Things Lamordia Needs to Add/Update to Save DPS Casters

[doctorjazz]

I'm going to keep this one short: Elemental DPS Casters are dead at endgame. The concept of nuking past Isle of Dread is a figment of the imagination. For a DnD IP, feeling pigeonholed at endgame to sacrifice all my spellpower to ensure a finger of death or turn to frog lands is the worst feeling when every other DPS type gets to stack purely damage in their main sentient weapon. Push raiding (r7+) incurs such a penalty to overall DPS for casters that it becomes quickly a wasted raid group slot for a caster to hit a boss due to mana limitations and the extra (and completely unneeded) elemental damage nerf. I do not wish to nerf other DPS specs, simply bring casters up to the bar that Melee and Ranged are setting.

Here's a few suggestions (consider each on their own, not all implemented at the same time):

- Raid fili: +15 USP (rare an additional +15 USP) -- Set 1 stacks DCs, Set 2 stacks USP, crit chance, crit dmg
- Update DC affixes/augments to be line with tactics DC augments: for example, ML32 augments/affixes should be +16 individual school enhancement, +6 all spell school insight bonus, +3 quality bonus -- why is utility getting better treatment than necessary DCs for damage?
- Consider revamping Feydark Illusionist to have a multi selector "Spell Trance" for INT/CHA/WIS. -- Even just purely for DCs with no added damage, this would go miles to solve the DPS caster issue.
- Create opportunities for casters to spike or maintain 100% critical chance. 100% doublestrike exists for melees with way better multipliers, and I don't need to talk about the tomfoolery that comes with uncapped doubleshot
- Augments to dramatically increase or remove Max Caster Level.
- Update Wild Mage +2CL/MCL toggle to be protected by Chaos Control I & II or require a spell point cost increase like a metamagic.
- Remove R7+ Nerf to elemental damage
- Revert Dragon's Breath Nerf

 

[justin credible]

Are you kidding? IKs and spell CC are ridiculously penalized these days. What we need is to stop pampering weapon users so much.

Why does the Dragonlord have CC that works on everything, even constructs and undead? Why is it so ridiculously easy for them to raise DC while spell DC is pure hell? Why the hell do melee trees have a weird capstone with half the cooldown of equivalent caster spells, and on top of that, with much higher and easier-to-obtain DCs? And all this, while melee toons have superior survivability and superior DPS. Come on.

yeah, if casters got the equivalent of fighter tactics feats +8 to all dc from one feat or +20 from taking them all. we have to spend a feat for +1 to one spell school

 

[justin credible]

You'd think a 20th level sorc who can manipulate the weave like origami could drop titanic killers like they were nothing.

instead the sorc capstone is 10% increase in spell cost, its nuts

 

[Thebento]

I'm going to keep this one short: Elemental DPS Casters are dead at endgame. The concept of nuking past Isle of Dread is a figment of the imagination. For a DnD IP, feeling pigeonholed at endgame to sacrifice all my spellpower to ensure a finger of death or turn to frog lands is the worst feeling when every other DPS type gets to stack purely damage in their main sentient weapon. Push raiding (r7+) incurs such a penalty to overall DPS for casters that it becomes quickly a wasted raid group slot for a caster to hit a boss due to mana limitations and the extra (and completely unneeded) elemental damage nerf. I do not wish to nerf other DPS specs, simply bring casters up to the bar that Melee and Ranged are setting.

Here's a few suggestions (consider each on their own, not all implemented at the same time):

- Raid fili: +15 USP (rare an additional +15 USP) -- Set 1 stacks DCs, Set 2 stacks USP, crit chance, crit dmg
- Update DC affixes/augments to be line with tactics DC augments: for example, ML32 augments/affixes should be +16 individual school enhancement, +6 all spell school insight bonus, +3 quality bonus -- why is utility getting better treatment than necessary DCs for damage?
- Consider revamping Feydark Illusionist to have a multi selector "Spell Trance" for INT/CHA/WIS. -- Even just purely for DCs with no added damage, this would go miles to solve the DPS caster issue.
- Create opportunities for casters to spike or maintain 100% critical chance. 100% doublestrike exists for melees with way better multipliers, and I don't need to talk about the tomfoolery that comes with uncapped doubleshot
- Augments to dramatically increase or remove Max Caster Level.
- Update Wild Mage +2CL/MCL toggle to be protected by Chaos Control I & II or require a spell point cost increase like a metamagic.
- Remove R7+ Nerf to elemental damage
- Revert Dragon's Breath Nerf

Hi, I understand that the caster's spicsd strikes in general are really crap, but a lot of this is just a bit of whining.

In my opinion, as a caster coming from paper and pencil RPGs... it's that they have a terrible life to level and are the strongest when they reach a high level, unfortunately in DDO it's not like that...

 

[Thebento]

I think Mobs should get more Spell saves specifically against Insta Kills and enchantment/Illu while we simutaneously buff general casting DCs so we have a clear cut of where a Nuker reliably hits their spells but cant really Fod / reliably Hold mass without Putting in effort still Makes DC casting desirable and creates a clear Line between the two of them

When I see these messages, the only thing that comes to mind is... whoever complains about IK has never done one. I have an endgame one, it has all the lives, it has everything you can imagine, maximum reaper points, MD gear, anyway... to get to 130+ DC, and I tell you at r10 it still fails.

In the new base 35 quests it's easier...
Apart from the fact that you have to use a huge penetration spell.

Don't forget that if you fail your IK test, it's 8/80, either you kill or you don't do anything.

The nukers, for the most part, still do half the damage.

And I'm not even going to get into the merits of putting a rednamed/boss with an instakiller, it's a sad task, either you spend days trying to kill him or you can't even do it.

Improve the epic strikers' damage a little. I agree now that IKs have a lot of power, unfortunately there's no way to argue, it's something for those who have never done one or don't participate in r10 with a guild where there is one to know how complicated it is to maintain an effective one.

 

[justin credible]

When I see these messages, the only thing that comes to mind is... whoever complains about IK has never done one. I have an endgame one, it has all the lives, it has everything you can imagine, maximum reaper points, MD gear, anyway... to get to 130+ DC, and I tell you at r10 it still fails.

In the new base 35 quests it's easier...
Apart from the fact that you have to use a huge penetration spell.

Don't forget that if you fail your IK test, it's 8/80, either you kill or you don't do anything.

The nukers, for the most part, still do half the damage.

And I'm not even going to get into the merits of putting a rednamed/boss with an instakiller, it's a sad task, either you spend days trying to kill him or you can't even do it.

Improve the epic strikers' damage a little. I agree now that IKs have a lot of power, unfortunately there's no way to argue, it's something for those who have never done one or don't participate in r10 with a guild where there is one to know how complicated it is to maintain an effective one.

and melee is running around in r10 with ZERO hate generation, doing 1000 damage a swing, and the caster does 60 damage with a failed FoD and pulls agro, lol

 

[unforgiven_broken]

When I see these messages, the only thing that comes to mind is... whoever complains about IK has never done one. I have an endgame one, it has all the lives, it has everything you can imagine, maximum reaper points, MD gear, anyway... to get to 130+ DC, and I tell you at r10 it still fails.

In the new base 35 quests it's easier...
Apart from the fact that you have to use a huge penetration spell.

Don't forget that if you fail your IK test, it's 8/80, either you kill or you don't do anything.

The nukers, for the most part, still do half the damage.

And I'm not even going to get into the merits of putting a rednamed/boss with an instakiller, it's a sad task, either you spend days trying to kill him or you can't even do it.

Improve the epic strikers' damage a little. I agree now that IKs have a lot of power, unfortunately there's no way to argue, it's something for those who have never done one or don't participate in r10 with a guild where there is one to know how complicated it is to maintain an effective one.

I have done an IK and Saltmarsh Mobs having an effective 135 Dcs vs non will IK isnt fun Felt like Sahuagin have 3 Bazillion con on the other hands there are those quests where u just have 90% kills like framework

I think my comment was somewhat misunderstood I didnt mean to nerf Dc casters in anyway quiet the Opposite actually I wanna bring DC casters identity back by taking the CC aspect away from Nukers.... the exact Numbers on How i would do such a thing are for another day.... but in No shape or form is it meant as a "lets give all casters 15 Dcs but imply a 20 DC penalty on fod so dc casters suck even more in droam LOL"

the comment was also written with the general thought of making ddo less soloable which includes Nerfing/changing Melee and physical ranged characters too.... creating clear identities where Melees have reliable MELEE CC like dire charge/stunning blow but not BS like DL Breath but are clear Dps Monsters and dont get equalled or overshadowed by ranged..... Give Tanks more innitiative etc Intim is the buggiest bs to exist
give Healers More reasons to exist outside of r10 raids revert the heal changes so melees dont just primal scream thru their solo r10s and on and on.... give Disable device more reason to exist than just Bonus xp
Heck beside nerfing ranged to be at best 70% of their melee dps counterparts also take away their survivability a bit more or rather their kite capabilities... I dont think IK are OP at all right now.... I just believe that if u nerf everyone while making IK different from nukers u actually make them have a Purpose.... there are archers on the ledge? well good Luck with your dire charge and if yo Alchs wanna actually Hit them bottles and not evaded u better ask daddy Wizard....

 

[Smokewolf]

yeah, if casters got the equivalent of fighter tactics feats +8 to all dc from one feat or +20 from taking them all. we have to spend a feat for +1 to one spell school

Problem with this statement is that the Dev's will just rescale mobs to compensate. Meanwhile, your locking down feats that are going to be required from that point on. This is why DC's should mostly come from the base stats and gear as it allows players to have a variety of builds, without feeling unduly penalized.

 

[Smokewolf]

I have done an IK and Saltmarsh Mobs having an effective 135 Dcs vs non will IK isnt fun Felt like Sahuagin have 3 Bazillion con on the other hands there are those quests where u just have 90% kills like framework

I think my comment was somewhat misunderstood I didnt mean to nerf Dc casters in anyway quiet the Opposite actually I wanna bring DC casters identity back by taking the CC aspect away from Nukers.... the exact Numbers on How i would do such a thing are for another day.... but in No shape or form is it meant as a "lets give all casters 15 Dcs but imply a 20 DC penalty on fod so dc casters suck even more in droam LOL"

the comment was also written with the general thought of making ddo less soloable which includes Nerfing/changing Melee and physical ranged characters too.... creating clear identities where Melees have reliable MELEE CC like dire charge/stunning blow but not BS like DL Breath but are clear Dps Monsters and dont get equalled or overshadowed by ranged..... Give Tanks more innitiative etc Intim is the buggiest bs to exist
give Healers More reasons to exist outside of r10 raids revert the heal changes so melees dont just primal scream thru their solo r10s and on and on.... give Disable device more reason to exist than just Bonus xp
Heck beside nerfing ranged to be at best 70% of their melee dps counterparts also take away their survivability a bit more or rather their kite capabilities... I dont think IK are OP at all right now.... I just believe that if u nerf everyone while making IK different from nukers u actually make them have a Purpose.... there are archers on the ledge? well good Luck with your dire charge and if yo Alchs wanna actually Hit them bottles and not evaded u better ask daddy Wizard....

DC & DPS casting could be awesome if four things were done.

1) Being that most melees and range builds are performing well, NOW it's time to roll back the R7 + Reaper Penalties for casters.

2) Allow all Spells & SLA's to scale to the casters current level + enhancements + feats and gearing bonuses. (As the DnD gods intended)

3) With people soon transfering to 64 bit servers, mob AI should significantly improve. (Rolls eyes) Time to dial back the excessive mob stat-bloat and spell dice that's ridiculously prelivant in Epics.

4) When running R5-10's, not every mob needs Deathblock or Deathward, especially if the mob isn't able to cast those spells natively. For (expletive) sakes, this is what spell saves are for!

 

[Fenryn]

The huge hurdles that casters have to jump through in order to be effective has actually kept me from playing a full caster, and instead have moved to Kali's Dark Apostate build to feel like spells play a real part in what I do without needing the massive investment to just feel okay, never mind the problems just getting ready to play in high skulls.

 

[Vox]

The huge hurdles that casters have to jump through in order to be effective has actually kept me from playing a full caster, and instead have moved to Kali's Dark Apostate build to feel like spells play a real part in what I do without needing the massive investment to just feel okay, never mind the problems just getting ready to play in high skulls.

I'm sure Kali means well, but I am not sure that their builds represent quality endgame designs. Various levels of flavour maybe, some almost palatable.

You are on the nose with difficulty for casters. I have no idea why SSG think the current state of "balance" is ok.

 

[unforgiven_broken]

I'm sure Kali means well

Press X to doubt

 

[Vox]

Press X to doubt

Donate now!

But in all seriousness. The idea of a Feydark spell DC trance is brilliant.

As OP pointed out, DPS melee & ranged can just go full damage filigree. They get massive margins to tactics with gear. They don't risk running out of DPS or CC or instakills as there is no SP bar to exhaust.

Even just basic stuff like +15 stunning augment vs +6 spell DC augment.

OP has great ideas to help casters without diluting the power of melee & ranged.

I hope SSG takes note.

 

[danzig138]

These suggestions are just adhesive bandages on a sucking chest wound. The problem isn't spell damage, spell DCs, or melee damage or ranged damage. The problem is the ridiculously inflated HP numbers that critters have. Nothing is ever going to be quite right so long as the devs rely on the lazy, uninspired technique of inflating enemy HPs as a replacement for challenging, good encounters and design.

 

[Hobgoblin]

danzig mo.......


wait a tic that's actually accurate?