STR challenged dood interested in Bow STR build

Oliphant

Well-known member
So not very knowledgeable about melee and STR pocket so somewhat green considering a Bow Strength build. Recently did a successful melee doing twf STR DL with monk splash Master of Forms Sun stance, Tensors, Aasimar boosting and Psionic boost item. Feel like I'm tapping somewhat into the STR specific boost neighborhood but not an expert on all the exotic STR boosts. Seems like an obvious stretch in the first place with STR for damage and DEX to hit, and could wonder why, but I guess hitting 80 Dex and a very high STR would be cool enough.
 

ChickenMobile

Well-known member
I'm not sure why you would want to focus on Strength for a bow build. Even choosing Falconry or Zen Archery for Wis hit/dmg is a better choice.

Why?
  • Prerequisite for many ranged feats require DEX (13) not STR
  • It is very difficult to focus on 2 main ability scores - therefore you will likely deal Grazing Hits often.
  • Named ranged gear generally gives bonuses to Wisdom or Dexterity not Strength.
  • Spells that Improve STR generally also improve DEX (Tenser's, Primal Scream etc.)
 

unbongwah

Well-known member
STR based archers were rendered obsolete when SSG made DEX to damage an inherent quality of bows. Now the trend is towards single-attribute builds where one stat covers attack, damage, and Battle Trance.

Not that some of us are still salty about there being a STR Battle Trance but no CON to hit option!
 

Lagin

Well-known member
STR based archers were rendered obsolete when SSG made DEX to damage an inherent quality of bows. Now the trend is towards single-attribute builds where one stat covers attack, damage, and Battle Trance.

Not that some of us are still salty about there being a STR Battle Trance but no CON to hit option!
yup, my old str based ranged build that used the feat bow strength is now just a mule.
 

Lagin

Well-known member
Going back to my old argument on this, dex can't help you pull or draw, without the devs shooting a torpedo in the strength needed to pull a 175lb draw preimse. Yet another stupid move by a few devs. Obviously they have never used a bow. :cool:
 

danzig138

Well-known member
Bow Strength bah should never have been in the game. If you want to add your Strength bonus to your bow damage, you should have to buy a composite bow with the appropriate Strength rating!
 

Guntango

Well-known member
Going back to my old argument on this, dex can't help you pull or draw, without the devs shooting a torpedo in the strength needed to pull a 175lb draw preimse. Yet another stupid move by a few devs. Obviously they have never used a bow. :cool:
What's your argument for riding a dragon?
 

droid327

Hardcore casual soloist
There is no such thing as a "Bow Strength" build. Bow Strength was intended to allow STR based melee builds to be able to hit things with a bow as a backup weapon...but that's not something that's ever worth spending a feat on now, and it arguably never was. If you're melee, you want to put all your feats towards melee and defense. If you're a bow build, then you have no use for STR.

The only relevance it might still have is letting Rangers use it (since they get it auto granted) to occasionally hit perched snipers with a bow, but again that's probably irrelevant since you'd probably just skip past most perched snipers, and even if you didnt you'd probably use a returning thrower since that has STR to dmg and doesnt require ammo.

And now I want a bow that can shoot a tornado.

Any bow can shoot a tornado...you probably just dont want to ever get close enough for that, though
 

Oliphant

Well-known member
Yeah, was trying out ideas (trying to hit DEX and STR 80 for Threats tbh) based on the exotic STR boost idea but just didn't seem to pencil out. I don't think it would be decent DPS but noted in my experiments the Cleric/DA Strength domain which has an ability to provide fairly decent STR boost to party. Maybe some kind of flavor build of the boosting variety could make non-zero sense, although I'm abandoning it.
 

Elisser

Member
I did this years ago for a laugh (and maybe racial grind was driving me battier than usual) during my Horc racial lives as my main has mostly bow specced gear and +8 Supreme Tome. I did low dex thanks to tome filler to make the most of Str main stat.
Was something like 11-14? Brb, 6 Rng and don't recall including a 3rd class or not for a trance. (This was before horizon walker too.) All the str buff items - quality/psionic etc - and rages possible like you stated for Angry Archery!
Likely I dipped into AA for morphic/metalline, and force (ghost touch and thematic!) imbue as qol choices.

I had fun and it played well enough for an archer at the time (again few years ago now). Horizon Walker probably make it more palatable with threat/multi in T5 and DH might have some curious synergy with medium armour boosts.
Would recommend bow experienced playstyle user first, before attempting the experiment if you change your mind re:abandonment.
 

Oliphant

Well-known member
Dhampir Dark Apostate STR Domain cleric maybe, +10 partywide STR buff. Can probably boost STR quite a bit higher than DEX, can take two Aim feats to compensate, will get 1.5x damage stat boost now. Of course, it's a little silly :whistle:
 

Phoenicis

Savage's Husband
it's bad game design from 3.0.

I gotta ask . . . has anyone ever fired a high-powered bow in real life? I have, you need to be strong to fire these. Dex to damage is a "Hollywood" thing.
*blink*

I actually agree with Teh_Troll.

Someone mark this day on a calendar!
 

Oliphant

Well-known member
They should update this feat to allow STR to attack as well. Seems fair to allow higher cap on attack and damage in exchange for burning a feat. Why have near-useless feats in the game?

p.s. A buddy of mine got into using traditional longbows. I walked with him through an archery course. Seems like a cool hobby. Definitely progression is centered around STR. If you progress properly you always use a draw strength you can handle well and move up slowly to stronger and stronger bows. Given how hard it is to pull, the idea is to draw and release quickly and there is a nice rhythm to it.
 

VirginiaCreeper

Well-known member
it's bad game design from 3.0.

I gotta ask . . . has anyone ever fired a high-powered bow in real life? I have, you need to be strong to fire these. Dex to damage is a "Hollywood" thing.
Yes. I have fired a bow in real-life. however, as some have pointed out, it makes more sense to add strength if you get bows specifically built, like compound bows, with a certain lb draw that requires a certain strength. Also, strength doesn't mean you can hit anything. It just means you can draw the bow. Dex in the game makes more sense as a modifier because it's about your reflexes as you move aim and let loose in battle that determine your hit and damage i.e. your aim and accuracy under pressure. This is why you get bonuses if you stand still (Archer's Focus).

Additionally, if you are an archer of some time and a professional adventurer even at level 1, it's assumed you have used a bow since you could pick one up - your body has already adapted to using a bow along with your muscles, tendons, and skeletal system. They looked at skeletons of archers from the middle ages and discovered that their bodies had changed significantly over years or decades of practice, even at a young age, especially with longbows.

Then there is the "magic" factor where you aren't even drawing a bow as you would with a traditional riser and string. You just pull back and your bolt is there to fire.

And of course no bow you find on an adventure takes into account your draw length - which is kind of essential.

All to say, strength bonus to damage should really only play a small factor considering how homogeneous most bows are in DDO (long or short). Being extremely weak has an effect whether you are using a bow or wielding a sword for obvious reasons. The same sword will do more damage with more strength behind the blow. An arrow will do more damage with more accuracy behind the blow but every shot from the same bow will have the same velocity and strength of impact.
 

Oliphant

Well-known member
Longbows have draw strength just like compound bows. Your STR determines the draw strength of the bow you can use, thus the damage.
 
Top