So you want more players?

Justfungus

Justfungus

Well-known member
There is one growing untapped pool of possible new players for the game.
It would require some R&D but not as bad as installing a new engine.
The GROWING VR player base (Quest 2, Quest 3)
The graphics in DDO are simple enough for either headset to digest.
Hand tracking has significantly improved.
SS would need to create a Specific mod for those players.
and The UI in that mod would need to be geared toward VR players.
Do it right, double your player base ... as a minimum.
-----
There will be a very vocal group that will decry this idea solely because they don't want anything
that might distract from the creation of new end-game content for them.
Fair enough.
Do keep in mind that the player population is shrinking and there is a point where SS will be forced to pull the plug.
-----
If you want this game around long-term, they need more players.
Ads and word of mouth will not cut it anymore.
PC mmorpgs are on the decline.
Smart phone and VR gaming are on the rise and DDO does not translate well to the tiny smart phone screen.
---------
Thats all I got, said my peace.
 
Upvote 0
Kathwynn

Kathwynn

Well-known member
Justfungus said:
There is one growing untapped pool of possible new players for the game.
It would require some R&D but not as bad as installing a new engine.
The GROWING VR player base (Quest 2, Quest 3)
The graphics in DDO are simple enough for either headset to digest.
Hand tracking has significantly improved.
SS would need to create a Specific mod for those players.
and The UI in that mod would need to be geared toward VR players.
Do it right, double your player base ... as a minimum.
-----
There will be a very vocal group that will decry this idea solely because they don't want anything
that might distract from the creation of new end-game content for them.
Fair enough.
Do keep in mind that the player population is shrinking and there is a point where SS will be forced to pull the plug.
-----
If you want this game around long-term, they need more players.
Ads and word of mouth will not cut it anymore.
PC mmorpgs are on the decline.
Smart phone and VR gaming are on the rise and DDO does not translate well to the tiny smart phone screen.
---------
Thats all I got, said my peace.
Click to expand...
Actually, DDO is all likelihood will not go to a phone App. The major reason for that was why Turbine was going to shut down DDO and LOTRO. WoTC told Turbine No when that company proposed going to a mobile game App. That is how SSG got started. The Devs and Employees got together, and with some financial backing, bought DDO and LOTRO. Turbine was just as happy to take the money and go.

But you are right the game needs to be updated and needs a better marketing and Ad campaign. The new players that I have talked to more or less stumbled across the website and had no idea that the game even existed prior to that moment.

As to whether the game is going to be shutdown any time soon. I have my doubts. I have seen posts predicting doom and gloom since I started to play better than 10 years ago. It is still here. And from where I sit it is going to be here a good while longer.
 
Justfungus

Justfungus

Well-known member
The main problem with DDO is population ... it has very little.
(Compared to a lot of mmorpgs)
There are private wow servers with 10x the population of DDO.
LOTRO is small and has double the population.
Population = money
 
Eme

Eme

Well-known member
I used to be pro new engine, but not anymore. In a couple of years we'll have AI passes over 3d content done on your cards, rather than 3D engine rendering as the final output you can see, the 3D as we know it will be a thing of hte past, and users will be able to prompt realistic, painted or whatever for whatever look they want their game to look like. They could probably have a D&D trained module to make games look like the fully painted covers on modules, that only use the current rendering engine we already have as the starter pass.
 
rabidfox

rabidfox

The People's Champion
Justfungus said:
The PC mmorpg customer pool is tapped out. There are no mmorpg players
that don't know about DDO, trust me, they know. They are either here
or have no interest.
Click to expand...
Really? We get new people over on DDO discord fairly regularly who just discovered the existance of DDO. Other than a few major MMOs, I couldn't tell you what other ones exist out there myself. As for VR stuff, raids/long questing with a headset on is just painful to one's neck after a while.
 
L

Lacci

Well-known member
Have you ever played a VR game ?
DDO would be terrible in VR. 3rd person doesn´t translate well into VR. All the jumping sequences in every quest will be motion sickness turned to 11. The lag will have a similar effect.

Apart from that, coding this to work in VR would also be no small feat. They haven´t even bothered to make the UI workable on 4k screens and now we want a VR-friendly UI ?

Which other VR MMORPGS are there ? Which ones of those do well ?
 
jotmon

jotmon

Well-known member
Fix Lag...


Players play enjoyable games.. DDO hits the benchmarks.

When you mention 'Lag' to another potential player it is enough to shut down interest .

Periodically I will try new games to see if they are fun, first red flag is Lag.
When I see lag.. delete.. move on.

If I didn't already play DDO before lag was bad I would never have given it a chance.
Years of increasing and unresolved Lag issues is enough to shake off player interest in continuing the game.

Once players leave it is that much more difficult to entice them or anyone they play with in future to come back.
 
rabidfox

rabidfox

The People's Champion
Oddly, I've run DDO in VR before; several years ago in fact. I used a mix of TriDef and an image wrapper via ReShade at the time. The UI was an issue, but other than that it generally worked. Given the complexity and gameplay style of DDO, it wasn't practical to play on IMO but it had some fun wow factor for looking around; and was decent for short periods of game play. (I did it in LOTRO too and that was awesome for getting absorbed into the visuals, but it too didn't work well for the actual gameplay aspects IMO other than in short bursts of play)
 
Owlbear

Owlbear

Well-known member
VR gaming isn't booming at all... 9/10 VR gaming projects flop. Most VR headsets are collecting dust in the closets. Really not worth putting precious SSG assets on right now.

Lacci said:
Have you ever played a VR game ?
DDO would be terrible in VR. 3rd person doesn´t translate well into VR. All the jumping sequences in every quest will be motion sickness turned to 11. The lag will have a similar effect.
Click to expand...
You can play DDO in first person. Just zoom in the camera.
 
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vryxnr

vryxnr

Well-known member
People have actually run DDO in VR, though it does take some setting up to do, and is usually more of a novelty than a regular gaming experience.

My problem with jumping on bandwagons for what's "big right now" is historically 99% will burn bright but burn fast then die a horrible death very quickly. Yes, DDO must continue to innovate and try new things to continue, but a part of why it's been able to last as long as it has (imo of course) is that it fills a niche, and that niche has players who are dedicated to enjoying that niche.

Drastically changing DDO to "mass market appeal" by copying the current trends of mobile, or the "hot new thing that is still so new it actually kinda sucks atm", will alienate much (not all, but a lot of) of the current players, while potentially not drawing in that many new players to replace them due to it's history of being a niche game within a niche world within a niche IP, and those who do come will be just as likely to move on to something else pretty quickly given the nature of how the industry and the masses have been of late. It's a huge gamble for maybe big money in the very short term that rarely lasts long at all.

Don't get me wrong, I want DDO to be better and last many many more years to come, but I don't see mobile and VR as the solutions.
 
Onyxia2016

Onyxia2016

Well-known member
Appreciate the picking on new ideas but I feel VR would not do that much for DDO.

One of the things that sets DDO a part from other games is the amount of detail and customization that can be done. This is not a game you can just load and play decent based on experience with other game (except LoTR) it take a serious time and learning commitment.

Of the VR games I have read about and the very few I have played, they are an entirely different breed and cater to a very different gamer. They seem to fall into the "twitch" as in reflex, style of play. Think first person shooter vs DDO.

Again, I have little experience with VR games but I do agree with @rabidfox, wearing a VR headset of hours on end would give me a headache.
 
Justfungus

Justfungus

Well-known member
Agreed, let's keep this about the merits (or non-merits) of adding a mod for DDO to play in VR.

As for VR is 3rd person, I would not do that. VR does 3rd person badly.
I would assume if DDO added VR, it would be 1st person for those folks.
 
D

DDO Gaming

Well-known member
Justfungus said:
There is one growing untapped pool of possible new players for the game.
It would require some R&D but not as bad as installing a new engine.
The GROWING VR player base (Quest 2, Quest 3)
The graphics in DDO are simple enough for either headset to digest.
Click to expand...
If you can create an "Intro to DDO" that's comprehensive enough to get started BUT no more than a single paragraph of maybe 5 lines THEN you have a great startingpoint for introducing new players to the game.

Thusfar I am contemplating bringing in new players BUT ONLY after I have invested time creating an account and filling it with playable characters probably lvl10+ (which is when gamers can start playing reasonable gaming characters)
 
D

DDO Gaming

Well-known member
DDO Gaming said:
If you can create an "Intro to DDO" that's comprehensive enough to get started BUT no more than a single paragraph of maybe 5 lines THEN you have a great startingpoint for introducing new players to the game.

Thusfar I am contemplating bringing in new players BUT ONLY after I have invested time creating an account and filling it with playable characters probably lvl10+ (which is when gamers can start playing reasonable gaming characters)
Click to expand...
And this is the big problem with DDO...new level 1 characters are totally unplayable
 
vryxnr

vryxnr

Well-known member
DDO Gaming said:
And this is the big problem with DDO...new level 1 characters are totally unplayable
Click to expand...
"totally unplayable" seems a wee bit hyperbolic to me.

Slow? yes.
Awkward? yes.
Unfun? subjective.
Totally unplayable? to what standard? as a vet used to their level 32 completionist? maybe, but hardcore proved otherwise, else no one could get past level 1.
 
vryxnr

vryxnr

Well-known member
Ying said:
SSG does very little marketing to bring in new players.
Click to expand...
Agreed. I miss the old marketing, and I wish there was more current marketing. The "marketing" done at the moment is mostly targeted towards current and returning players, those already paying attention via social media or on their list via email updates on new expansions. That's playing to the current players and players who already played and left, not "new" players.
 
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