Shear-buckler
Master of reactions
Are you saying everything you posted based on your incorrect understanding of the feat applies equally with the correct understanding?
Or that you still dont know how it works?
ssg will nerf Legen Strength of Arms in 3 month right when most players start to enjoy it and ppl will be mad
- Thread starter Concavenator
- Start date
Or that you still dont know how it works?
A noobs point of view. I like the feats, I don't find them OP but the do make a change. I don't think I have a lot of MP but what I now see is that with the feat I can be a bit more aggressive than before. I can charge mobs get the temp HP and fight without worrying that I will need to withdraw to heal after.
I soloed r3 level 30s. I would have soloed them before too but I would need to wait more after battles for healing.
For context:
My scream heals for 800 when in battle and makes me full when not.
Yes, I find the scream more OP than the 2 feats btw. I use the scream as an endless source of healing but obviously it needs some patience.
With the combination of the 2 feats I get to significantly need less screams.
I'm expecting that while this is the effect for me at r3 the really strong toons will have a similar effect in r10.
I want to point out that elite (excluding raids) for a 5-7 reincarnations toon like mine is a walk in the park. This feat doesn't change that fact. Now for first lifers, maybe it makes a difference at elite but I wouldn't consider it an issue as in reality 80%+ of the people play most content on r1+.
I soloed r3 level 30s. I would have soloed them before too but I would need to wait more after battles for healing.
For context:
My scream heals for 800 when in battle and makes me full when not.
Yes, I find the scream more OP than the 2 feats btw. I use the scream as an endless source of healing but obviously it needs some patience.
With the combination of the 2 feats I get to significantly need less screams.
I'm expecting that while this is the effect for me at r3 the really strong toons will have a similar effect in r10.
I want to point out that elite (excluding raids) for a 5-7 reincarnations toon like mine is a walk in the park. This feat doesn't change that fact. Now for first lifers, maybe it makes a difference at elite but I wouldn't consider it an issue as in reality 80%+ of the people play most content on r1+.
kmoustakas
Scourge of Xaos
I haven't even read the OP but this has 16 pages wow
erethizon1
Well-known member
This is the case every time people say something is OP. What they mean is that certain builds, that were already OP, will be even more OP because every feat is designed to make the rich, richer and the poor, poorer. I swear the Devs don't even grasp the concept of making something that means more to the weak than to the strong. It is why this game is among the least balanced games that has ever existed. We do not need new powers based on a percentage of the power you already have (unless that percentage is not the same for everyone, meaning the weak get a dramatically higher percentage than the strong).
Bjond
Well-known member
I like scaling a LOT. Low investment should mean low performance. There is a certain base level that is required, but a first life melee can (without SOA or L.SOA) solo rolf-stomp through R1 quests, run Hard raids, and join high reaper quest runs. Newbie has issues beyond 1st life, but that's normal, expected, and GOOD.
BTW, my debuffer has ~370 MP and that doesn't make L.SOA magically good. L.SOA utility scales on build features, not MP.
IMHO, Salt+Chains builds are going to be the really big winners for solo + L.SOA. It's absolutely an unequal gain in utility, but the gains are from either happenstance (ie. you had a build with those before L.SOA) or deliberate build leveraging.
I'm going to try it on my dodgy tank. It has ~50% dodge, DRoll, Feast, Guard-Up, IU/Dodge, & ~300 MP. I haven't bothered solo'ing past R4 with it (too slow, but R4 is a yawn without L.SOA). I suspect it will top out around R6~8, but adding Salt will likely permit solo R10.
Honestly, I still expect SOA to be completely removed from game, but not because "OP". It's because of the pressure to zerg from the 10s CD. Melee in quests are going to rush hard from pack to pack to keep their stacks. I started doing it on about the 3rd quest with L.SOA. The "omg stop zerging" squealing is going to be LOUD. It's just a matter of how long it takes for the devs to hear and respond.
erethizon1
Well-known member
I agree that was a terrible design decision. I don't mind the damage shield, but I would like to see it available to all classes and for it to accumulate over time without doing anything to trigger it. It is far more reasonable to wait 6 to 18 seconds between battles for the damage shield to build up than to mandate no breaks between battles to keep the damage shield going.
Nearly every other play style already has a better shield - distance. If you don't have to get close, you don't have to get hit. I'll concede that the limited range of eldritch blasts regularly puts warlocks in the danger zone, which is why I say "nearly every other". Also, I want to wait less between fights, not more, and that's where this feat really shines. I play mostly on the same difficulty as before but spend less time twiddling my thumbs as I wait to be out of combat.
Except no amount of zip is going to get you to the next fight in many quests before the shield is removed. The shield lasts ten seconds with a six second cooldown; on paper that means in the absolute best case scenario you have a ten second window to get to the next fight (you kill the last mob on a refresh) and in the worst case four seconds (you kill the last mob right before the cooldown ends), and I say "on paper" because the reality for many is that desync with the server will reduce the actual window to as low as two seconds. Anyway, if you're aiming for optimal uptime you'll have to try and leave some mobs behind or pause your attacks if you think you can't get another refresh before you kill them, but in high reaper these aren't really options. Even if you do somehow manage to keep the shield going there's a curious bug where all stacks are lost despite landing multiple hits throughout the entire duration of the shield, including when it's off cooldown; I don't know how the refresh check is coded but it's occasionally sleeping during the entire four second refresh window. The first time I saw it I thought maybe I had made a mistake so I really starting paying attention and noticed it happen during multiple boss fights where I had not once taken enough damage to lose the shield.
For the majority of players this feat is going to be better than other alternatives but still be merely "okay".
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Bjond
Well-known member
It's not too hard to do in most quests. It's more like 50% chance zippy pays when you know packs are parked nearby. Monk absolutely had it easier with 194 runspeed (a fast horse is 211). That's not even a Tabby Monk. Those are likely to fall off the world by accident.
FYI, I tried L.SOA on my dodgy tank and OMG LOL did it bump skulls up. Easy R4 became even easier R6 -- just rofl-stomped it. R8 took a little more "work" -- not a stomping, but still quick. I'd want salt for R10. Caveat: this was WPM -- one of the easier quests to solo on high-skulls and no Dooms spawned (during vampire would have been especially "interesting").
My TLDR; L.SOA = one small step for most, one giant leap for the tanky few.
Shear-buckler
Master of reactions
There is a very important distinction here.
The temporary HP stacking with MP is one thing. I get your point but it is still pretty standard stuff. Scaling is generally fun and actually easier to balance.
The temporary HP reseting all three stacks at once if you have any temp HP remaining is a completely different thing. It is another level of win-more that seems very hard to justify.
It's a difference in kind and not just in scale.
As for "least balanced game". I dont know, in the typical ARPG one build can deal literally a million times more damage than another.
PaleFox
Well-known member
We were promised to get an overhaul of things, (I believe it was epic destinies but could be wrong,) and I don't know how well it overlaps with the forecasted "in 3 months from now", but my guess is that the cookie cutter melee builds will get a hit or two with the nerf bat.
...
Instead of the hoped boost to spell casters to bring those up to par with melee and ranged.
And as so long now, ranged remains as is.
...
Instead of the hoped boost to spell casters to bring those up to par with melee and ranged.
And as so long now, ranged remains as is.
Jack Jarvis Esquire
Well-known member
I think melee got thrown a bone by the new feats intended to help close the risk gap that generally disadvantages them in comparison to ranged and most casters. I agree with Bjond the mechanics are a bit off in terms of inviting behaviours last seen in Blitz days - not all of which were helpful to harmonious group play. That may well need looked at.
FWIW I think the Devs may see that as balancing melee sufficiently to have them as the standard wrt DPS. I think ranged may get nerfed to try to get them just a bit below that, particularly the easy access Inquisitives, and caster DPS will be buffed to be just below ranged. Naturally there will be outliers and exceptions to such generalisations.
Nor sure how they'll accomplish that with precision and success, as it's a complex beastie all round, but my best guess is that's where they'll aim, and TBH I'm ok with that as it's an improvement on where we are today with the go ranged or go daftie meta...
FWIW I think the Devs may see that as balancing melee sufficiently to have them as the standard wrt DPS. I think ranged may get nerfed to try to get them just a bit below that, particularly the easy access Inquisitives, and caster DPS will be buffed to be just below ranged. Naturally there will be outliers and exceptions to such generalisations.
Nor sure how they'll accomplish that with precision and success, as it's a complex beastie all round, but my best guess is that's where they'll aim, and TBH I'm ok with that as it's an improvement on where we are today with the go ranged or go daftie meta...
Not in my experience. On average you'll have five seconds to get to the next fight (for me, really more like three to four due to server distance), so unless it's a quest where trash groups are packed in extremely tight then you're going to have trouble. Then there's all the impediments to travel... champ/reaper slowed? Forget about it. Have to open a door? Forget about it. Wait any amount of time for mobs to activate? Forget about it. Want to loot that chest? Not gonna happen.
Is this in isolation of the level cap increase? I could go from r4 to r6 in White Plume with just the two extra levels and different feats. If you remained level 34 then a four skull jump is impressive, even in that quest.
Bjond
Well-known member
It's hard to tell. I never really tried solo'ing him much before. He's a raid tank that "got lucky" with L.SOA synergy.
However, I wasn't solo'ing "smart". I've solo'd R10 before on diff builld/char and every critter-pack was a new and serious challenge.
This was different. R6 was full zerg, charge & stomp -- no thinking at all. The R8 wasn't a whole lot different, mostly prep'd with guard-up and/or feast then a bunch of circle-strafing. The bosses were sooo easy. With only one critter hitting, tmp stacked right up. But, it was WPM. I didn't pick it to test L.SOA. I was testing other things and wanted a drop and so bumped skulls for even more test mileage.
It was also in very stark contrast with my raid DPS, which didn't gain any skulls at all from L.SOA. Existing skulls were just easier & zergier.