Don't repeat Vecna Unleashed

[Lofen]

Just finished playing through this pack for the first time, and through the new quests that were released in the recent update - Spark of Life.
I should begin by mentioning that for what it's worth I enjoyed acute delirium and similar quests, so the occasional weirdness doesn't bother me at all.
Having said that - these sucked.

On a first play-through I usually solo with the sound on and do all the optionals, to get a feel for the quest. I did not bother with all the optionals in these, in most I just wanted to be done with this story. To be clear about my feedback - I felt these quests have nothing to do with dungeons OR dragons, they felt like someone's weak attempt at being whimsical, only without the humor or imagination to make it interesting, entertaining or worthwhile.
Apologies if this sounds harsh, it is honest.

Helping someone with test anxiety, or helping someone throw a party, or deal with real estate agents or practice for a date or help with a students loan, how is any of this on ddo? it's like the person in charge ran out of ideas and just started dropping in stuff from their personal life that they'd like help with.
I hope I do not sound uncaring - if it's a cry for help please get them the help they need.

As for the quests, I can only suggest that if you stick to bread and butter and apply yourself, eventually you'll be making amazing bread and butter.

 

[Col Kurtz]

the original Vecna thread someone dropped on release says all the same stuff I've read here maybe someone should link that one.

Bark n Blade is a cute idea... maybe could be a section or two shorter...soloing that is a bit of a pain timewise

I pretty much like the whole pack...except maybe we can get an optional in the Loan one, to side with the Demon. MWAHAHA
Tough> You signed in Blood.... and now trade school sounds pretty appealing, doesn't it? LMAO

the court area are side quests... we could consider those like collateral damage or side effects from Vecna pushing into the realm.. maybe they make some sense with that thought?

Love the end Boss riding the T rex

 

[kmoustakas]

The ones in Vecna that really bothered me were What Dreams May Come and Party 101. Neither of those were a reasonable concept for Legendary characters (in fact they were pretty weak for Level 18s, they may have been appropriate for a level 5 character).

But Party 101 really stands out as quest that simply shouldn't exist for Legendary character. It wasn't the mechanics of the quest that were the problem but the rational and story. Why build a world of legendary characters taking on wanna be Gods only to have them run around a University and encounter security systems and students that were a match for those characters? Should Level 32 characters walk into a lecture and be fairly matched by students in the class? Should they be challenged by a security system designed to maintain student curfew? That seems like a world that doesn't need heroes. And it's all to help some dweeb have a party? Ridiculous and insulting.

Better writing could have at least made it reasonable. The Legendary characters could help rescue important students who had broke curfew to throw a party and got caught in one of Vecna's incursions. Of course that couldn't have saved the killer pies room. That part was simply too dumb to save.

IMHO part of this problem is the repackaging of the same content at multiple levels. Quests that may make sense for level 5s or Level 18s simply don't make sense for Level 32s (and vice versa). If the wildlife in an area or average mobs walking the streets of town can challenge Level 32s what are the regular people of the world doing? It breaks reasonable world building when Low level heroic and Legendary characters are saving the world from the same God like menaces. Why write something intelligent if it is going to come back to that incongruity? It seems like the devs agree that its futile based on those quests.

That is exceptionally spot on. Both party 101 and dreams may come (although I like them mechanically) remind me of all the legendary rats I've had to fight in this damn game.

 

[Malruk]

I will add my vote on enjoying the diversity of quest types. I don't want everything to be ravenloft. I appreciated the commentary on student loan debt. But, as was mentioned, having a legendary quest about helping a student throw a party that involves fighting campus security breaks the "scene". While enjoyable, that framing should be for a level 5 quest, for legendary it needs to be retooled with different obstacles and monsters.

In general the reskin of low heroics to be epic (borderlands) or legendary (salt marsh) that one would expect to fight as a low heroic character is disappointing. It's very jarring to go from slaying dragons and giants in late heroic to rats killing you in epic and other vermin all over again in legendary. Unless there is some story to support why they are a challenge eg the stone that made rodents giant in lower morgrave. That totally fit and was enjoyable.

 

[Blaster]

Is it possible the Nymph's Court quests would be better received had they not been part of the saga; perhaps if they had been released as a support pack similar to the Soul Splitter chain with Sharn. The quests do not fall into the main storyline of the expansion, but do have a connection to it in varying capacity, and are not required to finish the saga.

Since the quests are all relatively short, make them free to VIP or purchasable as a pack via the store at a reduced cost, or include them in free content codes like we have gotten over the years. Slice of Life will after April will go this route and it is only three quests, so I don't see any reason why the student-based quests couldn't have done the same.

(The big caveat about all this being that gear and esoteric relics drop from these quests that are connected to the rest of Vecna Unleashed gear/sets, so retroactively splitting them off could cause an issue, but having done this before the release of Vecna Unleashed perhaps could have been addressed and gear shifted to other quests or maybe as in the case of The Soul Splitter and Slice of Life gear could have been made for its own unique set to compliment the Venca Unleashed sets.)

 

[Refutor]

One thing I'd like to add, is Vecna' had nothing at all compelling gear-wise for casters. I've run it multiple times, as well as the raid, but don't ever see the need to farm a single item. Which, for me, is a first with a new'ish expansion.

is that a mini-expansion thing? i don't recall many items i needed to farm from Saltmarsh either, and at least there was a raid this time!

 

[Ahpuch]

Is it possible the Nymph's Court quests would be better received had they not been part of the saga; perhaps if they had been released as a support pack similar to the Soul Splitter chain with Sharn. The quests do not fall into the main storyline of the expansion, but do have a connection to it in varying capacity, and are not required to finish the saga.

Since the quests are all relatively short, make them free to VIP or purchasable as a pack via the store at a reduced cost, or include them in free content codes like we have gotten over the years. Slice of Life will after April will go this route and it is only three quests, so I don't see any reason why the student-based quests couldn't have done the same.

(The big caveat about all this being that gear and esoteric relics drop from these quests that are connected to the rest of Vecna Unleashed gear/sets, so retroactively splitting them off could cause an issue, but having done this before the release of Vecna Unleashed perhaps could have been addressed and gear shifted to other quests or maybe as in the case of The Soul Splitter and Slice of Life gear could have been made for its own unique set to compliment the Venca Unleashed sets.)

That would have left them with insufficient content for the mini expansion price point. They would have to replaced them with other quests which would have the same problem if the writing didnt improve.

As quests they were fine. The problem was the story behind the quests. Rather than enrich the story of Vecna they took away from it. If they took their writing and world building seriously those quests may not have grated on so many players.

 

[Vox]

I only found about half of the quests engaging.

I really didn't like the boring long distance running of Bark & Blade, but what made me hate the quest was that LoB's voice actor was changed. It ruined the immersion (I know the DM was different for the quest vs LLOB).

AFAIK this was supposed to be a big endpoint conclusion to what began with the release of legendary Shroud in 2015, however it just didn't feel like that to me. Druids->High Road->Wheloon->Stormhorns was a much better scripted & experienced story + it had a end quest that felt like a high stakes adventure conclusion.

I just hope there is some kind of exposition interrupt in Myth Drannor.

 

[Drunken.dx]

Whoever complains about dream quest never experienced exam anxiety.

I love how it shows how bad it can be.

 

[Col Kurtz]

Whoever complains about dream quest never experienced exam anxiety.

I love how it shows how bad it can be.

how do you study for an exam? ..the doctor just checks you and you leave

 

[Oliphant]

All of the quests listed in the OP are the side quests relegated to the lower area. It was fine imo.

 

[Phoenicis]

IMO the lower area side quests should not have been part of the Saga. Aside from that, I think Vecna is (mostly) fine.

 

[Shear-buckler]

The Devils to Pay is a brilliant commentary on student loans. I enjoy almost everything about Vecna Unleashed. I find DDO quest design and variety to be first-rate. I appreciate that quests aren't stuck in 1991. It's great to have a dungeon crawl, but there is a lot more variety to quests and DDO taps into that. Take the time to read the stories, some are quite immersive.

Contemporary US politics is not a great basis for a theme for a DDO quest.

 

[Oliphant]

Why is education and exploitive lending "real life" and not DnD? DnD has civilizations organized into cities and towns, including humans and similar species and even lawful evil devils and djinn. Exploring all the ways the world is constituted is part of DnD. What kind of nonsense PnP games played with soft degens were folks running?

 

[Glargfest]

Why is education and exploitive lending "real life" and not DnD? DnD has civilizations organized into cities and towns, including humans and similar species and even lawful evil devils and djinn. Exploring all the ways the world is constituted is part of DnD. What kind of nonsense PnP games played with soft degens were folks running?

Ones where I delved dungeons and killed dragons my guy

 

[Shear-buckler]

Why is education and exploitive lending "real life" and not DnD? DnD has civilizations organized into cities and towns, including humans and similar species and even lawful evil devils and djinn. Exploring all the ways the world is constituted is part of DnD. What kind of nonsense PnP games played with soft degens were folks running?

In this case it's because it's a contemporary and local issue.

Social commentary works great in fantasy if you are dealing with universal and timeless struggles.

Just to make it clear, where im from student loans are fantastic and lets anyone from any social and economic background study at whatever university they have the grades for and pay it back over however long time period they want with 0-1% interest. That's not really captured in the quest, is it?

 

[Col Kurtz]

In this case it's because it's a contemporary and local issue.

Social commentary works great in fantasy if you are dealing with universal and timeless struggles.

Just to make it clear, where im from student loans are fantastic and lets anyone from any social and economic background study at whatever university they have the grades for and pay it back over however long time period they want with 0-1% interest. That's not really captured in the quest, is it?

i've avoided bringing up that quest in the forums.. it's totally political timing when that quest was released. Let's just assume the dev's are innocent, and keep a don't ask don't tell policy about that quest.

Happy Spring everyone! Spring Skiing was freakin awesome today! got to hit 4 peruvian, 3 little cloud, 1 tram, and 1 gadzoom run in this afternoon