U74 Preview 2: Iconic Dhampir Dark Bargainer Warlock

[rabidfox]

With u66 SSG did this:


Since the new pact is evil (aka aligment damage), it should be made to proc both of EA's mantles (alignment) and Primal Heart (alignment). Maybe it does already and just isn't in the notes, I'll check once I log on.

From testing, doesn't proc any mantles other than the generic on spell cast ones, so EA/Primal stuff would be good IMO to get added.


It's also missing greater death aura from leveling up.

 

[rabidfox]

Well that means Warlock only gets 2 procs per ~3 secs, since the second blast of each triplet would be on the CD still

So anything hitting at 1 sec would be 50% faster at building

Whatever the time rate is for blasts then if the current 1s ICD doesn't work out right.

 

[Anurakh]

I really really hope that Cursekeeper / the next epic destiny themed around warlock is also coming with this expansion.
Radiant/Nullification have been getting paired up since Abyss Pact and then Dark Apostate and now again with Dark Bargainer and it's a very poorly supported combination in current epic destinies.
Light/alignment and Negative are both lacking a third destiny tree, an evil damage pact doesn't fit well with a draconic ruin intensified build, doesn't have a compelling epic strike option, doesn't have a well budgetted mantle option.
This is much the same issue DA faces in epics, but for warlocks this is even worse.

I agree with your post. Only a note- Currently, warlocks have to focus on two spellpowers: force/alignment and one elemental/sonic/negative. A build for this iconic spell with intensified bane will have to do the same. This wouldn't be the first warlock to take a mantle other than draconic, even if they're in draconic tier 5.

The question is which mantle will be best, and how many mantles work with this pact. I find it quite ironic that a natural ED like Primal is so good for my PM, an undead,and the complete opposite of a devout naturalist. I suppose the same will happen with this warlock.

 

[rabidfox]

The vampiric blast essence stance needs to work on shapes other than the default single target 'eldricth blast focused' shape. Anyone running any warlock build beyond level 2 or 3 will be using either the AoE shapes (cone, chain, aura, eye beam) or enervating shadow for single target attacks.

 

[Lotoc]

I agree with your post. Only a note- Currently, warlocks have to focus on two spellpowers: force/alignment and one elemental/sonic/negative. A build for this iconic spell with intensified bane will have to do the same. This wouldn't be the first warlock to take a mantle other than draconic, even if they're in draconic tier 5.

The question is which mantle will be best, and how many mantles work with this pact. I find it quite ironic that a natural ED like Primal is so good for my PM, an undead,and the complete opposite of a devout naturalist. I suppose the same will happen with this warlock.

Shiradi in terms of elements should really be the go to mantle for many warlock builds, Primal and Exalted Angel mantles have their power budgets split between 3 different elements while Shiradi lets you pick a single element between Sonic, Light, Force and Poison but the spell proc rate is half the ranged proc rate and it scales with imbue dice rather than caster levels.

 

[Christhemiss]

bugs:
lesser death aura has gust of wind icon
ray of exhaustion has sleet storm icon
death aura has ice storm icon
dread mist has evards icon
dust to dust feat gives no description of what it does on character level up
i was not granted greater death aura at 19
crushing dread is doing about half the damage it should be if its supposed to do 1d6+8. atm its barely more than prey on fear
growing mist has 20 sec cd and not 5
growing mist casting speed is slower than i would like
the 1d20 damage on crushing dread appears to be lower than 1d20 at 30 stacks (with my characters spellpower)

things that should be changed based on my testing
id like to see vampiric blast changed to an eldritch essence stance to avoid confusion of why it doesnt work with aoe shapes. in addition, allow this to change the base damage to evil (similar to TS) but keep the heal/extra dice
id like to see dark ascendant bite have a better debuff than 5 vul stacks

 

[canicus]

It does not appear that the PA mantle (Heart) procs on the ES Aura

 

[Anurakh]

Shiradi in terms of elements should really be the go to mantle for many warlock builds, Primal and Exalted Angel mantles have their power budgets split between 3 different elements while Shiradi lets you pick a single element between Sonic, Light, Force and Poison but the spell proc rate is half the ranged proc rate and it scales with imbue dice rather than caster levels.

Yes, for the reasons you mention, Shiradi doesn't appeal to me. Also, I've never been a fan of the Primal, Magus, and EA element split (and I completely feel like my wizard is missing a mantle for generalist spellcasters), but sadly, it's the lesser of two evils. At least all blasts can activate the mantle, even if activation by other elements is lost. I still prefer it to Shiradi.

(The Draconic also works for warlocks with elemental pacts, but of course, this one isn't.)

 

[rabidfox]

Working mantles are the ones that work with any spell cast (and pact doesn't matter): Shiradi, Draconic, & Fatesinger.

None of the others work with this warlock. SSG had to manually code the other mantles to play nice with pacts; which they did with u66. I think every pact was made to play nice with two other mantles then. They just haven't done so with this new pact (and I sure hope they're going to).

 

[Anurakh]

Working mantles are the ones that work with any spell cast (and pact doesn't matter): Shiradi, Draconic, & Fatesinger.

None of the others work with this warlock. SSG had to manually code the other mantles to play nice with pacts; which they did with u66. I think every pact was made to play nice with two other mantles then. They just haven't done so with this new pact (and I sure hope they're going to).

I hope they do, because Shiradi has a bad rate for casters, Draconic forces you to take an element when this iconic doesn't work with elements, and the Fatesinger's Mantle is for melee.

Magus, EA and Thorn should work with this iconic.

Thanks for testing it, Rabid.

 

[Svirfneblin]

Do we get a new Epic Destiny to synergize with Warlock now?

Finally?

Adjusting other ED's to trigger on Eldrich Blast like others have said would sure be nice.

 

[Lotoc]

Working mantles are the ones that work with any spell cast (and pact doesn't matter): Shiradi, Draconic, & Fatesinger.

None of the others work with this warlock. SSG had to manually code the other mantles to play nice with pacts; which they did with u66. I think every pact was made to play nice with two other mantles then. They just haven't done so with this new pact (and I sure hope they're going to).

Issue with those other mantles is their power budget is split between light, fire and positive.
In truth an ideal mantle is 3 hits of d6+6 per CL per 5 seconds, draconic is mono element but applies extra ticks as DoT, primal thorn/sky procs 3 different elements per 5 seconds if you can meet the 3 element condition (or are melee/gish) heart only has 2 damage procs, fatesinger is aoe but is d6+6 per 10 seconds and can't crit.
Magus is a choice between 2 procs cold+neg per 5 seconds or aoe of both every 6 seconds (no crit)
EA mantle as far as damage is the same as Magus for on spell hit damage or a worse chill aura.

Really the only mantles budgetted at the good end are draconic and primal sky/thorn, everything else is effectively missing 33% damage potential at a minimum.

 

[SpardaX]

Could this be its own EB Shape instead?

Having it be an Essence (afaict) means it competes with Utterdark, which all DB locks are doubtlessly going to take so they can use Light & Alignment as their OSFA spellpower. Turning this on would drop you back into Force damage, which would severely neuter your DPS unless you specced dual element anyway, defeating the whole purpose of having a OSFA spellpower.

Having it be a single-target Shape means you could keep your spellpower alignment, and simply be sacrificing AOE for healing, useful against bosses.

If you look closely, you'll notice that it basically is. It requires you to be using basic focused EB. So it locks you down into both a shape and essence. Unless the +1 to Dice and Pact Dice work regardless, in which case, you lose the healing and I guess just get a Force powered Cone that has no "essence" effect except the +1 dice/pdice.

 

[rabidfox]

Issue with those other mantles is their power budget is split between light, fire and positive.
In truth an ideal mantle is 3 hits of d6+6 per CL per 5 seconds, draconic is mono element but applies extra ticks as DoT, primal thorn/sky procs 3 different elements per 5 seconds if you can meet the 3 element condition (or are melee/gish) heart only has 2 damage procs, fatesinger is aoe but is d6+6 per 10 seconds and can't crit.
Magus is a choice between 2 procs cold+neg per 5 seconds or aoe of both every 6 seconds (no crit)
EA mantle as far as damage is the same as Magus for on spell hit damage or a worse chill aura.

Really the only mantles budgetted at the good end are draconic and primal sky/thorn, everything else is effectively missing 33% damage potential at a minimum.

I like EA on warlock, it's got a debuff from the mantle; which works nice with the style of play I enjoy. If I run the AoE barrier version then it does light/fire damage in AoE pulses (or I can run the non-barrier version for better ranged attacks in raids but it only triggers 1 type element then). Meanwhile, Primal isn't the best personal damage since only one damage type procs but I can do stuff like boost hires/summons to hit harder. Magus mantle has it's perks too like nullmagic strike procing off blasts. Could they be better? Sure. And they might not be the top damage builds, but they give a lot of utility and build choices and I want that kind of choice on this new iconic too.

 

[erethizon1]

Wait, does the iconic absolutely have to take one of these dark gifts feats that I personally hate? You've just killed the iconic for me.

No, please. Provide an alternative, the flat Toughness feat, for example, or Mental Toughness. Not particularly exciting, but at least you're not forcing us to take one of these aberrations. I don't mind these types of options existing for those who like them, but I hate them and I don't want to be forced to take them just because I play a race.

Also, what's up with caster iconics? First, the Chaosmancer and having to spend 19 racial points to get rid of Bad Surges. Now this one with these types of aberrant feats. Please, casters are severely penalized these days. Stop beating them up.

Chaosmancer just needs 17 racial points to get rid of Bad Surges (still a lot, but at least it can be done entirely with racial AP).

 

[droid327]

If you look closely, you'll notice that it basically is. It requires you to be using basic focused EB. So it locks you down into both a shape and essence. Unless the +1 to Dice and Pact Dice work regardless, in which case, you lose the healing and I guess just get a Force powered Cone that has no "essence" effect except the +1 dice/pdice.

Yes but that's my point

It can duplicate the focused firing behavior as a shape, add the healing effect, and not disable utterdark. I think that's a better implementation that doesn't fight with the stated design intent to let you go full Evil on blast and pact

 

[Nimvind]

Do we know the past life on this beautiful iconic yet?

 

[Zavina]

Do we know the past life on this beautiful iconic yet?

i was just going to ask that....

 

[rabidfox]

Do we know the past life on this beautiful iconic yet?

On lam, it shows chaosmancer's past life info when I visit the life-shaper (in the info window); so likely not added into the game yet. I assume that's what'll give me if I actual TR, but haven't done so to 100% verify that (still testing stuff at cap and don't want to set up the character again after a TR).

 

[Purr]

Can we just change this into a dark version of enlightened spirit and add support for melee (maybe unarmed) attack? Make the evil mist the perma aura and give an evil imbue with better progression in bonus dice? It could literally just be an undead monk with aura shredding things.

Which would be awesome.