Force Necromancer. Viable? To bypass the awful deathward?

ChaoticNecromancer

Well-known member
I love necromancy BUT in this game, there is a thing called Deathward. No elemental protection spell can absorb infinite amount of energy, most of them absorb 12*cl elemental damage. But any low level cleric with it can be hit with as much necrotic energy as the negative energy plane and walk as if is nothing.

So I wanna ask. Lets suppose that I focus in necromancy in feats as normal for a necromancer, but focus mostly in ARCHMAGE tree, picking only Pale Master up to tier 4 + pick the stuff from the Feydark illusionist to buff force critical chance. And in epic levels, pick the nightmare lance and focus the rest in magus. Would this build be viable?

I wanna be a necromancer but don't wanna a mere tier 3 spell making everything immune to my spells.
 

Lazuli

Well-known member
Yes, it is viable. This is how I build my wizard, and I can solo high reaper. Although I already said that of all the casters, wizard is the one in the worst situation currently (along perhaps with warlock).

But you won't have enough points to invest in feydark illusionist if you want to invest that deep in PM. Besides, feydark doesn't contribute that much anyway. Take tier 5 archmage, tier 4 + capstone PM and you will be golden. It works very well for me like this.

The next thing is not to make the mistake of linking your mantle to negative energy. That's a trap.

The third thing is not only to depend on force. Although ruins will help you a lot, you can't depend on them alone: they are expensive and have a long cooldown, and the wizard's native force spells are very meh. You need to make your high level elemental spells viable as well.

Magus is a bad main ED for wizard, sorry. I know it may seem thematically attractive. But it is bad. It's good as a third ED to add some DC (especially illusion) and some extra perks like nullmagic, but if you don't want to be a DC caster without spell damage, avoid going too deep.
 
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Lazuli

Well-known member
Tier 5 draconic is mandatory for ruins. The mantle is also ok because it is activated with any spell and gives spell cooldown reduction (good for your IKs too). However, the output is a single element and as a wizard that really sucks when immunities inevitably appear, so you may have to switch to another element in some quests resetting the ED or have the primal mantle as a backup. Of course, the points are very tight and having the backup mantle means giving up spellpower, and that hurts. When the cap goes up with the next expansion it should be possible to take the mantle without sacrificing spellpower, although then you will be sacrificing raising more Magus lol. Decisions decisions.

The primal mantle has the problem that it is activated with fewer elements. That is a problem for the wizard because it has quite large cooldowns, and it makes the dps with this mantle lower. However, this mantle has the advantage that the output is two elements, which helps with immunities. Thorn mantle is the best (triggers with force & acid and shard storm is lovely)

For the second ED I recommend either primal or shadowdancer. Primal is what I usually take with wizards who have a certain number of extra ED points: +2 int, temporary hit points (shard storm), evasion, crit damage, cocoon to help others, maybe even backup mantle. Shadowdancer provides spell cooldown reduction and evasion. Evasion is very useful to survive when wearing robes, and getting it is much cheaper in shadowdancer than in primal (something to consider if you have few epic PLs).

For third ED I recommend Magus or Exalted angel. The latter is basically for the wings for greater mobility. The Magus provides more DC to phantasmal killer and nullmagic. Both provide more spell points.

Mix as you wish, but I try to get the third tier spell DCs to give me Necromancy, Enchantment, and Illusion. Be careful, because primal is limited in this regard (it only provides enchantment). But primal gives more DC (more int)... and not the ED that according to the devs they designed for the DC casters. Of course, of course.

If you still really like the mantle of the magus, then you could have the mantle of the draconic linked to acid as a backup, since you will have to go up to tier 5 due to intensified ruin. I don't think this is as efficient (and you lose the cooldown reduction, which is better for a DC caster than anything from the mantle of the magus! Nullmagic Strike is disappointing, too limited), but with the recent changes the mantle doesn't suck as much as it used to, although it's still tied to two elements with too many immunities to be useful to the wizard. But it could work with a draconic-magus-shadowdancer template, although the trade off for raising the magus so much is significant.

Basically, the devs played a bad joke by putting a intensified ruin in ED for the sorc, since ruins are feats more intended for wizards than for bypass casters, who have always had other viable options. And then they completed the joke by adding a mantle designed for specialists in the wizard's ED, so the magus mantle is more useful for cold sorc, druid or alchemist than for the wizard. How much love for the wizard, right?

Forget about the background of the EDs, since the devs have also done it, and look for numerical synergies with the way you play your wizard, that is my advice. In DDO there is no perfect, unique and wonderful build, for each build there are usually several viable combinations. But be careful, because with the wizard it is easy to slide into areas of uselessness, there is not much room for error. Basically everything is designed for different playstyles than the one the wizard demands.
 

EinarMal

Well-known member
Slot
Head Dino (20/10/5 Acid,+2 Sacred,Walking)
Eye Legendary Dusk Lenses
Armor Dino (Voidscale,Voidfang,+5 Cold,Resistance,Walking)
Wrist Legendary Kopru Bracers (+20 Force, Dread)
Ring1 Bound Elemental Ring of Acid (Chained)
Ring2 Bound Elemental Ring of Frost (Chained)
Boots Osfield's Lightning Boots (Dread)
Gloves Dino Artifact (Int +15, 10/5 Force,Ghostly,Dread)
Cloak Legendary Walking Ancestor's Shroud (Walking)
Belt Legendary Black Satin Waist
Trinket Epic Gem of Many Facets (Void Lore,Con +14,Ins. Intelligence,Elders)
Necklace Elder's Focus (Elders)
Weapon Attuned Dino Weapon (Shadowscale, Meltfang, Brightclaw, Flamehorn, Dread)
Weapon Legendary Powder-Packed Barrel (Dread)

This packs in Walking, Dread, Chained elements, and Elders.

With this setup you can get standing ~900-1000 spell power across all elements pre-meta.

The critical chance is going to be around 50-65% depending on the elements but you cover Acid, Lightning, Sonic, Cold, Fire, Force, Fire, Void

The biggest downside is critical damage, the range is 40-100, but you can only really choose 2 to really push. Acid is the main one, the other chosen here is Force. That can vary on preference. Acid/Force can get up to 80-100 range, the other elements are going to be around 40-50.

If you take Ruin/Gruin and Draconic Ruin Intensified with Acid, I can solo Iron Golem-heavy quests like Reach for the Sky or Best Laid Plans on R6 with very reasonable completion times. I am not claiming to be the best player, I am sure someone could solo at least some quests on R10.

It does sacrifice some DC, if you run Fatesinger and use the IOD staff that gets you another +4 DC to all schools.

Reaper Int: 116

DCs (No Boost):
Illusion: 129
Necro: 126
Enchant: 124
Conjuration: 118
Evocation: 118

Enhancements (98)
Archmage 41
Racial 17
Palemaster 23
Falconry 8
Feydark 9

Epic Destiny DC (75)
Draconic 35
Primal 24
Magus 16

Feats: (7 + 5WB)
1-Quicken
1-(WB) Maximize
3-Arcane Initiate
5-(WB) Empower
6-Extend swap Enlarge
9-SF Conjuration
10-(WB) SF Illusion
12-Insightful Reflexes
15-(WB) SF Necromancy
15-GSF Necromancy
18-GSF Illusion
20-(WB) Heighten
21-Epic SF Necromancy
22-Epic Spellpower Acid
24-Embolden
25-Epic Spell Power Force
27-Ruin
28-Epic Spell Power Cold
30-Scion of Feywild
30-Greater Ruin
31-Spell Specialty Enchantment

Augments
Topaz of Enchantment Power
Topaz of Conjuration Power
Topaz of Evocation Power
Topaz of Greater Enchantment
Topaz of Greater Necromancy
Topaz of Greater Illusion
Topaz of Greater Conjuration
Topaz of Greater Evocation
Saphire of Heavy Fortification
Saphire of Defense
Saphire of False Life
Saphire of Dodge
Pomura's Momento
Ravil's Book of Legendary Recipes
Diamond of Spellcraft
Diamond of Heal
Legendary Moment to Legendary Moment
Diamond of Insightful Constitution
Festive Int
Festive Con
Globe of Imperial Blood
The Blackstone Liturgy
Ruby of Devotion
Diamond of Perform
 

magnus2882

Active member
The next thing is not to make the mistake of linking your mantle to negative energy. That's a trap.
To each their own... depends on your build, equipment, etc. I ALWAYS link my mantle to Neg energy, To me, that's the key for (my build) to run high reaper. I've stated many times that I don't find a problem with immune mobs, deathward, etc. Very rarely i'll have to cast arcane tempest or acid well to deal with mobs that resist my neg energy, and because I have 1000 negative spell power with 120% Spell crit and 70% crit prob, the dots on my mantle eliminate all trash instantly... And running Leg raids, most bosses are vulnerable to neg energy as an added bonus.
 

Timmius

Active member
I have 1000 negative spell power with 120% Spell crit and 70% crit prob
that is impressive. i usually get my numbers somewhere in the 700's for negative and the elementals I use. I wear end game equipment that provides spell power and I use augments too. Curious to where you find that extra oomph
 

Hobgoblin

Well-known member
You need insightful and quality of whatever element you are trying to boost. For crit chance it is mostly dinosaur crafted stuff
 

magnus2882

Active member
that is impressive. i usually get my numbers somewhere in the 700's for negative and the elementals I use. I wear end game equipment that provides spell power and I use augments too. Curious to where you find that extra oomph

more or less it's trying to get any source you can for neg spell power / USP.

for equipment, I have 4 piece autumn set from feywild (gives 6% universal crit chance for 4 piece bonus) ;
3 piece leg. dreadkeeper (best set in game for pale master)
dino ring with 35% spell crit
most of my filigrees are neg/usp (with 5 piece Dranconic soul for 10% spell crit)
Epic scepter of nullification
leg stygian wrath

tier 5 mote
tier 4 DI


that's pretty much it.
 

Timmius

Active member
more or less it's trying to get any source you can for neg spell power / USP.

for equipment, I have 4 piece autumn set from feywild (gives 6% universal crit chance for 4 piece bonus) ;
3 piece leg. dreadkeeper (best set in game for pale master)
dino ring with 35% spell crit
most of my filigrees are neg/usp (with 5 piece Dranconic soul for 10% spell crit)
Epic scepter of nullification
leg stygian wrath

tier 5 mote
tier 4 DI


that's pretty much it.
thank you
 

Raoul Duke

New member
Everything depends on the level of content you are playing, also are you doing quest solo, duo or in a group. Since we usually play R10's, our insta killer simply holds them or dances. Other than that...FoD, Trap, PK, Weird, Wail, everything basically evaporates before any melee can get to a mob :LOL:
Other than force/untyped spells/feats such as ruin/g.ruin, disintegrate, h.willting and m.swarm there is also a possibility of going fatesinger as secondary destiny, investing a bit in sonic lore/spell power and going with FSingers Strike a chord, it's 2 SP, 2 sec cooldown strike that can apply a bunch of debuffs on problematic mobs (with dino weapons for example) and with a tiny bit more investment...it can do A LOT of single target damage, espec if you mass hold the DW'd mob.
Another option is to have Powder packed barrel as a weapon swap, so you can smack that problematic mob with MSwarm ;)
Hope this gives you a bit of inspiration.
 
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