Unyielding Sentinel: Hands of the Sentinel - bug or wai?

Jhml

Well-known member
Hello

I took Hands of the Sentinel (ie. Lay on Hands) for my wiz 18 rogue 2 epic 9 toon. She has 29 CON so the modifier is +9.

By my calculation it should heal (10 + level) x CON modifier = 351 points of damage but my ability only heals 180 points of damage, as if it was only using 20 as the level modifier. Can anyone tell me what's up? :)
 

The Blonde

Catalogues Bugs
If you were getting healed for 180 then that would mean that the calculation identified your level as 10, which is very weird. Are you still encountering this behavior?
 

Jhml

Well-known member
If you were getting healed for 180 then that would mean that the calculation identified your level as 10, which is very weird. Are you still encountering this behavior?
Right, I've since epic reincarnated. I am now rogue 2 wizard 18 epic 4, with CON score of 33 (+11). Lay on hands produced 292 points now, which is better but still not correct as far as I can see: by my calculations it should be (10+24) x 11 = 374.

No big deal, since Renewal is a better and points-cheaper way to heal myself in the unyielding sentinel tree, but weird nonetheless.
 

Jhml

Well-known member
I assume that character is undead, with only hamp coming from ship buffs
She's not a pale master (used to use halfling tree & feat for healing) and doesn't benefit from negative healing in any way.
 

rabidfox

The People's Champion
This is what the ability from US shows in game.
brmGTei.jpg

The character (lvl 29) I tested on has 14 cha modifier and 40 hamp.
Heroic Lvl 20 * 14 = 280
280 * 1.4 = 392
Et5TCdP.jpg

And it matched up mathwise when I lowered my charisma too. It appears the math is (heroic character level * ability mod) * hamp.

Tried it on a character with 0 CHA mod and 11 CON mod/ 25 HAMP
20 x 11 x 1.25 = 275 which is the amount it healed for. Wiki is wrong.
 

Jhml

Well-known member
This is what the ability from US shows in game.
brmGTei.jpg

The character (lvl 29) I tested on has 14 cha modifier and 40 hamp.
Heroic Lvl 20 * 14 = 280
280 * 1.4 = 392
Et5TCdP.jpg

And it matched up mathwise when I lowered my charisma too. It appears the math is (heroic character level * ability mod) * hamp.

Tried it on a character with 0 CHA mod and 11 CON mod/ 25 HAMP
20 x 11 x 1.25 = 275 which is the amount it healed for. Wiki is wrong.
Ahh, I thought it would include epic levels as well. Right, that's sorted then. Thank you!
 

PraetorPlato

Well-known member
Hmm, I just tried on a level 32 char and got different results

4315 points of healing, +31 mod, 248 hamp. 20*31*3.48=2157. Pretty sure I'm just doing some silly math, because the numbers I had in my head were the way that rabid calculated it.
 

Tuxedomanwashere

Well-known member
Hmm, I just tried on a level 32 char and got different results

4315 points of healing, +31 mod, 248 hamp. 20*31*3.48=2157. Pretty sure I'm just doing some silly math, because the numbers I had in my head were the way that rabid calculated it.
Question. Did you take the "Light the Dark" AoE upgrade at T5?
 

Tuxedomanwashere

Well-known member
Have you fiddled around with positive spell power and/or melee spell power and see if that changes anything? The wiki says it doesn't scale, but perhaps that was changed at some point.
 

The Blonde

Catalogues Bugs
The ability is definitely bugged in terms of the levels it uses:

Regular Lay on Hands is (10 + Paladin level) x CHA mod
Hands of the Sentinel is 20 x CHA/CON mod

As you can see, the Hands of the Sentinel are missing a +10, since the (10+Paladin level) maxes out at 30, not 20. So either the calculation is missing the base +10, or the "character levels" calculation caps at 10 class levels.

Additionally (after it's fixed), the description of the enhancement should say "and also uses your total class levels instead of paladin level".

Relevant thread here.
 

Buddha5440

Well-known member
It does show a bug in the wiki that states: "Bug: Treats your level as 10". So I would think it may have been that way for a while.
 

shoka

New member
Hmm, I just tried on a level 32 char and got different results

4315 points of healing, +31 mod, 248 hamp. 20*31*3.48=2157. Pretty sure I'm just doing some silly math, because the numbers I had in my head were the way that rabid calculated it.
What were your melee power and positive spell power numbers when you got 4315 points of healing? Your math 20*31*3.48=2157 looks right to me if the calc is really supposed to use heroic level without the extra +10 per the wiki article (see next paragraph). You have Light in the Dark for a multiplier based on the higher of melee power or 1/2 (positive) spell power, so if you have about 100 melee power or 300 positive spell power, you would expect to see 2157 raised to about 4315, based on the description.

Normal Lay on Hands: I have a level 4 paladin with +3 CHA bonus from 16 CHA. Zero positive amp. His Lay on Hands heals him from 42 points. The only way that works is if the calculation is (Paladin Level +10) x CHA bonus. (4+10) x 3 = 42.

The calculation for Hands of the Sentinal really looks to be bugged, and treats your level as 10. Light in the Dark is also bugged, at least for me.

I respec'd my Unyielding Sentinal tree to try this with and without Light in the Dark. I'm not getting ANY bonus from it other than AOE.

My L32 character has a CON mod of +27 with positive healing amp 105 and also gets the expected healing based on 20 x 27 x 2.05=1107. However, with Light in the Dark I am still healing for 1107. My positive spell power is 609. I should be getting the heal increased by 7.09/2=3.545X. So it should be 3.545 x 1107 = 3924.

My character is a human wizard who mostly uses negative healing (with neg. amp 241) from all 3 death auras but I've been trying out the Unyielding Sentinal tree for a few weeks to see how I can be more supportive in raids. I can turn undead shroud off and on, and see exactly the 50% healing penalty with it on, so in that case my self heals are only 553. And that stays the same with or without Light in the Dark.
 
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Urklore

Well-known member
I also hate that when you take sentinel of the hand it places the ability as a feat (under a paladin heading). I keep looking for it in the destiny tab with the other destiny abilities.
 
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