Today I played Necro 2 for the first time

[eightspoons]

I'm with the OP on this one, particularly the swimmy one (ratty one goes without saying obviously) and I'll extend it to Necro 4 as well. I completely and utterly detest Inferno especially. That first impression has stuck with me, even after all these years, and there's no fixing it at this point. I've never once set foot in either Ascension Chamber or Mark of Death, and I'm not even bothered.

The hatred is more or less even with Devils of Shavarath, but the difference here is that I periodically force myself through those for the Yugo pots (my TR cache currently has about 50 stacks, so as to stave of needing to go there again any time soon).

Yep, I apparently have an intense dislike of anything creative. Oh, and Coalescence Chamber can chuck itself down a shaft of awkwardly placed rocky outcroppings, too.

 

[erethizon1]

hires? Oh, they said no hires. Guessing they used pets.

Can pets hold a gear? Or I guess you unlock the lever on each side yourself and then have a pet/hire pull the unlocked one you are not next to?

 

[rabidfox]

As an aside - I'm still not sure what they going for with the "delving" bonus. Heck, I'm sure most people who play DDO don't even know what delving means. So it's a curious word choice. The fact that the XP mechanics are still(evidently) unclear to many(even after the adjustments), is problematic. And emblematic of how a lot of the updates go...

Back 2019 (I had to look it up it as it was so long ago), they removed bravery streaks from the game and rolled those bonuses into the existing bravery bonus.

Bravery Streak for both Hard and Elite is now Hard Dungeons Completed and Elite Dungeons Completed. Bravery streaks will no longer end; they won’t have a chance for ending, you won’t need to turn off your streak, and you can freely play at any difficulty without the count resetting. The bravery streak bonus will be moved into the standard bravery bonus at its full value. We will still track how many times you finish hard and elite dungeons in the UI, but you are no longer required to playing 5 dungeons in a row at a specific difficulty to build a streak. https://ddowiki.com/page/Update_42_Patch_4_Release_Notes

But years later there were still a bunch of players that still believed bravery streaks were a thing; people would mention it in groups, on the forums, on reddit; they had no clue it had been removed. I assume SSG changing bravery bonus to the name delving (as silly a name as it is) was simply to remove any traces of the word "bravery" in hopes that people would finally move on from thinking old XP things that were long gone were still around.

And now there's a whole new group of people complete confused by the delving bonuses and thinking it changed things a bunch (as opposed it just being a rename of what was bravery bonuses - and them moving 50% XP from r1 1st time to delving 1st time for the same difference in XP when doing quests in range). It doesn't really seem to matter what SSG does, some folks will always get confused by the XP system and how complex it is.

 

[Lazuli]

Back 2019 (I had to look it up it as it was so long ago), they removed bravery streaks from the game and rolled those bonuses into the existing bravery bonus.

But years later there were still a bunch of players that still believed bravery streaks were a thing; people would mention it in groups, on the forums, on reddit; they had no clue it had been removed. I assume SSG changing bravery bonus to the name delving (as silly a name as it is) was simply to remove any traces of the word "bravery" in hopes that people would finally move on from thinking old XP things that were long gone were still around.

And now there's a whole new group of people complete confused by the delving bonuses and thinking it changed things a bunch (as opposed it just being a rename of what was bravery bonuses - and them moving 50% XP from r1 1st time to delving 1st time for the same difference in XP when doing quests in range). It doesn't really seem to matter what SSG does, some folks will always get confused by the XP system and how complex it is.

Well, this is not entirely true. Delving is not identical to the BB of yesteryear because it does not have the same values (although it works the same). If I remember correctly, they made the delving bonus larger and the bonus received for first completion of a given amount smaller.

The name change was not just cosmetic, and it was certainly not intended to distance people from the old concept and avoid misunderstandings, but because they wanted to make a complete revamp of the XP system, which fortunately in the end they did not do.

If you play a quest only once, you won't notice a difference. But if you repeat the quest several times, which is sometimes done in ERs or in select quests like shadow crypt, you receive less xp now than before.

Anyway, it wasn't a big change. In reality, they could have saved themselves the effort and instead invested the time in something useful, like adding filters to the crafting bank, something that is much more necessary.

 

[rabidfox]

Well, this is not entirely true. Delving is not identical to the BB of yesteryear because it does not have the same values (although it works the same). If I remember correctly, they made the delving bonus larger and the bonus received for first completion of a given amount smaller.

The name change was not just cosmetic, and it was certainly not intended to distance people from the old concept and avoid misunderstandings, but because they wanted to make a complete revamp of the XP system, which fortunately in the end they did not do.

If you play a quest only once, you won't notice a difference. But if you repeat the quest several times, which is sometimes done in ERs or in select quests like shadow crypt, you receive less xp now than before.

1st time bonuses for n/h/e didn't change at all (on lam it was different but they never rolled out that change to live). Delving bonus went from 100% (for elite/r+) to up to 150% for r+. R+ 1st time went from 95% down to 45%; but that 50% reduction is what was rolled into that 150% delving bonus. As long as within the base +2 range for the full 150% delving bonus on r1+, then it is the same overall XP when repeating quests or doing r/e/h/n.

 

[rabidfox]

Figured I'd add some visuals to help folks too.
The old XP 1st times:

The current XP 1st times:

Delving (bravery) went from 100% to 150% on reaper; they moved 50% of reaper's 1st time to delving resulting in the same 195% total XP bonus. The only time people get less XP than before is if they do reaper outside the base + 2 range, any other difficulty outside the bravery range is still the same XP as before; if done within the bravery range of base +2 then reaper XP is the same as before.

With the capping of conquest to 100 mobs, many quests award more XP as it's easier to get that 25% bonus. So on average, people should have seen an overall increase in XP when leveling.

 

[Dom]

Figured I'd add some visuals to help folks too.
The old XP 1st times:

The current XP 1st times:

Delving (bravery) went from 100% to 150% on reaper; they moved 50% of reaper's 1st time to delving resulting in the same 195% total XP bonus. The only time people get less XP than before is if they do reaper outside the base + 2 range, any other difficulty outside the bravery range is still the same XP as before; if done within the bravery range of base +2 then reaper XP is the same as before.

With the capping of conquest to 100 mobs, many quests award more XP as it's easier to get that 25% bonus. So on average, people should have seen an overall increase in XP when leveling.

If there’s still any confusion after this, plus the screenshot I posted of No Refunds as an example, there’s not much more we can do to make it more clear lol

 

[The Narc]

Can pets hold a gear? Or I guess you unlock the lever on each side yourself and then have a pet/hire pull the unlocked one you are not next to?

This is correct, you unlock the lever and leave your pet there to pull the lever once you are at the other lever. Unfortunately the timer on the gates opening is lengthy like 3-5 minutes so you have to sit there and wait for this at the gated section

 

[nix]

To paraphrase our favourite body neutral warforged,

DM: "kill something other than undead for a change"

 

[Randomdude1223]

Sorry, I see an xp hit. That being said, I will not continue the debate with you on this issue. Forum needs to have much more class to It. So will just concede to your view point out of respect.

You out of all people talking about "Forum needs more class to it" is just so ironic.

 

[YeeboF]

I've mentioned this multiple times on the old forums. EverQuest has this concept of "hot zones" where the Zone Experience Modifier is significantly increased in order to promote using it over other options. ZEMs stimulate the use of out of the way or underused zones. Something like that within DDO, rotating on a periodic basis like you suggest, would be most welcomed. I get tired of running the same content every single heroic life: Borderlands > Harbor > Marketplace > Gatekeepers > 3BC > Feywild > Dread > House K > Delera's > Shadow Crypt > Ravenloft > Sands > Lordsmarch > Gianthold > Necro 4 or House J > Sharn > Cogs. Those quests tend to be the fastest time to XP ratio, especially when you factor in sagas.

That is a great idea.

 

[dur]

This is correct, you unlock the lever and leave your pet there to pull the lever once you are at the other lever. Unfortunately the timer on the gates opening is lengthy like 3-5 minutes so you have to sit there and wait for this at the gated section

Tried that and failed. with an exasperated groupie n with hire. I couldn't get it to work.

I don't really get what the benefit of having delving range is supposed to be. There may be a few people who can't do r1 or even elite at level. But they are mostly new first to second lifers, who need less xp anyway, so I doubt it does anything tangible for xp pot sales.

That's the question

Most people don't run Necro 2 beyond making a Shadow Crypt opener.

Really? "Most" people?

3 1/2 minutes of swimming is not fun

No but it's different n get u used to UW.

Necro 1 and 4 are great. Tomb of the Blighted in Necro 3 is ok. The rest can burn in hell, including Shadow Crypt (and I've run that countless times). Any quest that requires a player to use a third-party site to figure out what the hell is going on is a huge failure IMO.

Ran 3 before wiki. What's your excuse?

Necro 1 great? Eh Feywild is better xp, loot and saga, 3BC much better xp.

Necro is original content.

 

[JustHavingFunBro]

Necro2 is one of my favorites, and if you don't own IoD its a great way to get from 9 to level 12 in a couple hours if not less. Of course, they take time to learn just like any quest that isn't a straight run.

 

[Bunker]

Necropolis series, 1 - 4 are great. There are challenges that promote running in a group. Yes, there are a few mechanics that leave a little to be desired, but isn't that what makes it great. The necro series has dungeons that are not like any others in the game. That alone is what makes it so good.

If you are running these quests for the first time, they will prove to be challenging. Especailly if you are attempting them solo. Yes, of course there is a learning curve when it comes to a different mechanic, or learning a new path that you have never discovered. At least these quests aren't the same old linear pathing that many quests in the game represent.

IDK, i guess it is hard to look back and remember being lost underwater, or having to fight mobs over and over as they respawn. But if you didn't get a different experience from quest to quest, wouldn't this thread be just more about how boring the content is?

 

[The Narc]

Tried that and failed. with an exasperated groupie n with hire. I couldn't get it to work.

Then you simply arent doing it right, when you are at the first lever use it but dont complete the action by interupting it by moving during the activation bar ticking down, this will leave the lever unlocked and ready to pull. Leave your hire at that lever on stay and passive, make your way around to the second lever again prep the lever by unlocking it only. Now target the lever where you hire is, have your hire activate and immediately pull the lever on your side too. Bingo both levers pulled and fight your way back, once you have cleared your side and are back in the main hall call your hire and wait for the gates to open(this is the long and excessively unneeded time wait but so be it in order to solo.

 

[Genkiba]

The only Necro quest I do is shadow crypt. I'm glad there are now other quests to run than these.

 

[YeeboF]

Pretty much the only time I do these is if I'm on a rep run. I'll also sometimes do them on the hardcore server because Nec 1 is slow but extremely safe XP.

I like that they have a very distinct flavor and feel. It's neat little area. However, a lot of them have mechanics that are a little annoying, like having to look for tiny switches on skulls that are easy to miss. They are also long and monotonous, with a lot of space that has to be cleared out and little variety within any given quest. Very often halves or quadrants of the quests are nearly identical mirrors of each other, and each section is as large as many entire quests.

 

[Fizban]

I like both Necro 1 & Necro 2 a lot. Now, Necro 3 is another story for its entireity. I do like some of the quests but not all.