The gear grind is too much

[GrizzlyOso]

Unfortunately you missed the entirety of what l was saying and then took it personally for some odd reason.

My apologies for posting something l thought might be helpful to others, but somehow managed to offend you. I will try harder to word things better in the future in the hopes it will make you feel better my friend.

Also noticed as l was upgrading to Dino weapon, l was Not using a L20 weapon!

You get the free weapon in R/L at L20 but L29 weapon.

So maybe no surprise this toon still does OK near cap R1.

I'm not offended in any way, nor do I take it personally. I'm not even sure what I WOULD take personally. I am judging you more though.

 

[GrizzlyOso]

None of the letters in RPG stands for gear. You're thinking of Diablo.

I almost wrote action RPG because I knew some pedant would say something like this. But I stand by my point for any video game, and honestly any table top RPG, people LOVE getting gear. Updating your gear sheet, the best. In fact, I don't know what you're talking about at all.

 

[Bjond]

None of the letters in RPG stands for gear.

!! !!

SSG needs that in great big banner above the dev cubes.

 

[IcyLokidottir]

I want the medium-grade min/max where I have good/modern items with augs filled, but not chasing M/R/C on them. And the occasional old M/R/C item that I'm fitting into my modern gearsets lol.

Rare items are like the same grade to me as chasing M/R/C on a non-rare item.

Like I'm planning an undead build, and I want Lesser Oblivion - neither of the builds I'm considering can use an orb so it's literally 14% Ins Void Lore vs 5% of Pomura's. If I could use an orb there'd be Stygian Wrath which would be good enough for me at 13%, but it is neither a runearm or a shield.

If I could run a handful of quests or get it as a chain reward (which would be un-boosted) I would happily do so, but instead I'm gonna run it until my eyes bleed or give up.

Don't worry I got like two of em so far... (because I wasn't lookin for them) xd

But still haven't seen Selune's Light

i think the idea of being able to trade in tokens you earn by doing quests for some of the rares might be a neat option

 

[Graceunderpressure]

Oh yeah, Salt is absolutely amazing for easy gearing. Fey is objectively nicer in heroics, but far more work to farm. On HC, I do Salt and Menechtarun in heroic then altar it into L20 gear.

IMHO, L3 is the ideal spot to stone up, too and look, there's salt right there at L3! L8 Lam gear is probably the next best step-up, but if you've been playing a while and already have Fey, IOD, RL, Sharn, the only gain from farming it would be so you can retire IOD/RL (and Lam farming is so intense, it's pretty far from Chill).

BUT, while Salt+Menech is ultra cheap and great for survival, it's not as nice for leveling speed as stepping up to Fey, IOD, Chill, RL, and Sharn during heroic and far FAR weaker at-cap for raiding and RXP.

Like l mentioned earlier, this wasn’t planned, it just sort of happened and once it did, ended up being a very interesting perspective on the complete opposite side of the gear grind as my whole goal was to get to cap as simply as possible and with as little gear along the way.

Not something l’ve ever done with any other toon and not something l would do with any toon l was planning on TR’g as there would be an added incentive for putting together some sets to make the next life easier of course.

Still, l thought it was a good eg. Of how one Could play the game with very little grind and still be more than powerful enough to engage in most aspects of the game while continuing to put more sets together as you go.

 

[Graceunderpressure]

I'm not offended in any way, nor do I take it personally. I'm not even sure what I WOULD take personally. I am judging you more though.

Happy to hear it! You sounded pretty bent out of shape, but that’s the problem with the written word, sometimes hard to tell how engaged the person behind the keyboard is.

 

[JustHavingFunBro]

I have to agree.... does anyone even like repeating the same quest dozens of times? Or does anyone even think this is good gameplay?

Compared to for example, every level appropriate quest can give you an upgrade, or you collect tokens and can buy stuff, like many other MMOs do it.

The old gear drop system with 5 items max per quests (no rares and without augments diluting the table) was more bearable, but still it could take ages to get a specific item.

I love how ESO does it. You get something every single time from the dungeon loot - usually multiple somethings as dungeons have mini-bosses and tresure chest that also drop loot. It fills out a "card" and you will not get another piece of the same loot until the entire deck is full. Meaning until you've gotten everything from that dungeon.

 

[Bjond]

I love how ESO does it. You get something every single time from the dungeon loot

Yeah, filling out the "sticker book" for dungeon sets is one of the most fun parts of ESO.

If they ever add an auction house, I'd go back and play it again. No AH killed it for me when I started crafting.

 

[Dandonk]

Update to my Heartshard grinding:

I got some help from my guild, used some gimpy old toons, and even used some AS for rerolling that I got from selling upgrade stuff on ASAH for the quiver...

I am now at 157 chest pulls. To noone's surprise at all, I still haven't got it or even seen it.

I thought games were supposed to be fun.

Silly Stupid Grind?

 

[Oliphant]

I thought games were supposed to be fun is the central issue here.

 

[dur]

I thought games were supposed to be fun is the central issue here.

You didn't get the memo?

 

[Indyanna]

Agreed.

I know many a player who have taken extensive breaks from the game because of gear grinding.. really wish they would look at their loot systems. It’s not just rare gear, how many runs through lamordia to get all your mats?

It’s killing players souls and it shouldn’t

 

[Oliphant]

I think rare items per se are ok, this recent math is just unhealthy

 

[Phaedra]

I think rare items per se are ok, this recent math is just unhealthy

Sure, if you mean things like PLIS with a 0.1% drop chance from any chest anywhere in the game, but MD+ rare is (allegedly) 25% of getting the one you want of 10% of getting a rare drop of 33-43% of getting a named item at all.

 

[Oliphant]

Yeah, the MD and Lamordia rare stuff is not fun and even worse than just not fun.

 

[Bigglesbee]

It's the player's own choice to repeat quests in order to get very specific items. None is that required that it forces you into that.

I farm sometimes now... but if it's not fun then I just don't. Game has been totally playable with the loot I had found without even knowing it existed (nice surprises found by chance in random chests), just by playing.

Also there's crafting, augments...

Apologists always say this in every game where loot grind is an issue, but the counter-argument's logic is always the same and always better: if getting the gear doesn't matter, then why not make the gear more obtainable since at least that makes people have more fun and leave the game happier?

The only answer is that SSG sees enough people spend shards on the rare gear to be worth the largely negative feedback regarding rare gear.

 

[Monkey_Archer]

The only answer is that SSG sees enough people spend shards on the rare gear to be worth the largely negative feedback regarding rare gear.

This is obviously what they think, but I believe its incorrect. Its like focusing on the trees and missing the forest.

Yes they can obviously see how much money is generated by shard rerolls, but how much potential revenue is lost when those same players get burnt out and don't even log in for months at a time is not so easy with shallow data analysis.

A 33% drop chance at a "rare token": trade 50 for a rare item (or similar system) could easily have players spending much more on rerolls in the long run than the miserable lottery we have now. I know that I'd be much more willing to drop a few rerolls if it actually guaranteed some progress.

 

[Wizard]

Yeah, if you aboslutely *have* to include gacha (which is really don't agree with), to keep the game running and making enough money. Then at the very least have a "guarantee". All the successful gacha games these days have them too.

And the successful MMO aren't so stingy with loot in general. (except "old school ones", which DDO isn't , it's post WoW)

 

[Bjond]

This is obviously what they think, but I believe its incorrect. Its like focusing on the trees and missing the forest.

100%

I think they're focusing on making a few people pay more when they could easily tempt everyone: make it an item buy from a chest instead of a reroll chance. If the free one didn't cough it up, pay shards and select the one you want. Buying good, gambling bad.

The entire reason players reroll is to reduce farming, not because popping chests is fun. The introduction of rares didn't do much. What killed rerolls was the 5x bigger loot tables.

Farming used to be 1~3 runs with rerolls. Now it's ransack with rerolls and still no item. That falls into the realm of operant conditioning. Works for a bit, but then folk learn to not do that because no result.

 

[Kimbere]

None of the letters in RPG stands for gear. You're thinking of Diablo.

WUT!? You're telling me RPG doesn't stand for Reaper Points and Gear? That's crazy talk.