This is not ok

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Bobbryan2

Bobbryan2

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misterski said:
Rerolling is a choice. Farming for a specific item is a choice. I would much rather they remove rerolling for shards but it's probably one of their biggest money makers via selling shards so whatever.
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In practice... you realize that this fundamentally means the game is financed on the backs of degenerate gamblers.
Like.... I'm all for arguing this pure nihilistic free will and all that, but let's just remember the broader picture.

Do you know the research on the % of players that pay the biggest % of mobile games?

It's not a really pretty picture.
I don't think it's like that in this game. But it's worthwhile to avoid becoming that dystopia as well, by being wide-eyed about the eventual outcome.
 
Konsumer

Konsumer

Well-known member
OG DM said:
You're still doing exactly what they want you to do. The first step succeeded. Getting you into the system as a payor, while at the same time never guaranteeing a desired result.

Did anyone think the probability wouldn't be manipulated in order to increase the average number of rolls needed, which also increases the average amount of money paid in, to net said desired result?
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Predatory.
 
Drunken.dx

Drunken.dx

Well-known member
Dandonk said:
Truly, it is a masterpiece of predatory game mechanics.
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Not even remotely close.

Masterpiece would be something most players would approve of.

Is it predatory? Most certainly.

Is it bad decision? YES

Is it competent? LOL no.

Only ones who fall for this are either "whales" who don't look at price or people who... Let's say... Are better off never stepping inside of a casino. (sorry OP).

Many freemium games have much worse (for players) systems which are usually so put down you don't even realise you've been had.

DDO would be MUCH more profitable is certain person at SSG stops being obsessed with FOMO and actually tries few profitable f2p games to seek inspiration.
 
eartheyes

eartheyes

outerspacetruth
Konsumer said:
"if the only way you are going to enjoy ddo is by getting every piece of gear you want, I would strongly suggest a new hobby?"
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ok, so first that is not an assumption let alone assumptions?! that is an inquiry and a suggestion for future mental wellbeing.
 
I

intravenous

Well-known member
I have returned to the game 2 months or so ago, maybe 3 at most. I have 75% of the items from MD, including 5 legendary golden age weapons, 1 artifact ring, 7 rare augments, legendary robe of warblade, leg light armor of crownblade, etc.

i also have plenty of heroic rare list items. This is not a humble brag, its a reality check. its RNG and thats it. They are not nearly as rare as nebula or the mythic boosts from slavers.

you dont even have to buy shards. do the saga in MD legendary and sell the rare augments for shards.

rare list items in MD are easier to get than the raid set augments since its impossible to find people dont those raids anymore.
 
Bobbryan2

Bobbryan2

Well-known member
If you've been around a while, you will remember that (Not SSG, then Turbine) released DDO Unlimited. They wanted to include ways for people to get DDO points without paying money for them. It was a completely worthwhile goal for them, and laudable for them to do it. In addition to farming out favor, they initially allowed you to do those old predatory surveys that would give you DDO points when you finished them. If you've been around the internet for a while, you'll remember those things that keep asking for more and more private data, and then they don't even pay you out at the end, unless you order subscriptions.

None of this was Turbine's intention, of course... selling everyone's data out on predatory surveys in exchange for in game purchases. They got a lot of negative feedback about it, and they took it down. The entire thing lasted a week or two?

I just think it's important for SSG to get this feedback about rare items and rerolling, because I see it as SSG implementing some of mobile games most predatory gambling modes. I think people can be waaaay over the top talking about it here. There are mobile games were people drop entire paychecks, and have monthly budgets in the thousands, rerolling on character packs and the like. For the most part, people are complaining about dropping 30-60 dollars (while also having a time investiture of hours of their own time... a good thing in this context).

But I do think the feedback is important, because it's a good way to remind companies about the negative effects of those kinds of things downstream. When you let people gamble real money for fake items on a video game, it's easy for people to poo poo it that don't have those kinds of impulses. But there are people that do.


Just things to think about...
 
Nod

Nod

I don't work for SSG- I pay their bills.
All I’ll say is per the FTC (federal trade commission), chest rerolls could fall under their guidelines for loot boxes, particularly if the odds of obtaining specific rare items are not disclosed. Do with that what you will.

With that being said, please gamble and drink responsibly.
 
Konsumer

Konsumer

Well-known member
eartheyes said:
ok, so first that is not an assumption let alone assumptions?! that is an inquiry and a suggestion for future mental wellbeing.
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1- I said I, and my friends were rolling after one item. Not 'every piece of gear you want".
2- "I would strongly suggest a new hobby" No one asked for your armchair doctors psychological evaluation behind ones motives.
If a person has 11 of 12 items needed for a gearset, being enticed by an exploitative system to speed up the process with a predatory function isn't a sign of illness.
 
Bobbryan2

Bobbryan2

Well-known member
Svirfneblin said:
Right but how common is it in America ?
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Well... firstly... DDO is an international game, so what it allows people to do with currencies in their own countries is, strictly speaking, pertinent here.
Secondly... One could argue that it already IS required here, in America. SSG, would argue, vociferously, that chest pulls are not loot boxes and that no laws regulating the use of loot boxes apply to chest pulls as those are, legally speaking, distinct.
 
Jack Jarvis Esquire

Jack Jarvis Esquire

Well-known member
I'm not buying into the hyperbole here. It's only a game folks. If you see it as more than that, that's on you. The rare loot mechanic is neither predatory nor gambling. It is awful though.

I speak as someone who spent c.5k shards on rerolls, but won't do so again. Both are choices. My choices. I'm a grown up. I make my own mistakes. And I try to learn from them.

I won't be buying the top tier of Lamordia if it has rare loot. I may not buy any tier at all and just sit it out til the next expansion, whatever that is. Or wait and buy it for points. There is a whole spectrum of choice.l in there. The needle is pointing to the low spend end right now because of rare loot. We'll see...

Again. My choice. I'm not blaming SSG for me being stupid enough to spaff 5k shards on loot I eventually got. I blame myself for being that stupid. But I'm definitely not stupid enough to do it again.

And of course YMMV. But realise it's your choice. Your consequence. Nobody else's. 👍
 
D

DDO Gaming

Well-known member
Bobbryan2 said:
Well... firstly... DDO is an international game, so what it allows people to do with currencies in their own countries is, strictly speaking, pertinent here.
Secondly... One could argue that it already IS required here, in America. SSG, would argue, vociferously, that chest pulls are not loot boxes and that no laws regulating the use of loot boxes apply to chest pulls as those are, legally speaking, distinct.
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something about bleached chickens comes to mind :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
 
eartheyes

eartheyes

outerspacetruth
Konsumer said:
1- I said I, and my friends were rolling after one item. Not 'every piece of gear you want".
2- "I would strongly suggest a new hobby" No one asked for your armchair doctors psychological evaluation behind ones motives.
If a person has 11 of 12 items needed for a gearset, being enticed by an exploitative system to speed up the process with a predatory function isn't a sign of illness.
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man, you are super triggered...you probably do need a little break from ddo, go outside, pet some dogs or something...i hope you feel better soon, remember to take deep belly breaths, stay hydrated, get plenty of rest.

take care of yourself :)
 
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