Can we get just a lil' BAB progression in Legendaries? Please?

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Drachmor

Well-known member
Apparently melees get their final attack speed boost at 25 BAB. Epics give you 5 BAB... finding 20 from heroics is tough, as BAB rounds down (so any multiclassing with less-than-best melee progressions will suffer the loss). There are ways to get BAB up, like Tensor's, but that's a big ask for a lot of melee builds and difficult to keep up (swapping to a scroll every minute or whatever it is). The alternative is the Divine Crusader mantle, which sets your BAB equal to your level (serving allegedly no purpose beyond 25).

Could we get some progression in Legendaries? Even .25?
 
Kessaran

Kessaran

Well-known member
Barbarian, Fighter, Paladin, Ranger all will get 25 BAB if they are the dominant class. Cleric, FvS, Warlock, Wizard/Sorc (Eldritch Knight), Alchemist get it from their melee focused enhancement tree's as long as you meet the capstone requirement. There's really no reason you're not able to get max BAB with any melee build. If your build can't get there, that's the fault of your build and not the game.
 
Kessaran

Kessaran

Well-known member
By design to my understanding. There's no real reason for Legendaries to grant increased BAB. With no benefit to melee users past 25 BAB, increasing BAB further just forces us to have even higher +attack bonuses to make up for it.
 
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Drachmor

Well-known member
Kessaran said:
Barbarian, Fighter, Paladin, Ranger all will get 25 BAB if they are the dominant class. Cleric, FvS, Warlock, Wizard/Sorc (Eldritch Knight), Alchemist get it from their melee focused enhancement tree's as long as you meet the capstone requirement. There's really no reason you're not able to get max BAB with any melee build. If your build can't get there, that's the fault of your build and not the game.
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Really not sure what you mean by this. What does "dominant class" mean here...? If I have 18 levels of fighter and 2 levels of... anything besides barbarian, paladin, and ranger, I'm not going to reach 25 BAB automatically.

Then you mention T5s / Capstones for clerics, FVS, Warlocks, EKs, and Alchemists...? As if the fact that I can get 25 BAB on a pure cleric melee is like... a winning point? If your melee build has to take the T5 or a *capstone* from one of those trees (so it's... a pure cleric, fvs, warlock, EK, or Alchemist) to get 25 BAB, it's... also probably not the best melee build lol. Except maybe EK.

It's just weird to list a few fringe examples that require *heavy* investment into a particular (off-melee) tree as if that substantiates your "any melee build" point... especially after the confusing "dominant class" remark, which is simply untrue.
 
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Drachmor

Well-known member
droid327 said:
If everyone could hit 25 BAB with no tradeoff, then there's no point in having different BABs. Full-BAB builds are supposed to be better at melee than partial builds
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See, this is an argument I could get behind. I still think my suggestion of .25 BAB per Legendary level could be reasonable, sort of following in the theory behind the "weapon specialty" feats: they do level the differences between certain builds, but are only obtainable by the time you're level 31.
 
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Drachmor

Well-known member
Kessaran said:
By design to my understanding. There's no real reason for Legendaries to grant increased BAB. With no benefit to melee users past 25 BAB, increasing BAB further just forces us to have even higher +attack bonuses to make up for it.
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I'm also kind of confused by this point... besides the implication here that everyone just has 25 BAB automatically, can you elaborate on the reason why this would have any downside...? How would it force us to have higher +attack bonuses to make up for it.
 
Kessaran

Kessaran

Well-known member
Drachmor said:
Really not sure what you mean by this. What does "dominant class" mean here...? If I have 18 levels of fighter and 2 levels of... anything besides barbarian, paladin, and ranger, I'm not going to reach 25 BAB automatically.

Then you mention T5s / Capstones for clerics, FVS, Warlocks, EKs, and Alchemists...? As if the fact that I can get 25 BAB on a pure cleric melee is like... a winning point? If your melee build has to take the T5 or a *capstone* from one of those trees (so it's... a pure cleric, fvs, warlock, EK, or Alchemist) to get 25 BAB, it's... also probably not the best melee build lol. Except maybe EK.

It's just weird to list a few fringe examples that require *heavy* investment into a particular (off-melee) tree as if that substantiates your "any melee build" point... especially after the confusing "dominant class" remark, which is simply untrue.
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Dominant class meaning your primary focus of enhancements is that class. There's absolutely 0 logical reason your build would not take a T4/T5 or Core that would grant that class the missing BAB if split out. Even looking at something like pure FvS who'd land under 25 BAB, even as a Cha build it makes no sense not to take the Divine Power t5. And even if you chose not to do that your argument would STILL be invalid because .25 BAB would mean you'd need level 50 before you hit 25 BAB as a 20 FvS.


The point of those enhancements is to allow a wider variety of classes/splits/builds access to the max BAB. They encourage build diversity, and your point is moot because some of those split builds ARE the best melee builds. I will concede defeat on the capstone point, as the only class that requires a capstone to get max BAB is Warlock, the rest are either t5 or t4 enhancements. Apologies for the confusion.


Higher BAB means higher attack bonus required to guarantee hits on the target. It's the mechanic in the game that let's Casters and non "Melee" classes to still hit targets with their weapons even though their "to-hit" bonus is marginally lower than a melee build. Changing anything about BAB now would indicate changes to max BAB. Seeing how the engine struggles now with attack speed there's 0 logical reason to increase BAB, and it would require higher "to-hit" bonuses then we currently have.
 
PersonMan

PersonMan

Well-known member
There are different buffs that give you BaB equal to your character level. Whether by feat, enhancement, destiny, or spell, every character can at least temporarily have max BaB.
 
K

Kintaya

Active member
Ying said:
Casting Tenser's every 1:06 is terrible user experience.
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Fair. But with the requested .25 BAB per legendary level the most you can get is +1 bab if your current is .5 or .75.
But even if you get +1 per level - an additional 2 BAB won't really make that much of a difference to any build. I have over +100 to hit on a tank with 39 str, 20 bab and no accuracy gear right now. If I slot some str and accuracy, enter a quest and buff up - i can probably get past 150. Another +2 at those values is almost negligible. You don't need bab for feats at that point either. The only place I can see it making a difference is fusilades maybe.
 
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