What in the hot mess did you do to stealth?
- Thread starter Konsumer
- Start date
Mindos
CHAOTIC EVIL
How far away was this?
Br4d
Well-known member
Eye was over me as soon as I reached the top of the ramp and only went away when I reached the trees on the far side. It was far enough that the 3 trolls under the tree were small by the time it went away.
I did not see eyes over them at any point.
Tyranthraxus
Well-known member
Simple solutions:
1. Invisibility is now "Walking mode" only.
2. Mass Invisibility is removed from the game.
No need to destroy Stealth.
1. Invisibility is now "Walking mode" only.
2. Mass Invisibility is removed from the game.
No need to destroy Stealth.
Phoenicis
Savage's Husband
Functioning as expected.
The eye over you indicates you are in 'something's' line of sight.
That you never saw eyes over the mobs indicates they never got enough bonus to actually spot you. Mobs get 1,2,3,&4 eyes over their heads, at which point they see you, (single large red eye). The longer you are in any given mob's LoS, the more bonus they get to beat your hide.
Br4d
Well-known member
Back in the day I used to use A New Invasion as a stealth tester. I probably ran it once a week for a couple of years as I was working through Rogue and Ranger lives. The pull was that it was semi-random in both layout and mob placement and it had several mobs who saw through stealth on Elite. It also had a wicked end fight for a melee at the time and I had a lot of fun winning and losing that end fight, which was no return if you failed.
I used to stalk the patrols in there and then mess with them trying to lose aggro by various means. It was still possible to get a total aggro wipe without killing the aggro'd things and it was fun trying to get to that state. One thing I noticed was that once the mobs were fully alerted only a teleport and invis combination would do the trick. If I ddoored back to the entrance and called Mikayl to me I could pin him there and restealth and meet the mobs halfway or so and they'd still be beelining straight for me.
I don't really think that much has changed over the years. I think SSG has added a bunch of stuff, like Champions and Reaper that devalue stealth due to true-seeing however I don't think the mechanics have changed that much. We can move faster in stealth now due to ED's and various enhancement changes but the basic structure of stealth at Elite has not changed much at all.
This is why when somebody tells me they want real stealth play I tell them just to avoid Reaper play and it's still there for them. Champs can be dealt with and not all of them have true-seeing.
saekee
long live ROGUE
the upper tier Reapers oddly do not detect stealth (venges and dooms).
Deathromancer
Well-known member
I agree I used to play rogues a lot but they have gotten so far away from DND Rogue core that its not even funny, now all the have is various shades of somewhat stealthy melee or ranged fighters that can do traps, and you can accomplish the same thing with most multi class with a few rogue levels splashed in. Was nice when game started and some quest needed a skilled rogue to use optional paths or secure named stuff. Nowadays the only rogue change I like is when playing non rogue characters I can use a perm rogue hirling for traps, but sadly that erodes grouping and has done away with the need for rogues in the game in most cases. It would be awesome if a pure or mostly rogue leveled character could do content like other mega builds. Heck they need to add a Supreme stealth tree that works in reaper lol
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Br4d
Well-known member
That's useful information. I might pick a few stealth-friendly instances and just wander around at R10 until killed, likely quickly.
The funny thing from my perspective is that if SSG had just promoted champs to be reaper-like in Reaper I might well have played the meta. I just hate reapers. They remove the suspension of disbelief for me because they add a completely alien layer to gameplay and it's across the board in Reaper.
Such a shame.
saekee
long live ROGUE
I proposed this at some point. Make mobs become reaper-like, like champs, so they are still integrated into the quest and story.
Yeah, as is, it is like some evil floating Muppet with no relationship to anything.
It is sadly where the game has gone but fortunately, it is pretty fast to get 21 reaper points at cap. That gets the requisite hp from the defense tree. From there, while incrementally useful, it is not as essential.
Lazuli
Well-known member
There's no need to destroy the spells either. The devs should learn from how stealth worked in the early years of the game. It worked, and these spells existed then too.
What they need to do is not destroy things.
Miahoo
Well-known member
Adding to the Rogue's hate:
1) Every attack, grazing or miss will take you out of stealth (this should be changed for something like the horses mechanic)
2) Assassinate is the only DC you cannot find in the Reaper trees
3) Stealth not working in Reaper at all (I can understand high spot\listen\true seeing, but that's not the case)
4) Rogues attack abilities (tree\ed) halt your attacks for some reason, they treated like cleaves although most of them are single target - I don't see this kind of delay with my other melees (maybe rogues attack speed just too fast which somehow bug this system?)
Fhrek
One Badge of Honor achieved
Cara to elaborate?
Because I usually cast invisibility and hop on my unicorn to run wilderness to quests without bother with slayers... yet, the mobs keep agroo'ing and every grazing hit or AoE that does 1 damage drops me from the poney.
Is mind boogling what they did to stealth.
Miahoo
Well-known member
Miss doesn't unmount you. Plus, it can take a few hits.
Fhrek
One Badge of Honor achieved
Yeah, the miss doesn't unmount, but don't take a few hits... is one hit and one desmount. Is so annoying I give up to call the mount again and just sprint way.
Miahoo
Well-known member
Same with stealth.
The most annoying thing to an assassin is when you try to assassinate, and some range kobold miss you and you're out of stealth. Or you're holding a heal scroll and can't assassinate.
And in some cases the ability goes into cooldown anyway.
Unk
Well-known member
I have to say I like loved how stealth was around 2013 I think. When I first started playing in 2006 it was stupid everybody just invisibility ran or stealth ran a lot of quest. I quit the game for two years because it was not fun grouping. I remember I never even saw butchers path because somebody in group would always cast invisibility on them self and run to the end it sucked. So there is definitely a happy medium somewhere.
Br4d
Well-known member
I don't spend my reaper points any more. They make Elite much too easy and I'm not going to chase my tail in R1 just because SSG told me to grind some more. To hell with that.
Br4d
Well-known member
The thing that cracks me up when I think about it is that the same dev/management team that made reapers ubiquitous in the game refused to put playable kobolds in the game.
That's just not understanding your marketplace which is likely why DDO relies on fewer and fewer big spenders to survive. Most of us have had it with the double standards in play.