The Math On Rare Loot Is Counterproductive For The Game

Grunndi

Well-known member
How many people have either ignored MD loot entirely or stopped playing altogether due to this mechanic? A lot. I know many.
I’m in the “Ignore Rare loot” camp. I’ve used a couple MD items here and there, but my endgame gear sets are still largely Vecna and IoD based.

Once you figure out the Tetris for a nice setup (and get some decent boosts), it becomes tricky to swap anything without a complete overhaul. And if that requires a piece of Rare loot… just not worth the effort…

Been at least a month since I’ve run anything in MD, but when I’m not in the mood to level an Alt I’ll still farm Vecna and IoD for better boosts.
 

l_remmie

Well-known member
The health of the game is not EG7's concern.

It's shareholder value right now.

Rareloot was forced from the top and SSG isn't allowed to talk about it.
 

Mornyngstar

Well-known member
What they should do is update the artwork of older content items and have them as rare drops in the older content. (With extra sparkle!)
 

Kimbere

Well-known member
Been saying for years that the only way to win when SSG plays stupid games like this new rare loot for standard effects stuff is to not play it.

And yes, due to the rare loot BS in MD and the subsequent quests, I will also not be pre-ordering any expansions. I'll wait until after they're out to see what lame shenanigans they contain before ordering going forward.

At this point, I could have completely skipped the MD pack and been perfectly fine.
 

Lominal

Well-known member
There was zero disclosure on which loot was rare or that there was rare loot at all!
I hate the rare loot system, but we knew that rare loot existed and which items from lammania (vendor had a "show me the rare loot" option). they never gave us the rare drop rates, and we only know because they were data mined.
 

Anurakh

Little Nixie
I hate the rare loot system, but we knew that rare loot existed and which items from lammania (vendor had a "show me the rare loot" option). they never gave us the rare drop rates, and we only know because they were data mined.
Nah, putting it in a special section of Lammania isn't enough. They should give us the loot list here in the forums, and they should add the rare tag and the drop rates in the case of rare items. After all, to know if it's worth spending shards, we need to know the odds.

They're too opaque.

And they're too lazy. Before, they used to post the loot list on the forum; now they let Zavina or some other kind soul do it. No! It shouldn't be like this. It's their job.
 

Fallout47

Well-known member
Let's take a quest like "Voices of the Dead". It's a 6 minute quest or so, and has 10 items on the loot table. If you go into elite and ransack it with 6 characters, you'll get 48 shots at items, and pull on average ~15-16 items, assuming a 33% drop rate, which seems pretty accurate. Higher skulls increase this marginally, supposedly, but the difference isn't massive. If you're looking for a common item, there's a good chance that you'll pull it within that hour.

Taking the 3% rare and 97% common rate that most people seem to agree on, that means that you'll get about half a rare item per ransack. However, in that quest, 7 items are common, but 3 are rare. So you'll get about .15 of the item that you really want per week. So, on average, it'll take about 6 weeks to get the item that you're looking for. And that's with a full group with all passing.

Solo? Obviously 6 times as long. See you in half a year or so, assuming you have average luck.

There's no guarantee that you'll get it within a year, even if you spend the ~$400 that it would take to reroll on a single character every time.

Why is this counterproductive?

First, it encourages just running alt accounts through the quest because the drop rates are so poor. Yes, you can run with people but if everyone knows the loot is rare they'll probably need or at least want it too. At the very least, good luck finding 5 people to run through a quest for an hour a week for many, many, many weeks in a row. While this is fine for their bottom line, this isn't great for the social aspect of the game.

Second, burnout. This isn't like dino bones where you feel like you're working towards something. Because you very well might not be working towards anything.

Third, rerolls obviously double your shot at getting an item, but doubling a tiny droprate (that is not disclosed at all, is that even legal?) feels very exploitative.

Fourth, ironically, it actually decreases replayability in some ways. On common loot, you can maybe think about getting a better curse or a mythic1/2/3/4 item to upgrade your existing gear. But RARE LOOT? Ain't nobody refarming out a golden age shield or artifact ring for a mythic bonus or a curse.

Fifth, it erodes trust in the game developers. The first week MD came out, there was a lot of "so....has anyone actually seen any of these artifacts?" with most people responding "nope, and we've ransacked everything, no one in my guild has gotten anything, what is with the loot in this pack!1?".

There was zero disclosure on which loot was rare or that there was rare loot at all!

When you buy a pack, you aren't exactly buying the items, but when a solo player who doesn't reroll will often need the better part of a year of ransacking to maybe get an item....that's total dung.

Rare loot should either be a niche item that doesn't impact gearing or build (jibbers) or a slight but unneeded upgrade (mythic/curse/reaper items, rare filigrees). I think rare loot is GREAT for keeping people playing especially the more results-focused, hardcore players. But it has to be done right, and it certainly wasn't with MD.

How many people have either ignored MD loot entirely or stopped playing altogether due to this mechanic? A lot. I know many. Making a quick buck but splintering the playerbase is not actually a winning long term strategy. Most players enjoy having a sense of progress, but when the reward is nowhere near proportionate to the time and energy invested, that sour taste in your mouth eventually leads to resenting the game.
Remember, in order to run alt accounts through the content, each has to have purchased the pack. Stating the obvious, I know. But this is win-win for SSG.
 

Mechgraber

Well-known member
He probably meant alt characters on one's main account.
No I meant alt accounts, which is implying that it's ($$$) a big part of the reason why SSG turns a blind eye to those running multiple accounts, even with "assistance". It's not really good for the game and tons of people do it, myself included, but that's a discussion for another day.
 

Mechgraber

Well-known member
I hate the rare loot system, but we knew that rare loot existed and which items from lammania (vendor had a "show me the rare loot" option). they never gave us the rare drop rates, and we only know because they were data mined.

I did not know that.

But then again, if I did not know that, then the majority of people didn't either. They need to be far, far, far more transparent with this type of stuff.
 

Elminster

Sage of Shadowdale
Dude…

I’m actually getting tired of these threads.

They know we absolutely despise this rare loot nonsense.
 
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PersonMan

Well-known member
Remember, in order to run alt accounts through the content, each has to have purchased the pack. Stating the obvious, I know. But this is win-win for SSG.
No I meant alt accounts, which is implying that it's ($$$) a big part of the reason why SSG turns a blind eye to those running multiple accounts, even with "assistance". It's not really good for the game and tons of people do it, myself included, but that's a discussion for another day.
Incidentally the 6 accounts playing at once only need have spent real money if they are getting the content before it hits the points store. With the external software people are tentatively permitted to use, farming points should be no more or less difficult than farming chests.
Certainly I have seen one who purchased the MD ultimate on all accounts (all riding carpets), but most I have seen in game world have no indication of having spent money.
 
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