deck of many curses - rate

[Mordenkainen]

They saw the mental illness caused by mythic/reaper bonuses and wanted to triple-down on it with the ultimate rando-grind fest that is curse cards.

 

[mikarddo]

That's not good enough, for two reasons

One, its entirely unsatisfying to just have useless mods on your gear and be unable to do anything about it. In a game about progression and optimization, telling people "oh you just dont get to progress anymore, sucks to be you!" runs counter to the whole ethos of the game. Every time you see the worthless mod on your gear you're just going to be reminded how frustrated you are that you cant realistically improve it. Plus, it rewards dupers, who WILL be able to get a full optimized suit, and thus get a meaningful advantage (being able to Favor endgame falchions, RXBs, etc.)

Two, its just bad design to implement a system in a way where it quickly makes itself obsolete, when it could otherwise provide long-term goals, and foster a robust economy. Even if you do subscribe to the "take what you can get and then just go with it" approach, that still only creates a couple hours of play. That's not really getting much value out of all the development time it took, when it could create dozens of hours of play simply by increasing cleanser drops.

Plus it'd still take hundreds of hours of play, because RNG is still very much against you for getting one piece right, let alone a full suit - so its impractical if not unrealistic, even if cleansers were sold at a vendor (which, sell them for 100k pp and then you've created a great plat sink too!)

I disagree fully with your first point as per the reasons I have already given. The duping part I wont get into here.
Your second point does have some merit - except I dont think rerunning the same 4 challenges on R1 100s of times or rerunning Sagas more than I already do anyway to be interesting game play. Thus I only really see negative implications of making that system more used than "add a curse once to each item and "reroll" curses if you have the same item drop again while playing.

That said - I think SSG should sell cleansers at 99 DDO points each in the store. That would allow those in dire need of having the very best a way to do that while making SSG some money. Infact, I am seriously surprised that SSG didnt do so months ago.

 

[Dunspartacus]

After a few months of messing around with trying to optimize with curses I kinda just tossed it into the "too much work for the payoff" bucket with reaper bonuses and the gem of many fu's. If I get good curses? Great, but I'm not chasing it anymore.

I'm definitely not above being a little try hard on my optimizations, but I've got limits.

 

[DBZ]

Definition of pay to win really

 

[mikarddo]

Definition of pay to win really

I dont think getting perfect curses equates to winning all that much really.

I dont mind people winning a little if they pay alot. Hence I dont mind Ottos boxes, Wishes etc. I pay for VIP myself but if others are willing to pay alot more to keep the game afloat I am happy with that - even if they "win" a little.

 

[Arkat]

Without being able to work the system its just a useless system period

Time and money waste no benefit

This is exactly why I refuse to participate in using this particular "system."

My time is extremely limited. This style of gambling is just a waste of it.

 

[Pano]

As someone who is constantly farming five-rings to get +2 int, I can tell you that it feels like
1 in 'I miss farming jibbers'
Also, although I think this system is horrible. I really dont want them to sell cleansers...

 

[droid327]

Also, although I think this system is horrible. I really dont want them to sell cleansers...

In the Store, no. In game, yes

 

[droid327]

I dont think getting perfect curses equates to winning all that much really.

Thats kinda contradictory. If full bespoke curses are powerful, then its blatant P2W if the only path there is through the Store. If they arent that powerful, then there's no real issue with letting people work deterministically towards a full suit of curses.

The only thing that's indefensible is the current design, where you just hit a wall no matter how good or bad the curses are

 

[mikarddo]

Thats kinda contradictory. If full bespoke curses are powerful, then its blatant P2W if the only path there is through the Store. If they arent that powerful, then there's no real issue with letting people work deterministically towards a full suit of curses.

The only thing that's indefensible is the current design, where you just hit a wall no matter how good or bad the curses are

I disagree. Letting people purchase full lives for peanuts would be bad. Letting people purchase full lives for a good deal of $ (Ottos) is fine because it earns SSG a living. And unless you buy _alot_ of lives its not really even that valuable in game.

Heck, I would not even mind if SSG sold characters with all PL and 156 rp for $20k, but I sure would mind if they sold them for 2 mill plat.

The same applies here. There is no contradiction.

 

[Mordenkainen]

Curse cards are crazy powerful especially with a full suite of curses for a particular style of play. There are 16 slots to get a curse on, imagine a stacking +2 to each stat, +6 temp stats, +5% HP, +3 to attk/Damage, +5% to fort bypass, +2% Dodge Cap & MDB, +5 to Melee Power, 2 extra sneak attack die, 2 extra imbue die ALL on one character...

It's CrAzY OP when seen together.

 

[Jack Jarvis Esquire]

I like the card system.

It's one of the few things that doesn't cater to min-maxing. Having it random and out of control adds a uniqueness to the items.

I don't go chasing good effects as that way lies madness for me, but I keep a healthy enough stock of cards to roll up an alternative bit of kit if a duplicate falls into my loot, and I've had one or two nice results, including the +6 STR boost on my artifact. I'd hazard that item is pretty much unique to me on the server, if not the game.

It's a lottery where you don't need to pay for a ticket. You won't win very often, but you've really not lost anything when you don't. And it's a really nice surprise when your ticket comes up!

 

[Jack Jarvis Esquire]

Curse cards are crazy powerful especially with a full suite of curses for a particular style of play. There are 16 slots to get a curse on, imagine a stacking +2 to each stat, +6 temp stats, +5% HP, +3 to attk/Damage, +5% to fort bypass, +2% Dodge Cap & MDB, +5 to Melee Power, 2 extra sneak attack die, 2 extra imbue die ALL on one character...

It's CrAzY OP when seen together.

Which is why it needs to remain random and uncontrollable from min-maxing.

 

[Refutor]

okay so i heard "one in jibbers" which is bad enough for me. i happend to get a +2 WIS on the sharn ice necklace and decided to make a ice druid instead of an alchemist or sorcerorr. my alt got a +1 Necro DC on Legendary Order's Garb. it may be possible to pick a build around the random, rather than try to make the random fit your build. thanks everyone for the info, not worth it especially since i will be completely re-gearing in the next coupld months due to Myth Drannor.

 

[DBZ]

For melees and ranged sure

 

[droid327]

I disagree. Letting people purchase full lives for peanuts would be bad. Letting people purchase full lives for a good deal of $ (Ottos) is fine because it earns SSG a living. And unless you buy _alot_ of lives its not really even that valuable in game.

Heck, I would not even mind if SSG sold characters with all PL and 156 rp for $20k, but I sure would mind if they sold them for 2 mill plat.

The same applies here. There is no contradiction.

The difference is everyone can earn full past lives in a reasonable way through free play. So Otto's isnt P2W, its merely pay-for-convenience

Curse cards are not reasonably available through play, so selling cleansers in the Store means a full suit would be exclusively available for money - that's what makes it P2W

You could sell them in store, but you also have to make them available in-game at a reasonable rate. I just dont think there's a need to gate them, because there's already so much RNG in the system, and that (plus the need to grind cards) provides all the gating you need to make the system balanced

They could give cleansers away for free and most people still wouldnt get a full suit of curses before the next expansion makes their gear obsolete and gets them grinding the next batch

 

[droid327]

Curse cards are crazy powerful especially with a full suite of curses for a particular style of play. There are 16 slots to get a curse on, imagine a stacking +2 to each stat, +6 temp stats, +5% HP, +3 to attk/Damage, +5% to fort bypass, +2% Dodge Cap & MDB, +5 to Melee Power, 2 extra sneak attack die, 2 extra imbue die ALL on one character...

It's CrAzY OP when seen together.

That'd still represent literally thousands of rerolls to get exactly the stats you want

Getting a GMoF with two sets you want would seem like farming Keep weapons in comparison

 

[Gimp-1]

I suggest you be lucky...its the only thing ive found that helps with curse cards (also reaper items...etc).

 

[Pano]

I disagree. Letting people purchase full lives for peanuts would be bad. Letting people purchase full lives for a good deal of $ (Ottos) is fine because it earns SSG a living. And unless you buy _alot_ of lives its not really even that valuable in game.

Heck, I would not even mind if SSG sold characters with all PL and 156 rp for $20k, but I sure would mind if they sold them for 2 mill plat.

The same applies here. There is no contradiction.

This is totally different on a fundamental level. Buying something deterministic in a game is fair and OK. Lootboxes are a form of gambling. You indirectly don't know what you are buying, because you dont know your next curse. Guys, don't let DDO be a casino.

 

[mikarddo]

The difference is everyone can earn full past lives in a reasonable way through free play. So Otto's isnt P2W, its merely pay-for-convenience

Curse cards are not reasonably available through play, so selling cleansers in the Store means a full suit would be exclusively available for money - that's what makes it P2W

You could sell them in store, but you also have to make them available in-game at a reasonable rate. I just dont think there's a need to gate them, because there's already so much RNG in the system, and that (plus the need to grind cards) provides all the gating you need to make the system balanced

They could give cleansers away for free and most people still wouldnt get a full suit of curses before the next expansion makes their gear obsolete and gets them grinding the next batch

While one can reasonable get a past live many players do not see it as easy to get *all* full past lives.

Similarly, most players should find it reasonable easy to refarm some of their gear for "free" rerolls of curses.

So, no, I dont reasonably see the difference. Remember that the p2w version still needs to farm the cards, so it does involved actual playing too, not all p2w