Traps that dont have any trap warnings - BEWARE - a warning to new and casual hardcore players

[Col Kurtz]

When Hardcore toons Die, their corresponding player needs to hit a punching bag .
Punching at air in the forum would get tiring? I would think

 

[Falkor]

Perhaps just start over with a new thread, and tailor the information for hardcore players. If it's expanded beyond traps to point out constructive techniques, warnings, and guidance unique to HC ... it could be the first steps towards a 'playstyle guide' for your guild and approach.

 

[The Narc2]

Perhaps just start over with a new thread, and tailor the information for hardcore players. If it's expanded beyond traps to point out constructive techniques, warnings, and guidance unique to HC ... it could be the first steps towards a 'playstyle guide' for your guild and approach.

We dont really need a playstyle guide we are allowed to discuss events in guild after they happen, we discuss SSG cheese design and resolve those issues within the “Club”. This guide is solely to increase the awareness of these places to the general population especially newer and casual players doing hardcore. Its our way of helping them avoid loss of winter lute status.

 

[Col Kurtz]

seems fairly civil, though it drifted a bit> that's up to the thread starter to control. If its messy, then they make a new thread, or they forget it and go have a beer and fire up a fresh toon with a smile

 

[The Narc2]

seems fairly civil, though it drifted a bit> that's up to the thread starter to control. If its messy, then they make a new thread, or they forget it and go have a beer and fire up a fresh toon with a smile

Why would a thread giving warnings to players about broken traps be uncivil? I mean i guess of you are making reference to the players that hate hardcore trying to derail the thread, sure.

No need to fire up any new toons, would have to experience a death first.

 

[Igognito]

Pen and paper doesnt convert perfectly into a digital version, i thought SSG did a great job with their trapping system up until the point where they made undetectable traps, such as collapsable floors.

A digital game is unlikely to move at the pace of a pen and paper game, nobody is going to search every ten feet, but hey maybe we could give scouts a collapsable 10 foot pool and a stance they can enter which means they are poking and prodding with their 10 foot pole and can deteft these undetectable floors.

All we can do is provide other players likely to be exposed to such tactics a way to avoid it be revenue generating for SSG that these type of designs will be removed from the game.

P&p, official adventures of 2nd edition especially had plenty of unavoidable traps. Common description for the DM was: choose randomly a player, their character dies from xyz reason. Make them a new character.

I agree with you that some traps are not following the DDO trap rules, but I don't think it was made maliciously from the devs.

Boxes, don't represent the mechanism controller. Just s way that you can disable the trap. The local inhabitants might enable/disable/avoid the trap in other ways.

I also want to praise DDO for the trap variety, and interesting challenges they have added in the game! I would like more unavoidable traps, but survivable.
Example, fall in a pit (feather fall protects you) but you can't exit now unless someone can throw you a rope from above or if you have a dd.
Cheers

 

[The Narc2]

P&p, official adventures of 2nd edition especially had plenty of unavoidable traps. Common description for the DM was: choose randomly a player, their character dies from xyz reason. Make them a new character.

I agree with you that some traps are not following the DDO trap rules, but I don't think it was made maliciously from the devs.

Boxes, don't represent the mechanism controller. Just s way that you can disable the trap. The local inhabitants might enable/disable/avoid the trap in other ways.

I also want to praise DDO for the trap variety, and interesting challenges they have added in the game! I would like more unavoidable traps, but survivable.
Example, fall in a pit (feather fall protects you) but you can't exit now unless someone can throw you a rope from above or if you have a dd.
Cheers

2nd edition pen and paper was the least purchased version for a reason and any DM that just randomly kills off their players with a no escape trap they determined happened wont have many players sitting at their table for long.

There are plenty of other unavoidable situations in DDO that would be the equivalent of the DM forcing the direction of the story, but none of those are situations that lead to imminent damage/death by some enviroment or trap.

As i mentioned earlier, a digital version of pen and paper doesnt convert well to someone going down a dungeon hall poking ahead with their 10 foot pole nor does it bode well for people lowering ropes and not all types of players will have dimension door.

let the trapfinding work properly and stop the predatory traps meant to earn revenue from unsuspecting players.

 

[Bjond]

A digital game is unlikely to move at the pace of a pen and paper game, nobody is going to search every ten feet,

I hated trapping until I learned it needed spot+search AND found NIH -- OMG! what a difference. It is such a fantastic way of implementing trap discovery that I think it should be the default. It's much too fun to hide behind zero documentation and an unclear feat or node.

It's far FAR too non-obvious to a newbie what it actually does or even how it works. No one is going to snag it until someone on the forums tells them to go use it.

IMHO, trapping should work like this:

• disarm: add a Y/N "are you sure!?" IFF there's a chance of breaking the box
• search: determines success of a manual search, perhaps with bonus
• (spot + search)/2: determines success of automatic searches (NIH style)

The lack of a warning for breakage potential really irks me. Your character should know when the box is simply too dangerous to touch.

 

[Bjond]

Cabol for One: There is a corner with multiple traps, where the trapbox is sat in the middle.

I used to think that, but ALL the traps in Cabal can be done without taking damage. It takes a TON of experimentation and taking damage to figure it out, though. I got curious and spent time on it one life.

Some quests require evasion, like the VON5 lightning corridor. You can alternate sides to avoid spinners, but I've not found a way to avoid the lightning.

 

[Igognito]

2nd edition pen and paper was the least purchased version for a reason and any DM that just randomly kills off their players with a no escape trap they determined happened wont have many players sitting at their table for long.

Possibly right, I just wanted to point out that such type of traps existed in PnP. I never said I'm in favor of them. I always adapted the content to make sense and to not be "predatory".
My only argument to what you are presenting is that you "blame" the devs to have done it in purpose for predatory purposes.
I personally believe it is not the reason. If they want us to die they would do it as in the epic prove your worth trap, that kills you and traps you so you can only release.
That yes it's predatory, but it is a quest called: prove your worth!
My point is, that I think some are just a bug and yes the should be recorded, some are in purpose to create a variety and an element of surprise.
Yes, some of those are not suitable for PM or HC unless you already know them.
Cheerios

 

[Col Kurtz]

I used to think that, but ALL the traps in Cabal can be done without taking damage. It takes a TON of experimentation and taking damage to figure it out, though. I got curious and spent time on it one life.

Some quests require evasion, like the VON5 lightning corridor. You can alternate sides to avoid spinners, but I've not found a way to avoid the lightning.

many can be run past, IF your character is 1st to pass by the trap

(trapper goes 1st wink wink- or just zerg through and rez em later> but, thats not a group hardcore tactic of course )

 

[The Narc2]

Possibly right, I just wanted to point out that such type of traps existed in PnP. I never said I'm in favor of them. I always adapted the content to make sense and to not be "predatory".
My only argument to what you are presenting is that you "blame" the devs to have done it in purpose for predatory purposes.
I personally believe it is not the reason. If they want us to die they would do it as in the epic prove your worth trap, that kills you and traps you so you can only release.
That yes it's predatory, but it is a quest called: prove your worth!
My point is, that I think some are just a bug and yes the should be recorded, some are in purpose to create a variety and an element of surprise.
Yes, some of those are not suitable for PM or HC unless you already know them.
Cheerios

They dont want you to only release, they want you to purchase rez cakes, also why most of these broken traps are located in quests low
enough level that party rezzing and/or stone recovery is limited.

As a sidenote, there are several quests that are better to run in heroics over epics when looking for the favor in hardcore because of the variants, but this has nothing to do with the topic on hand.

 

[Smokewolf]

I used to think that, but ALL the traps in Cabal can be done without taking damage. It takes a TON of experimentation and taking damage to figure it out, though. I got curious and spent time on it one life.

Some quests require evasion, like the VON5 lightning corridor. You can alternate sides to avoid spinners, but I've not found a way to avoid the lightning.

Yeah Cabal is just one of those Quests that if run at level with the Traps "on" your going to lose someone. Sure for my main, I can just walk thru everything NP but a first life build is kinda screwed.

 

[PaleFox]

While not traps as in the classic sense, the fishes that chew you up in Isle of Dread quests can't be disarmed and for unaware players can be deadly.
So is setting off the acid ray guns in the last quest of Isle of Dread.

 

[Bjond]

While not traps as in the classic sense, the fishes that chew you up in Isle of Dread quests can't be disarmed and for unaware players can be deadly.
So is setting off the acid ray guns in the last quest of Isle of Dread.

Ah, there's also the mirror beams in various dungeons, like Oath of Vengeance. Killed a guy on HC with that one -- warned, 321 count, fired, death notice, and oh, wait, he's in OUR party!

Turns out he had no idea the beams were dangerous, much less deadly -- thought they were cosmetic -- and was just standing in the path.

---

BTW, loved the fishes and that swim on IOD. Swimming up and leaping out with a giant bronto in your face was a fantastic visual. We bash SSG for a lot of things, but the creatives do a great job.

 

[vryxnr]

I wish all breakable floors got the WizKing treatment. There, if you have even a few ranks in the listen skill, you will get DM text and a voiceover warning you that you can hear the sound of the ground breaking beneath you, giving you time to jump to safety.

 

[The Narc2]

Edited original post with a couple updates.

Firstly a note to the new and casual players to not rely on the ddo wiki for this information as the players that are running the wiki have purposely omitted many of the traps/effects noted here, likely in cooperation with our game
management.

Secondly have added a bug that has a trap/effect of massive damage if you enter the end fight in VON 6 Plane of Night and attempt to melee the dragon to fast and get in an area underneath the dragon you can be instantly slain by this effect called an Invisible Volume Trigger. When approaching the dragon in the end fight take your time and get just close enough to attack for damage and do not go any further.

Thirdly have added a bug that has a trap/effect of massive damage if you stand on the edge of the fight with the Fire Giant Ingstoldt in VON 2 The Prisoner only on the Epic version, this is also an Invisible Volume Trigger effect. When fighting the fire giant be sure to have the entire froup either enter the pad he is on or stay completely away from the area.

The club that is never spoken of continues to bring the community important information.

 

[Falkor]

Firstly a note to the new and casual players to not rely on the ddo wiki for this information as the players that are running the wiki have purposely omitted many of the traps/effects noted here, likely in cooperation with our game management.

While the information may not be in the wiki, to assume it was deliberately left out in cooperation with game management does no good for anyone. Just cannot get on board with this line of conspiratorial thinking. And with total transparency, utterly and fully disagree with you in this instance. Forever. There are plenty of shady things SSG does where I would agree with you, but really I find this ridiculous and slightly concerning.

As far as I am aware, anyone could contribute to the wiki. Pehraps your hardcore info could go there. Or you can edit these pages. Not sure who you would talk too, but rest assured they are not the boogeyman you are making them out to be. I appreciate the efforts made to keep the wiki-updated, and only wish those who maintain it the best. Not going to entertain your conspiracy thinking and insinuations against them.

As for the dragon, yes ... if you go too far underneath him, it will nuke ya. Had that issue recently with my completitionist, who was annihilated meleeing the dragon from underneath. It's happened to me only once in all my millenia of playing, and recently. It could be the 64 bit move has made this bug / feature trigger more frequently?

Wasn't aware of the fire giant issue though. I've had a wall of fire appear in epic at the entrance ramp, and have died there. Never seen it spawn in heroics. Had no idea the borders could kill ya. I'll try this out on a non-HC character some other day.

 

[The Narc2]

While the information may not be in the wiki, to assume it was deliberately left out in cooperation with game management does no good for anyone. Just cannot get on board with this line of conspiratorial thinking. And with total transparency, utterly and fully disagree with you in this instance. Forever. There are plenty of shady things SSG does where I would agree with you, but really I find this ridiculous and slightly concerning.

As far as I am aware, anyone could contribute to the wiki. Pehraps your hardcore info could go there. Or you can edit these pages. Not sure who you would talk too, but rest assured they are not the boogeyman you are making them out to be. I appreciate the efforts made to keep the wiki-updated, and only wish those who maintain it the best. Not going to entertain your conspiracy thinking and insinuations against them.

As for the dragon, yes ... if you go too far underneath him, it will nuke ya. Had that issue recently with my completitionist, who was annihilated meleeing the dragon from underneath. It's happened to me only once in all my millenia of playing, and recently. It could be the 64 bit move has made this bug / feature trigger more frequently?

Wasn't aware of the fire giant issue though. I've had a wall of fire appear in epic at the entrance ramp, and have died there. Never seen it spawn in heroics. Had no idea the borders could kill ya. I'll try this out on a non-HC character some other day.

Well hey now the wiki updaters have a chance to catch this thread and make the appropriate updates noted within the appropriate quests listed here.

it is simply their opportunity to make my suggestion ultimately incorrect and show their commitment to providing a knowledgeable resource base to the entire community.

hope the respond in a positive manner and make me look like a foolish conspirator.

 

[Falkor]

Hanlons Razor ; do not attribute to malice which can be explained by stupidity or ignorance. And in the case of the wiki, motivation of not-paid wiki editors. Not malice.

You give the devs way too much conspiratorial credit, if they put that much thought into the game, we'd see a lot of positive results. Honestly I _wish_ they put that much thought and effort into the game, it'd be an improvement. ahahahaha

And I am pretty sure any player can contribute to the wiki as an editor. You are the chosen champion!