U72 Early Look 2: Monk Revamp

[Xgya]

• Wholeness of Body: This feat allows Monks to expend 10 Ki to heal some hit points over time in a meditative state. You regain hit points equal to twice Monk level + Epic/Legendary levels + Wisdom modifier every two seconds for 8 seconds. This scales with the higher of Positive or twice Melee Power. You can still move while meditating, but do so at a reduced speed unless you have the mobility feat. Other actions will interrupt your meditation. 1 minute cooldown.

I wanted to single this one out.
The class that is SUPPOSED to have some self-healing in it currently does it WORSE than the class that ISN'T (Fighter).

It should at least be as good as what Fighters get.

I'd have it work like Lay on Hands, but as a bonus for being self-only (and probably a higher CD), costing Ki instead of being charge-based. Click button, very short animation, (10+Monk Level)xWisdom Mod healing, scaling off MP or RP. Same benefit of LoH of being either Repair or Positive (heck, give a nod to the old Vampire Monks and have it also do Negative when it turns out better than the other two)

 

[pame12]

From what we know about how animations work and how skills are hooked to various points in the animation, this would likely multiply the workload involved with developing new skills significantly - and increase the chance of bugs arising associated with certain animations

It is fiscally irresponsible.

 

[pame12]

Man, a kamehameha charge up attack with animations, that's the stuff of wet dreams!
What an absolute missed opportunity! Come on devs! Make the dream come true!

 

[J1NG]

Man, a kamehameha charge up attack with animations, that's the stuff of wet dreams!
What an absolute missed opportunity! Come on devs! Make the dream come true!

And they have everything already in place:

Sun Beam.

Ki Cost versions: 50, 100, 200, 400 Ki.

Damage is multiplied by Melee Power x1, x2, x3, x4

J1NG

 

[pame12]

And they have everything already in place:

Sun Beam.

Ki Cost versions: 50, 100, 200, 400 Ki.

Damage is multiplied by Melee Power x1, x2, x3, x4

J1NG

HOLY!
Come on @SteelStar ! Pretty please! Add it over to the henshin!

 

[Shall]

Pros and Cons of the Monk Pass -- Removal of the Builders to Finishers

Buffs
Some finishers still available and now a quicker single click
Monk becomes more user friendly
Combinations of buffs in a single click

Nerfs
Loss of most strike builders & finishers
Costs enhancement points & reduces tree design opportunities
Loss of complexity challenge & fun (for some)
Lends itself to homogeneity of the classes
Reduces diversity of play and playstyle

Suggestion: While some pointed out to move from 3 to 2 clicks to attain a finisher which would resolve most of the nerf situation I believe that is what the Devs fear will overpower the monk at all levels. Assuming therefore they wish to stay with a complete removal, I would like to see what many others have now lent their voice to in this column:

Make a List of the Monk Strikes Available for Choice Gated by Levels and Power

I would think a monk could choose 1 builder and 1 finisher at levels 1, 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 18,

The lists available could be gated at 1, 6, 12, 18 as when one receives new stance improvements.

The lists would correspond to the chosen philosphy Light or Dark and monks would receive at level 3 as they do now the Fist of Light strike (with healing shield) or the Touch of Despair strike (with debuff). These would work as single strikes and not function as builders. Those would still need to be chosen from the list.

So for example

Level 1 Builders
Strike of Enduring I
Storm Strike I
Fires of Purity I
Flowing Waters I

Level 1 Finishers
Trembling Earth
Gathering Storm
Raging Sea
Breath of the Fire Dragon

So a light monk could at level 1 choose Strike of Enduring (or 1 of the others) and would receive the finisher Trembling Earth.
If they chose instead Storm Strike they would receive the matching finisher as an available clicky Gathering Storm
They would have to wait until 6, 9,12, etc. to choose other elemental strikes with their corresponding finishers (receiving 1 elemental builder and 1 finisher as a total of 2 more clickies) at that level.

Level 3
This is a unique level because the monk chooses his philosophy here.
*At level 3 they Fist of Light or Touch of Despair is granted as the singular Builder and the corresponding Finisher whether or light or dark:
Healing Ki (Level 3+ Light)
Touch of Despair (Level 3+ Dark)

By level 12 all 4 elemental strikes would be chose. But the list of Finishers is grander and not all will be able to be chosen even by 20, thus limiting the monk player to what flavor and design they think best. That list will include all the other elemental finishers not yet chosen as well as the elemental - philsophy (light or dark) - elemental finishers. So whether dark or light the monk will have 5 finisher choices left after level 3 out of a list of 10 choices -- if you make Shining Star available on that list as well.


Conclusion: Though finishers will move to efficient single click moments -- and while all are available -- it is limited in by choice (a little more than 1/2 the finishers can be selected). This will lead to diversity and creativity playstyle. No monk can complain that if they really wanted something they couldn't get it. Also it is gated by levels -- you don't have almost all of them at level 3. Rather just and handful parsed out every 3 levels. This should help maintain the balance that the Devs and us are seeking in remaking the monk trees. Finally they still cost ki (which could be increased from current cost to nerf them more).

But flexibility, creativity, diversity of builds is maintained. I have not seen any monk overpowered by these abilities in the current meta, and here they are being reduced in this pass. This way I think is balanced to avoid significant reduction of power and choice, improves the current clunkiness of monk clickies, provides more space for creative tree enhancements and improves the monk experience.

I like the general idea of this, but given that I like being able to experiment with different abilities would rather it be implemented as a ki ability spell book for monks containing the current henshin ki spells and the strikes & finishers implemented as innate attack spells that scale like spells with caster level, ie adding dice every few monk levels (maybe add on to the improved martial arts feat something that raises max ki spell caster level to add scaling into epic levels) . It would achieve the same general thing, level gating of abilities known and their dice instead of getting everything with a splash and making you choose which abilities you have access to instead of being able to do everything at any time, but would be something that could be changed out in a tavern instead of requiring multiple trips to fred with the associated feat swap costs and cooldown.

Depending on if general spells can have the same interaction that the fatesinger epic strike does with chords of fate empowering the discord ability to deal increased damage and stun, it might even be able to save some of the feel of the current combo system. Say a dark strike gives a short term buff and at three stacks it adds the current pain touch effect to you next earth strike for example. They could keep their current proposed revisions releveant, with you purchasing sla's that trigger a specific empowered strike on demand and purchasing addon effects to empowered strikes. Maybe it could open up the possibility of enhancements or epic destiny cores adding spells to the spellbook. Or who knows, add ki metamagics for when you have a glut of ki, although I suppose monks probably don't have that many free feats so maybe not.

 

[droid327]

Man, a kamehameha charge up attack with animations, that's the stuff of wet dreams!
What an absolute missed opportunity! Come on devs! Make the dream come true!

So...Runearms?

 

[pame12]

So...Runearms?

Seems kinda puny no? Also they'd need to make runearms ki weapons.

 

[Phaedra]

some good ideas—but please do not mess with ki bolt. The ki bolt builds are niche and fun, not OP.
I think they will have ocean dodge cap (as on live) and wind MRR cap (as per a comment from Steel).

Which seems backwards, given the flavor of those two styles.

 

[saekee]

Which seems backwards, given the flavor of those two styles.

Totally true!

 

[LuKaSu]

Ok, so if there's no coming back with Fists of Light, maybe the Healing Ki could be boosted to make up some of the loss? Even if it costs more Ki to trigger it, it would be worth it to get back some of the lost healing.

 

[Yamani]

Might as well add a new feat for monks to get Wisdom to Reflex saves!

 

[rabidfox]

Might as well add a new feat for monks to get Wisdom to Reflex saves!

Isn't the rule for that that only abilities that don't have a save already to prevent 1 ability covering multiple saves?

 

[Dom]

Isn't the rule for that that only abilities that don't have a save already to prevent 1 ability covering multiple saves?

Technically no cause Alch gets int to reflex for free and then can take int to will or fort as a feat

 

[Grundable]

For monks consider bringing up Shin-Tao to tanking proportions by adding a +15 MRR cap increase per core ability. Also add a +5% hp stacking hp bonus somewhere as well.

 

[Svirfneblin]

With shortswords and kamas being some of the worst weapons in the game what can you do to help Ninjas that use them ?

 

[RayRay Ramone]

I find it hilarious that these changes actually make me want to play SF instead.

 

[saekee]

With shortswords and kamas being some of the worst weapons in the game what can you do to help Ninjas that use them ?

The enhancement trees and their crit profiles were designed back in the day in relationship to weapons with non-standard crit profiles.

They goofed with swash and regretted it, and since Fellblade and Mutineer (if I recall rightly) they have stopped making enhanced crit weapons, for the most part.

Short swords and long swords were junk, so they made named ones that were better; then the enhancement tree had to be balanced in relation to the named weapons.

Now at cap it is all crafted weapons with their native crit profiles, so there is no reason not to buff all weapons to a base 15-20/3 minimum.

 

[Ooblagato]

These were unaddressed from the first revision, so effectively a repost:

• All combo abilities should probably stay available to all monks with increased cost and no combo build up with appropriate cooldowns. Enhancement trees should give access to new abilities or upgrades to the combo abilities.
• Ninja poison has had its primary effect removed (5% poison vulnerability per stack), despite being replaced with a much needed poison immunity stripping, this is a nerf. This was probably done as 100% extra poison damage was seen as a potential issue, but perhaps you should consider adding a 25~50% flat vulnerability back in on top of the immunity stripping.
• Monks need a way to spend more ki. There should be consideration for buffing all abilities with increased ki cost. At some point as a monk ki is in a state of constant overflow when in combat, it would be very thematic and feel extremely nice to be able to utilize this effectively. (some sort of metamagic, repeat use power up/cost, or extra powerful version of the abilities)

 

[AMess]

Will you please give the fans what they want?

The publicity around monk has me logging back in and poking around in DDO and what I found is startling. Logged in a few times and it was a ghost town. On Orien the LFMs are slim and that pushed me into DDO live and the trends look bad, since this time last year the number of active players took a nose dive, expanding it out to the pandemic was much worse. I get that Cormyr has siphoned off some players, but a quick glance at Cormyr didn't show enough players to make up those lost from Orien.

Dunno, maybe it's bleak b/c holidays are over and folks are getting back to work, or maybe players are taking breaks b/c of whatever, but we need players, so please, even if you don't agree with the direction players want to go, placate the player base.