The monk changes are nice, but if you want to shift the meta . . .

[Fisto Mk I]

not one melee tree is supporting imbues.... why?

KotC, HM, DH, DA, DL... really, it's all non-melee trees, right?

 

[Dalsheel]

They should be posting specific builds and the aspects of them that are overpeforming;

Inquis has double the doubleshot it's supposed to have. Repeaters have triple the doubleshot they're supposed to have.

 

[rabidfox]

Inquis has double the doubleshot it's supposed to have. Repeaters have triple the doubleshot they're supposed to have.

They nerf'd the attack speed and reload speed on them in that same update (and since they changed that for performance, they're not going to undo it). The doubleshot change was to offset that.

 

[Teh_Troll]

Nerf 'em all and let Lolth sort them up.

 

[Marshal_Lannes]

Naw. People keep saying stuff like "nerf xbow". They should be posting specific builds and the aspects of them that are overpeforming; because we all know that SSG loves the nuke over the scalpel. It's no different than "nerf caster" or "nerf melee" threads. Details and specifics matter.

Don't call for a crossbow nerf

Post a thoughtful and thorough analysis of why those specific crossbow builds are substantially outperforming other non meta builds.

Close the loophole, but don't just nuke the entire playstyle to bring the loophole into balance (as the devs usually do)

Exactly. When people call for blanket nerfs to "crossbows" you need to spell out specifically what you believe is so overperforming on them. Just saying "doubleshot" is not an answer.

 

[Neo]

nerf ranger, bow and twf thanks

 

[Kimbere]

The real meta is to play what you like and stop worrying about what other people are doing.

That's the hardest meta to learn though. Few people ever do.

 

[bleach]

And all the non-meta xbow builds

LOL

 

[droid327]

The real meta is to play what you like and stop worrying about what other people are doing.

That's the hardest meta to learn though. Few people ever do.

The problem with that isolationist logic is that the content keeps creeping in power along with the meta, not with your flavor build

"Play what you like" eventually becomes "you can't play this content"

 

[droid327]

Inquis has double the doubleshot it's supposed to have. Repeaters have triple the doubleshot they're supposed to have.

They have as much as they always should have

Double shot is just a straight linear scalar for ranged dps. If bows and throwers can get 150% bonus dps than dxb and rxb can get 150% too

Twf can get 100% off hand dstrike too, is that too much? Even without that it only has a 25% penalty, not 50 or 66%. And they get an actual second weapon slot to balance against.

 

[Kimbere]

The problem with that isolationist logic is that the content keeps creeping in power along with the meta, not with your flavor build

"Play what you like" eventually becomes "you can't play this content"

Nah. You're missing the exact point, which is why it's so hard to learn this meta.

Happiness and enjoyment come from having something meet your expectations.

Playing what you like is a choice. All choices have results, consequences, and/or limitations. More importantly however, all expectations have minimum requirements that need to be met in order to succeed.

To meet expectations, you can either make a choice and adjust your expectations based on the limitations of the choice OR you can set your expectations and make a choice that will enable those expectations.

The meta is setting realistic expectations and making choices that ensure that your expectations are met.

 

[Tilomere]

Naw. People keep saying stuff like "nerf xbow". They should be posting specific builds and the aspects of them that are overpeforming; because we all know that SSG loves the nuke over the scalpel. It's no different than "nerf caster" or "nerf melee" threads. Details and specifics matter.

Ok, I'll be specific, remove the dot from Shoot First, as a T3 cleave is balanced to generally only have the cleave ability, or at most a 1d6 stacking dot, like AA's inferno shot.

If that isn't enough, also apply the standard 50% offhand doubleshot penalty to be akin to dual wield other weapon styles.

 

[Redoubt]

Naw. People keep saying stuff like "nerf xbow". They should be posting specific builds and the aspects of them that are overpeforming; because we all know that SSG loves the nuke over the scalpel. It's no different than "nerf caster" or "nerf melee" threads. Details and specifics matter.

But this is exactly the issue. It would be great is the company learned to use a scalpel.

I know multiple people in game who no longer post builds because they don't want to draw attention to whatever synergy build or gear they found. The community is worse off for it.

 

[droid327]

Nah. You're missing the exact point, which is why it's so hard to learn this meta.

Happiness and enjoyment come from having something meet your expectations.

Playing what you like is a choice. All choices have results, consequences, and/or limitations. More importantly however, all expectations have minimum requirements that need to be met in order to succeed.

To meet expectations, you can either make a choice and adjust your expectations based on the limitations of the choice OR you can set your expectations and make a choice that will enable those expectations.

The meta is setting realistic expectations and making choices that ensure that your expectations are met.

Power creep is a demonstrable problem, and when builds get left behind by meta creep, that's a problem with game design, and not with your expectations of being able to keep playing at a competitive level

I think it's a fair complaint to say don't let the meta keep creeping... Not just telling people "it's ok, you just need to learn to accept you suck now"

 

[Monkey_Archer]

Nah. You're missing the exact point, which is why it's so hard to learn this meta.

Happiness and enjoyment come from having something meet your expectations.

Playing what you like is a choice. All choices have results, consequences, and/or limitations. More importantly however, all expectations have minimum requirements that need to be met in order to succeed.

To meet expectations, you can either make a choice and adjust your expectations based on the limitations of the choice OR you can set your expectations and make a choice that will enable those expectations.

The meta is setting realistic expectations and making choices that ensure that your expectations are met.

Ah yes, yes, I understand now. If I expect to contribute nothing, then I will attain happiness when the inquisitives complete the quest for me.

Thank you for your lesson on the wise art of getting carried.

 

[rabidfox]

Ok, I'll be specific, remove the dot from Shoot First, as a T3 cleave is balanced to generally only have the cleave ability, or at most a 1d6 stacking dot, like AA's inferno shot.

Nice, that's a simple surgical slice that doesn't impact all xbow attacks & builds.

 

[Kimbere]

Ah yes, yes, I understand now. If I expect to contribute nothing, then I will attain happiness when the inquisitives complete the quest for me.

Thank you for your lesson on the wise art of getting carried.

Clearly you don't understand.

 

[Kimbere]

Power creep is a demonstrable problem, and when builds get left behind by meta creep, that's a problem with game design, and not with your expectations of being able to keep playing at a competitive level

I think it's a fair complaint to say don't let the meta keep creeping... Not just telling people "it's ok, you just need to learn to accept you suck now"

Ok, sure. Let me know when you convince SSG that a swim cleric should be able to solo R10s easily...

If I want to run endgame content at meta level difficulties, I run meta builds.

If I want to run a flavor build for fun, I run flavor build difficulty and content.

Seems like a simple concept to me.

For the record, I'm not debating whether it's *fair* or not.

It's not, but this is SSG we're talking about. Balanced and fair left the building years ago and isn't coming back anytime soon. Expecting otherwise is just setting yourself up for disappointment.

 

[droid327]

Ok, sure. Let me know when you convince SSG that a swim cleric should be able to solo R10s easily...

If I want to run endgame content at meta level difficulties, I run meta builds.

If I want to run a flavor build for fun, I run flavor build difficulty and content.

Seems like a simple concept to me.

For the record, I'm not debating whether it's *fair* or not.

It's not, but this is SSG we're talking about. Balanced and fair left the building years ago and isn't coming back anytime soon. Expecting otherwise is just setting yourself up for disappointment.

No one is complaining that their meme build is a meme build

People complain when the legit B or A tier build they're enjoying playing gets knocked down to C tier or worse because it caught a stray meant for the S tier cheese build SSG was trying to nerf

What everyone here is worried about is them throwing all inquis back into the wasteland at cap, just to get rid of the 14/4/4s that might be overperforming right now

 

[kmoustakas]

I vote we nerf the devs!