not enough spell points while leveling?

[Cowsn]

So I'm wondering something about spell points.
Right now, at level 16, I have 1k spell points and I'm using mostly SLAs.
If I had to rely on spells that are not SLAs, and also use metamagic feats, I'd run out of spell points too fast.
If I disable metamagic feats, my damage would drop a lot (while also running out of spell points probably too early in long dungeons).
I guess it doesn't mater in heroic quests since they're too easy.

However, I've seen guides talking about using lots of non-SLA spells, even while leveling, but how?

 

[rabidfox]

How's your spell power and DCs? Not enough spell power (for any given element) for the spells you casting will make them hit softer. If you're DCs aren't good enough then mobs will save and take reduced damage (or none); in some quests like heroic sharn, mobs saves get really good and they'll make life rough for you. Also know what spells use different save types and what mobs are weak vs them will let you select optimal spells to deal with different mobs.

 

[Skoltr]

Also look into items on gear that will give more sp. Like wizardry items or power. There are also some items to get back sp. As someone whos played spell casters, its a balance of what to use. I like to use sla's if I can. Boss or lots-o-mobs I'll use my regular spells. Not every spell has to be quickened or meta magic'd, like buffs. On sla's I right click them and turn on meta magics there, other combat spells ill turn quicken on then any other meta magics depending. Like said above also look for items to increase spell power and dc's. And there are times where your going to need your sp and stop at a shrine, refresh and continue.

 

[JustHavingFunBro]

If you already know this I apologize. But it actually took my quite awhile to learn this.
You can disable metamagic feats by right clicking the spell. This way you do not have to turn metamagic feats off/on randomly.

I always have MM feats on, and turn them off on anything not an SLA or just turn them on when I want more damage. This way you can rotate SLA and spells.

 

[jotmon]

There are in game options to supplement your mana pool..

https://ddowiki.com/page/Spell_point

I tend to keep stocked up on Eberron shards for...
-3 Small Eberron Dragonshard Fragments can be traded for an Eladrin rest shrine (self only.. stacks to 10 in inventory).
-3 Medium Eberron Dragonshard Fragments trade for a 20 clicky Trinket of Mnemonic Enhancement (can only carry 1 trinket at a time)
-3 Large Eberron Dragonshard Fragments to turn in for Ethereal rest shrines (party usable stacks to 10 in inventory).

Farm for clickies .. Korthos Archivist's Necklace, Mysterious Bauble, rings of spell storing (normal/Epic/Legendary)
.. Mass Deathward clicky

Draught of Sparkling Apple Cider from turning in 1 Commendation: Villagers of Eveningstar restores 120 (approx) Spell Points over 20 seconds

There are some cleric hirelings that have Divine Vitality to restore sp on you. (cant summon with a full group/raids. is ok for solo and short grp)

Use some quest strategy, clear shrines and keep moving forward until mana pool is mostly depleted then go back to use shrine as needed.

Some spell buffs can be cast on other players before shrining... then mass buff after shrining to include yourself.

Utilize scrolls when not in direct combat.. restoration, resurrection, Protection from Energy, mass bears/bulls, heal... save mana for post shrine combat

Keep Mana pots handy for emergency use...

and of course there is the DDO store that is ready to drain your wallet for store purchase mana pots.

 

[C-Dog]

You can right-click on any spell linked on a hotbar and select what MM are the default. ALL SLA's should have ALL MM's on permanently - free, so no reason not to!

Then you can also drag/drop the MM Feats themselves from your Character Sheet/Feats tab to a hotbar, and activate them (or not). I typically have Empower running, and turn on Maximize for key fights, but it all depends how much mana you have to burn.

And find room to slot a +SP item.

Beyond that, a fast-burning caster like a Sorcerer will often hit EVERY shrine they can find, and so the Player will learn where ALL of these are. Noticeably slower, but that's how some like to play.

(The only other solution is to be caster/melee, softening up w/ spells and then taking out the gimps w a few quick slashes. Depending on the build (and the PL's), can work great!)

Farm for clickies .. Korthos Archivist's Necklace, Mysterious Bauble, rings of spell storing (normal/Epic/Legendary)...

And Twisted Talisman.

The Ring of Spell Storing can now be gained via trade-in w Bronze Tokens - easy farm (if a bit grindy, depending).

 

[Zaszgul]

Hard to give pointed advice without knowing your class, but some advice as someone who never uses a single shrine or potion in heroics...

Try increasing your spellpower. Make sure you have a decent "regular" spellpower item for each type you care about, and "insightful" as well (at least via insightful potency, a popular item to get that benefit is Pansophic Circlet from Memoirs quest).

Increase your evocation (probably) DCs. Also your casting stat (regular ability + insightful again). You don't want mobs taking half damage on all your spells, or evaders taking 0.
-Use clouds or other no-save damage spells if you can't get your DCs up (firewall, acid rain, arcane tempest, etc)

Be efficient:
-round up big numbers of enemies and hit them all with the same AoE. Don't use AoE on just 2 or 3 monsters, drag them towards another pack.
-don't use single target spells except SLAs (except against reapers). You can sometimes just run away from e.g., a lone archer without ever killing it, it probably won't chase you so no need to expend resources/time killing it.
-another good use for clouds - very spellpoint efficient. Think in terms of damage per spellpoint.

If you aren't currently playing on reaper difficulty, then the last recommendation is: play on reaper difficulty! The trees will get you more spellpoints, and the occasional lost souls from killing stuff are just free mana potions.
-Also the stats/DCs from the trees will quickly outpace the buffs mobs get to their saves (they get +1.5 per skull, so 1 skull is, for so many reasons, easier than elite after you have built up some reaper points).

At level 20, you can buy and epicify a Ring of Spell Storing. The 3 (recharging) clickies on this will give you about 1000 spellpoints per rest, so it's even easier to avoid running out of spellpoints in epic questing.

 

[Cowsn]

Thanks a lot guys, all those tips are incredibly useful <33
I forgot to specify my class, sorry.

I'm playing as a blightcaster.
Currently I'm lvl 16 with 212 force and 147 acid spellpower, 1170 spell points, and my conjuration DC is 3.
So far I'm just using Thorn strike, Splinterbolt and Thorn bloom (they're SLAs).
I'm having zero issues sniping monsters and killing them fast on reaper, using Spike growth when they group up.

However, I want to use other spells like earthquake, acid blast, acid rain, etc.
Maybe I'm too accustomed to blowing everything up.

I'm going to disable the metamagic feats and enablethem only for certain spells

(btw, I'm also leveling an alchemist, currently lvl 8, stacking acid and negative spellpower, and a similar thing happens if I use other potions besides the SLA ones)

 

[FVSHasBeenEvenMoreGutted]

well one thing i can say is those spellpower are extremely low for the level. even with random gear I would expect 250 minimum. it also sounds like u missing is and/or wizardry augs. wis gives BC more spellpoints, so try boosting wiz. another thing u can do is use cleric hires who have divine vitality such as tempys. they can restore SP

 

[RangerOne]

As I recall my cleric was the worst. Seems like he needed to shrine every five steps. At cap, however, most of my casters can get through a quest without shrining, save for the very long ones. Once into epics using the Dragon destiny (total brain drop right now as to the real name) I can turn on all meta magics permanently and still make it through. The most powerful spells are epic SLA's. Hang in there, you're doing fine.

 

[Zaszgul]

Just for reference, I recently rolled up an iconic mage as a bank mule. It is level 17 and only has 3 rp and obviously 0 PLs.

Acid, Electric, Fire, Negative, Poison Spellpowers are at 313; Force is at 292.
Above Spell crit chances are 32, except negative at 42 and force 29.
Highest Evocation DC (which you can see if you mouse over the tooltip for a spell/SLA on your hotbar) is 43.
Hitpoints 393
Spellpoints 1845


As a blightcaster, you will also want negative spellpower to power the enhancement that adds negative damage to your growth spells.

Grasping Thorns SLA in t5 is quite good, with full metas and proccing both negative and acid damage from enhancements, it was one-shotting most things on initial tic when I first got it and stayed very strong for quite a while. It became my main killing spell after level 12, until getting Tsunami and Acid Well. Can stack it with Spike Growth if needed.

Which form are you using? Thorn Knight for the caster levels on your best spells is what you want. I never really used any acid spells on my blightcaster life, except acid well.

Don't worry about earthquake, the damage is terrible and you shouldn't need the CC between Grasping Thorns SLA and regular spell.

 

[Cowsn]

As I recall my cleric was the worst. Seems like he needed to shrine every five steps. At cap, however, most of my casters can get through a quest without shrining, save for the very long ones. Once into epics using the Dragon destiny (total brain drop right now as to the real name) I can turn on all meta magics permanently and still make it through. The most powerful spells are epic SLA's. Hang in there, you're doing fine.

oh yeah, I didn't even think about epics because my highest character is a lvl 17 cleric lol
I assume my sp cool will get better through epic enhancements and that stuff right?

well one thing i can say is those spellpower are extremely low for the level. even with random gear I would expect 250 minimum. it also sounds like u missing is and/or wizardry augs. wis gives BC more spellpoints, so try boosting wiz. another thing u can do is use cleric hires who have divine vitality such as tempys. they can restore SP

Just for reference, I recently rolled up an iconic mage as a bank mule. It is level 17 and only has 3 rp and obviously 0 PLs.

Acid, Electric, Fire, Negative, Poison Spellpowers are at 313; Force is at 292.
Above Spell crit chances are 32, except negative at 42 and force 29.
Highest Evocation DC (which you can see if you mouse over the tooltip for a spell/SLA on your hotbar) is 43.
Hitpoints 393
Spellpoints 1845


As a blightcaster, you will also want negative spellpower to power the enhancement that adds negative damage to your growth spells.

Grasping Thorns SLA in t5 is quite good, with full metas and proccing both negative and acid damage from enhancements, it was one-shotting most things on initial tic when I first got it and stayed very strong for quite a while. It became my main killing spell after level 12, until getting Tsunami and Acid Well. Can stack it with Spike Growth if needed.

Which form are you using? Thorn Knight for the caster levels on your best spells is what you want. I never really used any acid spells on my blightcaster life, except acid well.

Don't worry about earthquake, the damage is terrible and you shouldn't need the CC between Grasping Thorns SLA and regular spell.

my best spellpower item so far is my main hand, which gives impulse +82 and insightful impulse +42. As for acid, just some garbage green gloves that give +71 acid spellpower :,)
I'm going to check the wiki for other sources of spell power (profane? might?).
Also, how do you check the DC? I'm hovering my spells at the hotbar but I see nothing.
Grasping thorns is really cool, but it has a really long cd, I use it for groups when they've already stopped running around the room lol.
oh and thanks for asking which form I'm using! I just realized I'm still using the low level thorn form instead of the high level one, damn I feel retarded lmao, I thought I swapped it from the hotbar

 

[Zaszgul]

When you hover your mouse over an ability you should see something like this. Check your Options settings if it doesn't appear (tooltips can be disabled, or set to have a long time before they appear).

Pansophic Circlet is good item to farm, gives a solid base for all your spellpowers.

Cannith Challenge gear is where I get most of my spellpower + crit items from: Bracers, Cloak, Boots. Grinding mats can take a while, but at least you don't have to worry about ransack and RNG.

Spellpower sticks from Peril of Planar Eyes pack are good too, sounds like you might have one already!

 

[FVSHasBeenEvenMoreGutted]

oh yeah, I didn't even think about epics because my highest character is a lvl 17 cleric lol
I assume my sp cool will get better through epic enhancements and that stuff right?




my best spellpower item so far is my main hand, which gives impulse +82 and insightful impulse +42. As for acid, just some garbage green gloves that give +71 acid spellpower :,)
I'm going to check the wiki for other sources of spell power (profane? might?).
Also, how do you check the DC? I'm hovering my spells at the hotbar but I see nothing.
Grasping thorns is really cool, but it has a really long cd, I use it for groups when they've already stopped running around the room lol.
oh and thanks for asking which form I'm using! I just realized I'm still using the low level thorn form instead of the high level one, damn I feel retarded lmao, I thought I swapped it from the hotbar

look for artifact spellpower, such as beacon of magic or esoteric initiate. artifact USP usually stacks with artifact to 1 spellpower

 

[Xezon]

Efficient metamagic stacking in the Blightcaster/Druid trees goes a long way too. Between Efficient MM Maximize/Empower and gear sets (such as those from Sharn/Cogs) that give efficient MM can make it so that you can cast spell book spells for near base cost while still getting the MM boosts.

Once you get high enough level in the ED's you can actually get so much efficient MM stacked up that you can forego a piece of gear or a point in one of them since it will go over what you need (and overstocking does not REDUCE the cost of a spell should you go over the MM cost with reductions).

I personally main the Blight-caster (Force and Poison form, Necromancy focus) and this is how I do it and get away with being able to spam Poison (spell) and contagion (cackling fever for helpless stuns at least til you get to Legendaries and it no longer works) non-stop.

 

[Lazuli]

Good advice here. I only add one thing, Cowsn, for your next lives.

Before you TR, take some time to get an upgraded vibrant purple ioun and heroic spell point greensteel. Both items work for ANY spellcasting class you want to play. And they help a lot in the sense of spell points. Ioun is 200 spell points at level 5 (400 in sorc and fvs), and greensteel (which replaces ioun at level 11) is 300 spell points (600 in sorc and fvs)

Both items can be obtained playing solo once you have enough level.

The current devs are very stingy with spell points in equipment, so newbies who don't know this type of old equipment are at a noticeable disadvantage.

 

[Enoach]

One advantage I've had is playing casters long before SLAs and sp potions were the norm. When Meta Magic feats were more expensive.

Lessons:
1. Do I need to cast a spell?
It is easy to get into the mentality that you must hit every enemy with a spell, there are actually quests where you don't even need to engage every group of mobs. Learn when to cast can reduce spell point use avoiding unnecessary casting

2. The right spell
While it is easy to fall into a routine of casting the same spells in a cycle, the question is it the right spell for the job? Reflex Save spell vs a mob with evasion, Fortitude spell vs a more hearty mob, or Will spell vs a highly intelligent/wise mob. Or Fire Spell vs a Fire Elemental.
Sure there are tools that can help bypass but usually the right spell targeting the weakness of the mob is far more spell efficient

3. Are my DCs level appropriate
While this may seem obvious, the more a mob can save vs your DC the less effective. "No Fail" is not always going to be an option, I tend to shoot for 75% without debuff spells and 80%+ with debuffs as a lower point - Still best to target mobs weakness

 

[Archest]

set your self some ranged and or melee attacks so that you supplement for your spell point pool.
inclusive with SLA's
focus your spells in your spell schools for DC
farm for caster level bonus's https://ddowiki.com/page/Caster_level
Budget the spell points you have and get SP bonus were ever you can.

 

[seph1roth5]

Blightcaster definitely shouldn't run out of sp they have a zillion slas. Are you getting beat up if you don't kill super fast? I tended to only use slas or un-meta'd spells on my last BC life. Word of balance is damn strong on it's own lol. You can also quick key multiple versions of spells. So I had a cheap word of balance, and a fully beefed up one also prepared to one-shot bosses.

If you're not getting stomped on, it's fine to just wait a few sec in between spells, you don't have to constantly be casting unless it means death. Some good crowd control helps a lot too. Grasping thorns is nice, but if you have access to feydark, color spray is very powerful as well. Making enemies helpless means you do more damage and they don't hit you. Can let the sla dots do their thing, throw in some acid spray, etc., for cheap.

 

[C-Dog]

Blightcaster definitely shouldn't run out of sp they have a zillion slas. Are you getting beat up if you don't kill super fast?...

We're all assuming you have Maximize, Empower, Quicken, Heighten, for your SLA's... true?