Orien problem. More players doesn't necessarily mean better play experience. Life on Khyber good as ever.
Social State of the Game: In Tatters
- Thread starter Jinzi
- Start date
GrayJedi AntiProPaladin
Well-known member
"There are now three groups of players: the pikers, the anti-pikers, and those who..." [are Cool with Both/Either]
^^ well that Generally seems pretty Healthy... as long as the Choice remains for all these groups to Exist, it seems to be functioning democratic system of the Fantasy Game
^^ well that Generally seems pretty Healthy... as long as the Choice remains for all these groups to Exist, it seems to be functioning democratic system of the Fantasy Game
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PurpleSerpent
Monster Hunter of Moderate Renown
Agreed.
I can't help but find this sort of post fascinating. Complaining about the game is one thing, but complaining about other people playing it in a way that doesn't benefit you? Baffling...
And if it can happen on Orien, it can eventually happen elsewhere...
Hello Jinzi,
I am multiple completionist who stopped playing game before about 2 or 3 years.
I returned to game few weeks before and my gaming session ended with uninstalled game.
Not because game itself but because of community.
I returned to have fun, joined on very weak laptop.
So my loading screens and sometimes not the best memory for reach quest in shortest time possible limited my overal fun value.
Because offen someone else joined and did all the work.
Difficulity is factor that can help (so people dont zerg) but at some point you cant go to far or you become useless.
Anyway for me it is terrible experence, missing days where ppl waited for help and not soling r10 like today.
So this is explanation for you what is motive for people to pike... They just join for xp, because why bother run in quest and be proactive when someone else nukes entire stacks for 6sp and your hits dont even land because you either have weaker pc or network...
In my days I used to lead groups, ppl respected me, I always called for challange and bigger difficulity that can PARTY handle.
running for XP harmstrer wheel is pointless... it is driven by pure addiction to level level level..
People should focus FUN over it.
Maybe I will give another try later. BTW devs should add DDO to steam for mac. Or at least info that can be downloaded outside steam. It shows only windows icon on steam..
Cheers
GrayJedi AntiProPaladin
Well-known member
"hits dont even land because you either have weaker pc or network..."
so it would seem that one should fix first those factors within one's own control easily, rather than try to "fix" other things/or people that are Not within one's own control
perhaps try to upgrade your pc at least to medium spec (Not necessarily top of the line) and try upgrading your network to some Respectable speed/bandwidth/ping times, or use your cell phone as hotspot for your pc - heard some people on the Forums have done that Successfully during recent Network weirdness issues
GL & Cheers,
so it would seem that one should fix first those factors within one's own control easily, rather than try to "fix" other things/or people that are Not within one's own control
perhaps try to upgrade your pc at least to medium spec (Not necessarily top of the line) and try upgrading your network to some Respectable speed/bandwidth/ping times, or use your cell phone as hotspot for your pc - heard some people on the Forums have done that Successfully during recent Network weirdness issues
GL & Cheers,
I sorta get it. Back before reaper, the difference in power levels was much smaller. Now the mountain to ultimate power is huge (see another thread). And what seems awesome and somewhat unique the first few times (TRs) can become merely a penalty to getting back to cap where we can finally test out that new build. This has led to the piking and people willing to sell their souls for an Otto's box.
Can't bring myself to buy an Otto's. Paying to play, sure. Paying NOT to play? No thanks, not even to try that new build.
So ironically, one of the game's strongest points (TRs) is also self-defeating in terms of enjoyment for many of us.
But I stand by my earlier statement. Regardless of class, anyone can -- and should -- contribute. If we are all trying together, the TR slog will be more enjoyable and efficient.
Really, what should the game banner read?
"Play DDO! The game with unlimited builds, team synergy, and eager players!"
.....or.....
"Play DDO! The game you can play without really playing!"
Origin:
piking was created from typycal middle age style guard guy or guys who gatekeep some entry offten as duo. They stay there with pike weapon and look for threat... So it is same like not contributors who stay at entry door but they probably dont have pike...
you completely missed the point...
but its easier dont look at that...
If you want keep community in good condition, they should have fun with game...
if its not fun than its not interest..
I have no energy for you to teach you more, bye..
GrayJedi AntiProPaladin
Well-known member
uhhh yeahhh ok anybody knows for a game they should have fun with game
it's OK u don't need to teach me that
yah GL and bye
it's OK u don't need to teach me that
yah GL and bye
Col Kurtz
Well-known member
we have a don't ask , don't tell policy about what happens on Orion
Nothing is perfect, but I think the DDO player community is filled with great people that go out of their way to help people and make the game fun for people they group with.
People join raids that are available and typically for pugs that is LH or R1 and not everyone that joins understands there is a big difference between an R1 quest and an R1 raid. Or they sign up for an LH raid with their 8th alt and it gets pushed up to R1.
The age-old issue is that there are more people that want to join raid groups that will have an easy completion than there are people or small groups willing to lead/teach a raid.
I was away from the game for the better part of 2 years and have been thinking of starting up scheduled LN raiding because I've noticed an influx of newer and returning players and even for some LH raids can fall apart without all the roles filled properly and in some cases without the dps. I don't want anyone to feel like they aren't contributing or causing a raid failure.
People join raids that are available and typically for pugs that is LH or R1 and not everyone that joins understands there is a big difference between an R1 quest and an R1 raid. Or they sign up for an LH raid with their 8th alt and it gets pushed up to R1.
The age-old issue is that there are more people that want to join raid groups that will have an easy completion than there are people or small groups willing to lead/teach a raid.
I was away from the game for the better part of 2 years and have been thinking of starting up scheduled LN raiding because I've noticed an influx of newer and returning players and even for some LH raids can fall apart without all the roles filled properly and in some cases without the dps. I don't want anyone to feel like they aren't contributing or causing a raid failure.
Marshal_Lannes
Well-known member
If you don't like piking, don't put up LFMs or only group with people you know. If asked, I always tell anyone in my groups that you're welcome to contribute as much or as little as you want. Having rigid standards or ideas on what "should" be happening, in my opinion, only creates a further anti-social atmosphere because you will find that people aren't always playing the game with the same goals or reasons you may be.
I do agree with the OP on raids. 20% of players often do end up doing 80% of the work. But again, so what? They are usually the ones with completely idealized raid characters and are in essence professional raiders. They should be doing more of the work. Again, if you don't like that, then I'm sure there are specific raid push guilds on your server that you could join.
Both Piking and raiding with whatever has come about because of the massive discrepancy in character power. If you spend much of your time following along in LFMs up to 32 as one or two super-powered characters blow through the quest while tumbling/winging/sprinting through the dungeon at warp speed, what exactly are you supposed to do? The game is teaching you to pike because you can't even keep up with the character two rooms ahead AOE blasting everything apart. Telling people you can break boxes for me strikes me as the personification of letting them eat cake.
I do agree with the OP on raids. 20% of players often do end up doing 80% of the work. But again, so what? They are usually the ones with completely idealized raid characters and are in essence professional raiders. They should be doing more of the work. Again, if you don't like that, then I'm sure there are specific raid push guilds on your server that you could join.
Both Piking and raiding with whatever has come about because of the massive discrepancy in character power. If you spend much of your time following along in LFMs up to 32 as one or two super-powered characters blow through the quest while tumbling/winging/sprinting through the dungeon at warp speed, what exactly are you supposed to do? The game is teaching you to pike because you can't even keep up with the character two rooms ahead AOE blasting everything apart. Telling people you can break boxes for me strikes me as the personification of letting them eat cake.
GrayJedi AntiProPaladin
Well-known member
^^ and also discrepancy in Player Power/Knowledge of Game/quests/raids - "Knowledge is Power"
BTW too bad can't put "Like" on individual sentences... sometimes it happens reading a post and was about to give a Hella Phat Like on it...until the last few sentences.... ah well
BTW too bad can't put "Like" on individual sentences... sometimes it happens reading a post and was about to give a Hella Phat Like on it...until the last few sentences.... ah well
Mickeymouse
Well-known member
Were you playing Feywild? I get huge loading screens in that pack on my 8 year old toaster, but not so much elsewhere, and there is no shortage of loading screens in feywild.. also, make sure to reboot client if you swapped characters more than once.
In general, DDO is what DDO has always been, nothing new has happened and there are plenty of options for non-super zergers. Tons of guilds that goes a bit more slow.
Dhalgren
Well-known member
What you're looking for is not a system change but a social one. Good luck with that. System changes made to encourage this, such as those you suggest, would just make the divide between the long-timers and the first-lifer first-timers even greater than it is.
The OP has basically been reposted in different forms many, many times since before I joined in 2010 and I'm guessing it will never go away--because it's a fair complaint.
You can't build a system which will accommodate and adjust for all people all the time. Far better just to try to teach the newer ones you meet how to behave in public and to try to contribute to their parties if you can. You're never going to get through to every person but you can with some.
Whether people comport themselves with class or not is their own thing and system changes are never going to change that.
The OP has basically been reposted in different forms many, many times since before I joined in 2010 and I'm guessing it will never go away--because it's a fair complaint.
You can't build a system which will accommodate and adjust for all people all the time. Far better just to try to teach the newer ones you meet how to behave in public and to try to contribute to their parties if you can. You're never going to get through to every person but you can with some.
Whether people comport themselves with class or not is their own thing and system changes are never going to change that.
Dhalgren
Well-known member
If we need help with the social aspect, luckily there are kind posters here who can facilitate a connection with persons of, umm, negotiable affection
Friday evenings seem to be a good time for that.
Lazuli
Well-known member
I don't have these problems, honestly. I guess the servers are very different from each other. In my server, I find people who purposely pike repeatedly to be extremely rare. Sometimes there is someone who needs pike, it's ok, unforeseen things happen all the time in real life. Those same people on other days don't pike at all, these are things that happen. I am an active player and I try not to join a group if I think I will need to be away for a while. But sometimes I have needed to do it, and generally people have cared as little that I did it as I care that others do it.
If there is someone who repeatedly pikes into my groups without giving an explanation, what I would probably do is stop accepting them in my groups. But I can't think of anyone like that right now.
Accepting underdeveloped characters is usually not a problem for me either. If we don't help people reach us, we are going to have a serious population problem. I usually accept everyone. In quests it is not a problem to have a couple of characters in the group who do not contribute much. When I form a raid I try to make sure the important roles are covered, but other than that, it is okay for the new ones to join and start gaining strength. I always pass the loot that I don't anticipate using. How do we want a strong social community if we don't help the weak?
The only time I was bothered by weak characters joining was once when I was doing medium reaper questing with a build healer alt, and happened that everyone who joined was on an extremely new and underdeveloped toon. I had never encountered that concentration, when I was leading with a toon that basically had no dps. In the end I had to change to another character who could pull the group, because that didn't work lol But that's more of an anecdote to tell later than something to get angry about imo.
If there is someone who repeatedly pikes into my groups without giving an explanation, what I would probably do is stop accepting them in my groups. But I can't think of anyone like that right now.
Accepting underdeveloped characters is usually not a problem for me either. If we don't help people reach us, we are going to have a serious population problem. I usually accept everyone. In quests it is not a problem to have a couple of characters in the group who do not contribute much. When I form a raid I try to make sure the important roles are covered, but other than that, it is okay for the new ones to join and start gaining strength. I always pass the loot that I don't anticipate using. How do we want a strong social community if we don't help the weak?
The only time I was bothered by weak characters joining was once when I was doing medium reaper questing with a build healer alt, and happened that everyone who joined was on an extremely new and underdeveloped toon. I had never encountered that concentration, when I was leading with a toon that basically had no dps. In the end I had to change to another character who could pull the group, because that didn't work lol But that's more of an anecdote to tell later than something to get angry about imo.
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Lazuli
Well-known member
Thanks for the explanation, I always wondered where the word comes from.