Tanking questions and general info.

[Tanyajanfel]

working on tanking a few raids. have been learning a new role of tanking, and been loving it. ran through a few r10 legendary quests and it was alot of fun. defiantly a change in roles, and tactics. have... many questions. but will try to keep it limited.

working on TON dragon. and for the life of me, i can not figure out what causes the dot. started off with no problem, dps dragon, no dot. shortly after the marl room, they start getting dot and it goes up to 30. almost a wipe... but we saved it. i wasnt doing anything different as far as i know.

1- the dragon did jump into the corner, but i continued dps, was only off for a second or two. does that mater?

2- what "counts" as dps'ing the dragon? (im swinging, hitting, and doing damage) is there anything that does a better job? dots? ranged? like, would i be better off switching to a ranged so i dont have any down time at those times it blows me away? which is only a few seconds?

3- i heard that sometimes you need to reposition the dragon, but that also feels like a double edged sword, as it sometimes doesnt move? and then you spend time away no dps'ing it...

i feel like i had an easier time on my healer tanking the dragon, but i have no idea what i did different.

do the fire ellies matter?

most of the other raids i dont seem to have a problem with, vipers has been alot of fun.
any help would be greatly appreciated. (will have more questions about other raids later)

 

[J1NG]

The DoT effect from Karliath is triggered when the game pathing "thinks" Karliath can't reach the players; such as when everyone in the Raid has gone through to the next section leaving no one there (such as when you Solo the raid).

This unfortunately also means that if - for any reason, Karliath is unable to path to you as the tank in the main room (Enemies can block Karliath's pathing), then Karliath will instead treat it as though there is no one engaging them. And so will start the DoT up (that affects everyone in the Raid).

So ideally you need to make sure the Dracolich is right on top of you, or you are kiting them around and they are still following you. The moment they stop moving, you need to assess whether you need to go in, melee to get them to aggro on you and calculate a path to engage you and then move away again (if you kite). This is one issue with face tanking Karliath and that you won't know if for whatever reason Karliath considers itself unable to calculate a path to you and began the DoT again. Whilst if Kiting, it's easier to see when they're not moving towards you anymore.

The Fire Elementals can be an issue as their ground circles can cause hefty damage and if you are debuffed enough, can cause noticeable damage still. But realistically someone should have tackled them for you so you only needed to handle Karliath (the Dracolich) tanking duties only rather than try and tackle everything in the room alone.

J1NG

 

[Epicsoul]

If you're tanking the dragon and you party members are still getting dots, it's going to be an aggro/positioning issue. I would try moving the dragon and then make sure not to kite too much, as they can sometimes cause dots on the party even if someone is in the room with the dragon.

 

[vryxnr]

It's not about you DPSing Karlaith, it's about Karlaith being able to target and attack YOU. There are - unfortunately - a few spots, particularly along the western wall from my experience, where Karlaith's targetting goes haywire and it starts attacking air instead of you, and the chance of it doing the raid wide DoT goes up. Sometimes it just does it anyways, but for me, standing still in front of it's face will let it attack without the DoT going off. Elevation changes can also cause issues, such as the north-west corner's dirt pile.

Repositioning is vital for one instance: destroying the phylactery. The phylactery has to be held by someone standing in a dead magic zone, they must not be blocking, and they must get hit by Karlaith's stream of fire breath attack (the small spit-balls of fire do not count; the long stream in a line, and the long stream that arcs wide in front of it, do count).

The Fire Eles can be annoying, as the circles they place can do a lot of damage. Their normal attacks also give stacks of the fire absorption debuff (as does Karlaith's attacks), but those cap at 20 stacks.

Look at all the ninja's ninjaing me today.

 

[Tanyajanfel]

thank you very much for the response! that sounds like that should be it, the elevation, and western wall. its a relief to have at least some idea whats going on. i havnt been kiting, and just facing and dps. but when it jumped i followed. so i will try that next time and see if that does the trick.

yeah, its been frustrating, went in there solo to test out viability, and had no problem with the damage from the dragon or ellies, and didn't get a dot over 1. so going in with a raid group was a bit jarring, without to many suggestions for what i can do different.

thank you again, looking forward to trying this out again.

 

[HighLordPudding]

great info here, thanks for sharing

I also put a link for this on my guild forums so our various tanks will hopefully see this.

I was also told that the end fight can be pretty fast with back to back time stops casted on the dragon as well as other debuffs (not sure what other debuffs though)

 

[vryxnr]

great info here, thanks for sharing

I also put a link for this on my guild forums so our various tanks will hopefully see this.

I was also told that the end fight can be pretty fast with back to back time stops casted on the dragon as well as other debuffs (not sure what other debuffs though)

Time Stop IS amazing, but the more of these you can stack the better: (one of my friends made a google.doc listing debuffs that stack) HERE

 

[Tanyajanfel]

happy to say that the raid went alot smoother this time around. still got some dots, i think this was related to a dungeon alert? when they went to take out the portal keepers? but it was much less then last time and didn't cause a near wipe. stayed away from the west wall, and corners, kept it in the middle and seemed to go pretty smooth. thank you again for the help with that!

now wondering about vipers. been getting through it pretty smooth, but looking for info on the healing amp de buff? i didnt see anything on wiki, and its pretty hard to check it out mid quest. luckly i had an amazing healer, who was able to heal me through it, but wanted to see if there was anything i can do to avoid/mitigate it better. (short of just having more healing amp) didnt seem like curse pots, disease pots, or the lantern did anything. i did hear some talking about switching out tanks? again, doesnt seem to big of a deal right now (we are just doing normal, and hard) but... one day... who knows... or any other good tips on tanking vipers?

 

[ChickenMobile]

now wondering about vipers. been getting through it pretty smooth, but looking for info on the healing amp de buff?
...
i did hear some talking about switching out tanks?

Ran this one today and Malice of the Dark Lord stacked up to 10 times on Hard difficulty. According to the wiki would this would mean a max healing amp reduction of 500 (50 per stack) but believe it is actually more around 250 (25 per stack). With full stacks I still had bright green numbers on pos healing received with 300 Healing Amp. There might be some sort of AC strip debuff too as my AC lessened sometimes, but couldn't figure out where it was coming from.

I think the trick here is lots of DR and Temporary HP stacked with over-the-top Healing Amplification. Physical, Acid, Poison, Evil(?)/Alignment are the big hitters - make sure to get these absorps/resistances somehow. Memoriam has the most Competence Heal Amp bonus, things like Crownblade Armor (RARE) gives good bonus - Healing Hands of House Jorasco (also great for Displacement guard) with Belt of Bold Brilliance/Saviness/Wild Wisdom is much easier to obtain. Add another +30 Artifact & Profane in gear and bonuses from enhancements - and you're set.

Swapping tanks could be a strategy, however it's probably not necessary. A good healer and good enough healing amp will get you through it - even on reaper difficulty. It is very important players keep up with killing the trash in this one or the raid can easily wipe.

I suggest if you want to learn more, watch a video with commentation. I watched Axel's here after our guild ran it for the first time and he gave some useful info.