Update 63 Preview 2: Deck of Many Curses

[Rull]

So the best twf dps is now a kukri vistani with favored kukris I guess? How many dino kukris and/or cleansers would you expect to need to get two? 160? Ugh.

 

[Mordenkainen]

So the best twf dps is now a kukri vistani with favored kukris I guess? How many dino kukris and/or cleansers would you expect to need to get two? 160? Ugh.

160 cleansers @$10 each cleanser = $1600 for a pair of the best kukri's in the game.

 

[Spook]

Yup it’s reaper all over again. The bonus is too big to ignore so it’s going to be an insane grind.

 

[Rull]

160 cleansers @$10 each cleanser = $1600 for a pair of the best kukri's in the game.

Yeah that would probably be it for me then. Doesn't really matter if it's $160 or $1600 or $16000. You can already buy xp, if you can also just buy the best items (with only having to get the base items once instead of many times like everyone else), it's not a game anymore.

 

[The Delusionist]

Perhaps we can have flavor texts that make the effects seem more curse-like even if they are beneficial?

Some samples, using Nikodeamus' list:

Effect	Flavor Text
deathblock	The bearer is bound to walk forever in the land of the living, denied their rightful rest.
+6 Strength Boost	This item grants remarkable strength at the cost of gentleness. Do not wield while sewing.
Featherfall	This item defies the laws of gravity. Someday, in the distant future, the world may catch up with it at once.
+1 attack and dmg	This item focuses the bearer on the task at hand, absorbing the user so completely that other details may be missed.
10k sent	This item is marked by Mortality as a threat. Destroying it may prove imprudent for the future of Korvaire, though it may grant the bearer the fiend's fleeting fortune.
+1 Pact Dice	The faintest excerpts of a glowing arcane contract may be read as follows: "By wielding an artifact cursed with this enchantment, the bearer agrees to..." The lines become much too small to read thereafter, no matter how much you attempt to magnify them.
Fear immunity	Powerful magics subtly encourage bravery in the bearer no matter what dangers they face. But such courage in combat comes at a cost of reduced life expectancy.
+2 MRR	This item rejects your attempts to enchant it. It rejects all enchantments on principle. It doesn't particularly like you either.
+2 tactical	This item whispers into your subconscious mind. Your first thought when entering a room is always of how to murder anyone there. You feel some sense of guilt when visiting friends or family, but are better able to best any threats.
True Seeing	You see all. You cannot unsee what is seen, and are forever haunted. The secret habbits of a long-time friend. The hints of thoughts that they would never act upon. And it changes you, despite yourself.
+4 Spell Power	The weave flows freely through you. You can feel its threads merge with the spindles of your own lifeline. And you can feel your own span shorten, however so slightly, with every spell you cast.
+1 illusion DCs	Sometimes those you speak with lose themselves in your words, your eyes, or your voice. Lengthy conversations are nigh impossible, and you still aren't certain why.

 

[Bunker]

Why is it such a bad idea to have a random generator for a bonus type.

Every other bonus and buff in the game can be well coordinated to be placed on a character build. A bit of random is not a bad idea.

For those that want yet another perfect combination, by all means grind it out.

These bonuses are not over the top, and the randomizer style engine is fitting.

 

[CherryBomb]

Sorry, I have not read every entry in this thread, just the first few and those of the other preview threads.

Question: Is this Deck of Many Curses an event or permanent feature that is forthcoming?

 

[rabidfox]

Sorry, I have not read every entry in this thread, just the first few and those of the other preview threads.

Question: Is this Deck of Many Curses an event or permanent feature that is forthcoming?

The cards (for the deck) comes from the new challenge mode quests and is permanent new item. The event is just a week (or so) long one-time world event to unlock the new quests which then stay unlocked forever.

 

[The Blonde]

Dear devs, I'm gonna make one final attempt to at least get you to remove some of the more insane bonuses from the list, such as +2 Imbue Dice, +2 SA dice, +2 ability, +6 STR when Action Boost, etc. The minor versions are fine.

Thank you for your consideration.

 

[seph1roth5]

Why is it such a bad idea to have a random generator for a bonus type.

Every other bonus and buff in the game can be well coordinated to be placed on a character build. A bit of random is not a bad idea.

For those that want yet another perfect combination, by all means grind it out.

These bonuses are not over the top, and the randomizer style engine is fitting.

Problem is it's not just "a bit of random"

 

[Airmaiden]

I do not think this is a "Game Breaking" power creep. (Depending on how uncommon the curse Removals are going to be).

If they are ULTA RARE:

Take a D50 or D75 (Depending on how many effects there are) and roll it 12- 13 times (once for each item/ weapon you are using).
You might get 3-4 that will do ANYTHING for your build.


NOW, the grinders will:

Grind out More items (the ones that they got a crappy curse/ no good for their build).....of course they will have to grind out another mythic/ reaper blank!!!.....then try again



By the time they get a gear set that is "Near Perfect"..........BOOM!!!! Level increase/ New gear .......START OVER!


ENJOY THE GRIND!

 

[Mordenkainen]

I do not think this is a "Game Breaking" power creep. (Depending on how uncommon the curse Removals are going to be).

If they are ULTA RARE:

Take a D50 or D75 (Depending on how many effects there are) and roll it 12- 13 times (once for each item/ weapon you are using).
You might get 3-4 that will do ANYTHING for your build.


NOW, the grinders will:

Grind out More items (the ones that they got a crappy curse/ no good for their build).....of course they will have to grind out another mythic/ reaper blank!!!.....then try again



By the time they get a gear set that is "Near Perfect"..........BOOM!!!! Level increase/ New gear .......START OVER!


ENJOY THE GRIND!

Exactly.

This is one grind that is just not worth doing. I know some of you will but by the time you get anywhere; it's time to start over again. Just not worth starting in the first place.

 

[Mordenkainen]

Wel let me caveat what I said above.

If you are on your 5th life or whatever and you got like another 200 to go. This actually might be worth it for leveling gear, 1-10,10-20, 20-30 etc.

Otherwise, for capped gear (which will become obsolete after the next level increase) it's idiotic to even consider adding these on.

 

[saekee]

Perhaps we can have flavor texts that make the effects seem more curse-like even if they are beneficial?

Some samples, using Nikodeamus' list:

Effect	Flavor Text
deathblock	The bearer is bound to walk forever in the land of the living, denied their rightful rest.
+6 Strength Boost	This item grants remarkable strength at the cost of gentleness. Do not wield while sewing.
Featherfall	This item defies the laws of gravity. Someday, in the distant future, the world may catch up with it at once.
+1 attack and dmg	This item focuses the bearer on the task at hand, absorbing the user so completely that other details may be missed.
10k sent	This item is marked by Mortality as a threat. Destroying it may prove imprudent for the future of Korvaire, though it may grant the bearer the fiend's fleeting fortune.
+1 Pact Dice	The faintest excerpts of a glowing arcane contract may be read as follows: "By wielding an artifact cursed with this enchantment, the bearer agrees to..." The lines become much too small to read thereafter, no matter how much you attempt to magnify them.
Fear immunity	Powerful magics subtly encourage bravery in the bearer no matter what dangers they face. But such courage in combat comes at a cost of reduced life expectancy.
+2 MRR	This item rejects your attempts to enchant it. It rejects all enchantments on principle. It doesn't particularly like you either.
+2 tactical	This item whispers into your subconscious mind. Your first thought when entering a room is always of how to murder anyone there. You feel some sense of guilt when visiting friends or family, but are better able to best any threats.
True Seeing	You see all. You cannot unsee what is seen, and are forever haunted. The secret habbits of a long-time friend. The hints of thoughts that they would never act upon. And it changes you, despite yourself.
+4 Spell Power	The weave flows freely through you. You can feel its threads merge with the spindles of your own lifeline. And you can feel your own span shorten, however so slightly, with every spell you cast.
+1 illusion DCs	Sometimes those you speak with lose themselves in your words, your eyes, or your voice. Lengthy conversations are nigh impossible, and you still aren't certain why.

this reminds me of the amber temple effects! nice writeup

 

[nenetteblackmoor]

Isn't DDO strange?

Events seem to inflict pain rather than provide enjoyment, and they constantly tweak the balance by nerfing things.
What players truly desire isn't just powerful items, but 'fun.'
Everyone has their own way of having fun, and a system that doesn't allow for easy curse cleansing can't be accepted by everyone, as it prevents them from 'having fun.'

I always say, "DDO developers can create code and systems, but they can't create worlds or fun," and it feels like this time too, they're just writing code and implementing systems without any consideration for whether it's actually enjoyable for the players.

I would like to ask the developers where they think the players find the fun in this system.

They just need to implement the same kind of enjoyment that comes from identifying items in Wizardry 1.

 

[TedSandyman]

Isn't DDO strange?

Events seem to inflict pain rather than provide enjoyment, and they constantly tweak the balance by nerfing things.
What players truly desire isn't just powerful items, but 'fun.'
Everyone has their own way of having fun, and a system that doesn't allow for easy curse cleansing can't be accepted by everyone, as it prevents them from 'having fun.'

I always say, "DDO developers can create code and systems, but they can't create worlds or fun," and it feels like this time too, they're just writing code and implementing systems without any consideration for whether it's actually enjoyable for the players.

I would like to ask the developers where they think the players find the fun in this system.

They just need to implement the same kind of enjoyment that comes from identifying items in Wizardry 1.

The fun is running the same four hard quests over and over to get these cards.

If you have a cursed item on every piece of equipment then you will indeed be overpowered.

The most fun part is that the effects are random, so people who only care about being the most uber, the whales out there, you know who you are, will be forced to reroll items over and over and over and run these quests over and over and over until they get the perfect gear set.

Then, they can sit back and complain some more about how bored they are and how only the new quests are challenging and all the old stuff is trivial and boring and the old gear is worthless.

"But you cant reroll the things over and over and over since the clensers are rare drops", one might argue.

Once the clensers hit the ddo store you can, and man what a windfall for SSG.

No. Fun hasn't been the driving force for a while. It is more of "how do we create a risk/reward system that makes serious money".

It is very much like gambling and is simply a new version of the Mystery Box scam.

 

[CBDunk]

If you have a cursed item on every piece of equipment then you will indeed be overpowered.

Or... you could get curses on every gear slot that do absolutely nothing for your build.

Indeed, unless they have changed it since the previews, it is even possible to get curses that do absolutely nothing for ANY build. Such as '+2 Fortune Bonus to rune arm DCs'... on an orb.

"But you cant reroll the things over and over and over since the clensers are rare drops", one might argue.

Once the clensers hit the ddo store you can, and man what a windfall for SSG.

No. Fun hasn't been the driving force for a while. It is more of "how do we create a risk/reward system that makes serious money".

It is very much like gambling and is simply a new version of the Mystery Box scam.

You are very confident in your cynicism. I am equally confident that you are wrong.

I won't say NEVER, because anything could happen in the future. DDO could be sold off to another company or there could be a management change for any number of other reasons.

Thus, it COULD happen... but I don't believe it will any time soon.

...and even if it DID, you are VASTLY over-estimating the power level of the curse system as it currently stands. It provides VERY minor benefits compared to; mythic bonuses, reaper bonuses, filigrees, and augments. All of the those existing systems are 'more powerful' AND easier to optimize (yes, even reaper bonuses on gear are easier to optimize than curses).

There is ONE curse which will potentially allow new play styles in that it can make ANY weapon a favored weapon for all characters. That hasn't been possible before and thus will open up new class / weapon combinations with favored weapon bonuses... but again, that's not "MASSIVE POWER CREEP"!!!! Just a nice potential increase in build diversity.

 

[Mordenkainen]

The fun is running the same four hard quests over and over to get these cards.

If you have a cursed item on every piece of equipment then you will indeed be overpowered.

The most fun part is that the effects are random, so people who only care about being the most uber, the whales out there, you know who you are, will be forced to reroll items over and over and over and run these quests over and over and over until they get the perfect gear set.

Then, they can sit back and complain some more about how bored they are and how only the new quests are challenging and all the old stuff is trivial and boring and the old gear is worthless.

"But you cant reroll the things over and over and over since the clensers are rare drops", one might argue.

Once the clensers hit the ddo store you can, and man what a windfall for SSG.

No. Fun hasn't been the driving force for a while. It is more of "how do we create a risk/reward system that makes serious money".

It is very much like gambling and is simply a new version of the Mystery Box scam.

They curses are extremely OP for leveling gear. Imagine having a full set of curses on level 1 gear... even level 10-19 gear it'll be *** OP.

If you're a brand spanking new player and you have some obsession in getting full racial completionist (the most power short of epic PL's) then I recommend just grinding like 20+ copies of each leveling gear and then trying to add these curses on them and try to get lucky. In the long run it'll help tons especially since you might not know the leveling content well and especially especially since getting the curses and cards are all F2P.

But that's where the usefulness of these cards ends... unless you're some super whale.(and I do mean like a SUPER whale).

 

[Ratman]

"Presumably" is doing a lot of heavy lifting there. We don't know how exactly these cards are going to be rewarded. Will they scale with reaper or will elite give the max rewards? If it's capped to elite they'll just become a daily that any pugger can grind out and doing these challenges on higher difficulties will have the same reward of just bragging rights that reaper raids give. In my opinion they shouldn't allow these quests to be ran on reaper and norm/hard/elite should be scaled to R1/R6/R10 difficulty

Please no. Maybe I am misunderstanding what you’re suggesting here but Some people do not have that kind of time, nor a server that is populous enough to be running extreme dungeons on r10 with any sort of regularity and therefore they will be shut out of many if not all rewards. These rewards/curses should be accessible to every player randomly (like GOMF in chrono) and the grinding for the effect you really want should be the mechanic for doing so — not making it so difficult that just those in “endgame mode” — where they need so much completionist content done to be able to even try to obtain them.

Hello, everyone!

This preview has some changes to the Deck of Many Curses! Feel free to talk about those changes here.

There's also a new item in this preview, the Card of Curse Cleansing - Find more info and discuss that item here! (Please keep all discussion about curse removal/rerolling to that thread instead of this one.)

Here's a list of changes from last preview:

• Cards now drop at expected rates in the four new Dungeons in this update.
• Some deck effects that were not functioning in Preview 1 now do.
• The following Curses have been removed: Major Intuition (-2 Minimum Level), Superior Augmentation (Extra Augment Slot), Curse of the Deckmaster (Set Bonus), Wealth (weight and plat value), Stone (weight and sink in water), and Minor Intuition (-1 Minimum Level).
• The Curse of Divine Fortune now does both effects previously listed in its tooltip, though the Favored Weapon only works if the item is in fact a weapon.
• The Curse of the Sentient's Meal (Sentient XP) now also increases the platinum value of the item by 100,000.
• The Threat Increase has been removed from Curse of the Anger's Heart.
• The Threat Decrease from the Curse of the Charming Presence.
• The Curse of Weapon's Touch Strikethrough has been increased.
• The rarity of some effects has been adjusted.
• The list of supported item types that are not compatible with the Deck of Many Curses has been adjusted to include Cosmetics, Wands, Scrolls, Quivers, and Ammunition.
• Some new effects have been added to the Deck.

My rig is in the shop so I haven’t had a chance to lammania this one, so perhaps I may be off base with just reading the descriptions, but is there a way to make the decks different by effect type? For instance a “universal deck” you could build would have things like stats, feather falling, armor bonuses and dodge, item wear, etc… A “Deck of Cursed Invocations” would have things like fire or electricity or spell DC, and a “Deck of Cursed Blades” would have things like action boosts, doublestrike or assassinate. I for one would be highly annoyed to get incite bonuses on a magic using build and +1 to Conjuration for a fighting build. Can you maybe consider making the grind for these at least somewhat relevant to the build you have? Even at the expense of making them a bit harder to obtain or even cleanse?

 

[Mordenkainen]

The Cursed cards are really not for casual or even "regular" players. I don't think anyone will frelnleft behind because so few of us will have maxed out "meta'd"Curse Cards on any of our toons.

Just be happy selling cards for shards on the AH is what I say.