Dvinesword
Well-known member
It seems since update 59.2 that intimidation and threat gen is broke. It seems almost impossible to hold agro. We have noticed this with 2 different tanks at different levels including our raid tank.
Threat Generation
- Thread starter Dvinesword
- Start date
Thor
Looking for a New Love
The mobs are learning..... kill da healer....
Buckshank
Member
Running my first tank now, so this thread has me curious about all things tanky.
- What content are you running?
- At what difficulty?
- What's the character's buffed Intim?
- What other sources of hate are you using besides Intim?
Skoltr
Well-known member
Hi!
I think another place to ask for this sort of feedback in the Fighter (or other melee?) class forum or better yet the New Player Advice area.
Good luck tanking!
DilemmaEnder
Thelanis Player
I must agree. I've noticed no difference in my regular raid runs which I tank, nor on the Hardcore server.
As always, the only problem I run into is the teleporting unicorns in D & D. One of the 3 almost always breaks free at some point. Have to save my Throw The Boom for the inevitable runner.
On another note, I have never had so many people be so happy to have a tank running in their group as I have this Hardcore season. Just running into the thickest grouping of mobs and hitting Intimidate has never garnered me so much praise. Truth be told, it has been unusually smooth this season. Between the players I'm with and the less pressure we all feel about this season and getting the rewards (can run on normal and still be ok), it has been loads more casual than before.
My suggestion to anyone wanting to "Tank" is be prepared to sacrifice. You are choosing to take the hits. That is your job. So anything that doesn't help you take the hit, had better let you take more hits. You are literally sacrificing damage in your build so that you can take hits (and more hits), so that in turn your teammates can forgo defenses in their build thus allowing them to deal more damage.
This mindset has allowed our HC group to run like clock-work. I run in and gather the mobs, the other melee wades in with his two-hander and smashes the ones surrounding me, the ranged dps snipes any Champs/Casters/Stragglers. Any extras we fill the group with quickly learn to add whatever they can around my location. Had a caster that ran with us say all they did was throw spells at me since that's always where the mobs were. Thats how you know the "Tanking" is working.
The key to "Tanking" is the same as most other roles. Play to your role and communicate with your team. If you call out your plan before you do it others can adapt their own plans. Sometimes that is as simple as "I going to Intim the Champ's group". A tank needs his team just as much as they need him. Its no fun playing a tank if your team isn't on board, and it's likely to be harder on everyone.
calouscaine
Grouchy Vet
I've never been able to get threat gen to actually work correctly or really at all in this game, even with 70+ intim, and 500% + hate gen. Everything almost always ignores me. . .so, to say it got broken is a bit off, it always has been broken and has never been fixed to work worth a . . . yeah.
bummer.
for your intim I think it depends a lot on what content you are playing, 70 is great for a lot of levels & monsters, but not all. Seems like I needed 115 intim to be able to intim well at end game. although, my current fighter has 63 intim and I can generally turn the heads of dooms and pull mobs off of casters/healers/etc, but it's a dps centered build, so once I get their agro I have not problem holding it.
as for 500% hate gen, wow, that's a lot...interesting lesson I learned on one of my earlier tanks is that you must be able to deal more damage than the rogue/caster who may or may not be using threat reduction. most high dps folks have learned the hard way you must dump agro, however some dps folks don't gear/build for it at all. so you may trying adjusting your build to do more damage and/or ask the dps folks to give you time to build agro.
mostly I think tanks do do well if archers/casters don't bomb them before the tank can earn their agro...so, it's a team sport.
i think the DMs see that playing an intim tank with little dps isn't as fun as a dps/tank and have tried to push the builds to add more dps.
What mobs have you experienced this with? Certain types of mobs have unusual quirks when it comes to threat.
Zvdegor
Melee Artificer Freak
My friend plays warlock and/or fvs and I am the party tank in our static group. He uses aura always get the aggro before me. Through walls for example. Even if I am the 1st who deals them damage. Mobs just ignores me. I use my Intimidate (92) and no effect.
If aura works this good, why Intimidate isn't an aura effect too? I hate hitting the keyboard every 5-6sec. The higher Intimidate value U have, stronger the aura will be.
I'd love that.
If aura works this good, why Intimidate isn't an aura effect too? I hate hitting the keyboard every 5-6sec. The higher Intimidate value U have, stronger the aura will be.
I'd love that.
Cashery
Well-known member
my tank has 132 intim and 1800%+ threat gen
calouscaine
Grouchy Vet
all fighter? or barb? That's pretty impressive though.
Dvinesword
Well-known member
This has been with all mobs and not just those that have quirky mechanics like mummies.
This first became really noticable on hardcore. At level 5 our tank has an intimidate of 25 this means he generates hate of 5000. There is no way any of the other lvl 5 toons are generating over 5000 hate from damage. But we can immediately pull agro from the tank.
Then on Saturday raid night we ran into this constantly our raid tank was unable to keep agro this was in situations where would normally have no problem. Also if he lost agro he could not get it back by intimidate. Needless to say this maid raids fun.
Tonight is Wednesday raid night with the hippie crusaders and we will see how it goes.
Good thought, though the Warlock Aura of Menace is meant to be like intimidate, it's designed to pull agro, so it's doing a similar job as your intim, just in a different way. although that aura is a toggle, so if the warlock doesn't want agro, they can disable it. so since the aura hit first, then you need to overtake the agro felt by the aura before the mob will redirect attention to you.
part of agro mgmt is being the first one to hit or first to be in line of sight, so the Aura acts like hitting them through the wall. in many ways you are competing for agro with your warlock.
it's a team game, so if warlock wants to be Menacing, then let them have that agro and protect the others...if warlock complains ask them to turn toggle off and give you time to earn agro before they engage the mob...a decent guideline is to let the tank have a few seconds head start into every battle....if dps/casters don't wait for tank, then it's on them to manage the agro.
oh, in addition to getting the warlock to disable their aura, you may also consider asking the warlock to look at reducing threat gen (Soul Eater tier1 Subtle Spellcasting will help you both out).
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Cashery
Well-known member
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DilemmaEnder
Thelanis Player
Wow! Nice! Is that standing or fully buffed? Mind me asking for your build & equip list? I'd love to work towards mimicing something like that!All paladin
My Pug Raid Tank is only 3rd life but handles everything we do. Newer raids on Hard and older ones on R1-4.
But he's only running 4k hp and 330+ AC / 383 PRR unbuffed. He has few reaper points also. He just sits at cap and does PUG raids on saturdays so he can pass runes to my main. But I'd love to figure out how to progress him to those heights.
I assume it's a matter of stacking Reaper trees for HP buffs and some choice gear.